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[TolyK]

TolyK:

I... don't understand what blows your mind. I voted, there were more votes behind me. I did not remember what exactly was happening 4.5 hours before. Is that what does it?

Would you say you don't really follow the thread?

I haven't read everything yet. I just said that.

What blew my mind was your use of language and timing.  People had mostly stopped talking about millers for over a day at the time you voted, so when you voted, no, people weren't talking about millers.  That combined with your use of past tense, 'as far as I remember', 'when I voted', and 'random vote', to me that sounded like an attempt to make your 4.5 hour old vote sound like something from over a day before, back when people were talking about millers and when random votes were the only votes there were.

I didn't take your vote for a random vote at all; you even gave it a reason that didn't sound random in the slightest, for all it was a one-liner.

Given that you're not reading 'the whole thread', I guess you just grabbed bits of stuff that caught your eye while you skimmed, and you randomly grabbed flabbort's talk about his role as something to vote and ask about?  And you honestly meant what you said, 'people still talking about millers', because to you they were, you hadn't bothered to track the thread for over a day, really, so you just assumed that was still a topic?

It was a random vote with pressure attached, a weak accusation to start a question barrage.
And yes, you caught me, I really wasn't reading the thread back then. And unfortunately answering questions takes up a lot of time for me.

[TolyK]

Lynching 4mask might be a good idea. Mostly because he does WIFOM a lot.

Spoiler: Proof (click to show/hide)

 

So aside from being incredibly rude towards other players and semi-active lurking [he has made several posts recently that contain little to nothing of value inside of them.], His voting of Flabort for no real reason, he also doesn’t care about remaining alive to help town. Perhaps it is foolish to expect someone on their way out to commit. But if you don’t care about being alive, why should we 4mask?

*shrugs*
You shouldn't care about me being alive.  Nobody but me knows my alignment, I could be anti-town for all you know.  If you really want to lynch me, feel free.

You shouldn't care about me being alive.  Nobody but me knows my alignment, I could be anti-town for all you know.  If you really want to lynch me, feel free.

4maskwolf: What are you even doing?

Me?  I'm telling the truth.  You all don't know what my alignment is, be it town or scum or whatever: true.  As such, there is no particular incentive to keep me alive over anyone else.  This goes for everyone: currently, there is no particular reason to keep any given person alive because only they (and their scum buddies, should they have them) know who they are.

Ow-tato! Stop that. Stop poking your Jester's stick into my trillions of eyes!

Lolz you actually think I'm a jester?

Probably one or two I missed so far.

While Flabort seems to be taking a lot of risks for no reason, most notably telling parts of his role (even before the post I quoted, as it turns out) and then panicking and multi-voting several failed times. He is playing to save his own hide, which is very likely either a personality thing (though I haven't see that before from him) or a part of his alignment. He could very well be a survivor, watcher, or serial killer. Not likely scum, though, because it would be OP for a lylo breaking power like that.

Currently finished reading page 20 (for own reference).

Now, Flabort, did you use a night power, and who did you target? Don't say what you did exactly, just those two. If you prefer, you may refuse to answer, but given your playfulness I would guess you would want to comply. It could confirm or break a suspicion I have...

[Nerjin]

Ugh... No roleplay this morning. Head hurts...

Nerjin: Now this is quite the reaction.  In response to a small jab about your cases, you snap at NQT and spend several lines accusing him of hypocrisy.  And best of all...

I'd like to ask what contributions YOU'VE made to finding scum though since you apparently believe yourself to have done such an excellent job.

...you drag in an element you should know to be untrue.  I say you should know because the very next thing in your post is you seemingly selectively quoting much of the post that proves the above assertion false.  I say "seemingly selectively quoting" because you omitted only the part that proves your accusation false.
So.  Would you be so kind as to tell me what it is about the attention of NQT that so scares you?  Would you mind explaining the assertion that NQT believes himself to have done an excellent job this game?

It was a personal reason. I'm afraid that I can't actually tell you why I snapped at NQT. His attention doesn't scare me. In fact, I don't really care one way or the other what he thinks about me. Silthuri's been having Real life problems and I've wanted to avoid mentioning it because it isn't really my place in this game. However he started getting on her and I kinda snapped.

Also, don't say "Seemingly Selective Quoting" when what you mean is "Selective Quoting". If you want to accuse me of something just accuse me of it and be done with this. There is never enough time in mafia to be beating around the bush like that.

@TolyK

Not likely scum, though, because it would be OP for a lylo breaking power like that.

I don't know about that. If your only reason for him being not-scum is because a Lylo breaking power... That's pretty weak. You're assuming that there isn't a counter to it. You're assuming that Scum simply CANNOT have powers that can break votes [They easily can]. You're also assuming that Wuba is infallible. He is human just like the rest of us. He could easily put a power in a game without fully grasping how powerful it is in practice.

[TolyK]

That's true, but I'm saying that it's more likely for him to be third party, given I already have grounds for suspicion.

And yes, I've been persecuting third parties in this game for several reasons.
- Wuba's BYOR's tend to have quite a few third parties
- Several points of behavior from various players do not fit with scum play, but neither do they fit town play
- We have a confirmed SK-ally, ffs.
- * CLASSIFIED *

Also, I will almost certainly be PFP this weekend, possibly longer.

[notquitethere]

Imp

NQT:

Please explain why you voted for Toaster D1  D2 with the given reasons, then appear to so completely change direction in regards to him.

Well, he made a case in the interim, and his lack of engagement was what I'd voted him over and there were stronger candidates after that. In the early game, I see a large part of my mafia role in not only finding scum, but cajoling town players to play better (I'm not implying I play perfectly all the time myself, when I'm short on time my play suffers accordingly). He began a case on Scripten which showed at least a modicum of effort, effort that a few of the other players (like Varee) hadn't even managed. I didn't directly respond to his question (not deliberately, I was just looking at other things in my read through), but I answered it with my actions anyway.

As for the analysis, I checked up on a few things (like whether Flabort had suspected Shakerag and Cheetah before he put them both at L-1) but there was nothing super-weighty on my first pass.

I can guarantee that some of your conclusions will be false, but at least they're not coming out of nowhere.

Do you mean false as in his reasoning was genuine, but conclusions inaccurate, or false as in you think he's making up his conclusions and lying about what he claims to think?

I only meant that he couldn't reliably draw such strong conclusions from such weak premises and so he's bound to be wrong about at least some of the claims.

Persus

Yeah, I asked you some questions, one of them being a comment on you being really lenient this game. Can you answer or point to the post where you answered that?

Some reasons that we use to sink our teeth into players aren't actual scumtells and it's important to recognise this to minimise false positives. On what point do you think I'm being too lenient?

MBP

Still getting up to speed. The fact this day started while i was doing a graveyard shift back to back ain't helping it. Right now i see people getting all up on Flabort wich is understandable yet reeks of bussing ( When scum  all vote a guy to look neat, my terms are rusty. Correct me if wrong). Flabort already revealed his role, so personally i'd wait maybe a day. He'll probably be pelted by cops and disables.

When you're all rested, I'd be interested to see who you'd think would make a better alternative right now.

Jack

NQT: No.  Let's make a couple.  What do you think of Cheeetar's reasons not to lynch him?  Are your reads of Persus and Scripten null?

Cheetah thinks he's nailed obvscum, what I think about that depends on what Cheetah's alignment is.

I'm not willing, at this time, to vote Flabort.  He's my top suspect, but I wish to avoid drawing us close to a hammer this early in the day.  With regards to other players, I had not had the chance to do a good examination of those who had caught my attention when I first posted today (bad headache, bad internet...), and decided to leave my vote for when I could place it effectively.

That's reasonable enough I suppose. No need for another quickhammer.

Toly

And yes, I've been persecuting third parties in this game for several reasons.

3rd party hunting is a typical 3rd party trait. Are you a 3rd party?

[TolyK]

No, I'm not. I'm hunting whoever I find easiest to hunt for me personally. Getting more bang for the buck, so to say.

[Varee]

So Here is what happen last night. I tried build a house for toaster liek what flabort suggested. But form the other info, there a few thing that could have happen.
1 Toaster is lying and he got a new power but he is lying( Well i dont think he is lying but it is possible)
    This lead to two other possiblity

[TolyK]

That makes perfect sense...

Wait, it does, actually.

[Varee]

umm premature posting...





So Here is what happen last night. I tried build a house for toaster liek what flabort suggested. But form the other info, there a few thing that could have happen.
1 Toaster didnt get the power.
    This can happen in two
     1.1 Flabort did not target me or toaster as if he target one of us either he would also get the power or toaster would get the power
     1.2 Flabort lied about his power( well this is the most likely thing that happen)
2Toaster got the power but he dont want to tell us (I dont think this happen)
3 I totally misunderstand my power..... ( I dont think it is this one too, It might not be a house but i am positive i built something.)


So for a few question that came up....
@Tolyk

we are in wuba house

yeah thqat kinda make sense and we all went to toilet so I think It might have been a toilet rather than a house. Not about dump or shit or other meaning toilet may refer too....


@Irony

If you were in shake situa blah blah blah

Well If i was in that situation I think I would have done what cheetar did. I dont see it as selfish or anything but It survivor right? I dont think both guy have the reason to believe that the other is town or will likely help their wincon if they kill them self instead of hammering the other party. (I hope you guys understand this)


@Imp

Targeting someone

Well I was hoping on someone actually telling me what the freaking house do but it seem liek whoever got it is keeping quiet.... I Was going to make it sound Like i random the target so I can maybe figure out a lie or something.....

Voting flabort blah blah blah

I Believe that lynching flabort is a waste of lynch.... He seem to just get back up. I have a feeling he is like an annoying role that wouldnt really die....


@flabort

neijin

His roleplaying is amusing but for his content and stuff... I have a feeling he have a day power or some thing about president order. I still doubt that he is really a president though.


Andddd For those who concern about me stalking or what ever term you use around here. Let say Am gathering information and I am sorry for lack of involvement.

[flabort]

Jack A T I'm afraid I have to go look up a dictionary right now.
Posturing (Verb): To position, especially strategically. To develop a policy or stance for (Oneself, a company, government, etc)
Bravado (Noun): a pretentious, swaggering display of courage.
Why getting people into groups? To expand their horizons, to expand their field of vision.
Why those specific groups? Because those are focuses that I specifically made sure weren't focused on earlier.
Why this sudden push? I've actually been working on this the whole game, it's not sudden; perhaps you meant why do that all at once? To maximize the reads and information I get today.

Now, Flabort, did you use a night power, and who did you target? Don't say what you did exactly, just those two. If you prefer, you may refuse to answer, but given your playfulness I would guess you would want to comply. It could confirm or break a suspicion I have...

Yes, Toaster.
Given what I have claimed as my only night power, though, I don't think Varee is telling the whole truth.

Varee What do you mean "but from the other info, ..."? What other info?
What two other possibilities?PPE: You posted again.
I for sure targeted Toaster. I did not get targeted by your power as far as I can tell. I think it might be that it failed on Toaster, or you totally misunderstood your power, OR you lied about it.

No, I'm not. I'm hunting whoever I find easiest to hunt for me personally. Getting more bang for the buck, so to say.

Careful. That's close to being lazy about hunting; being lazy about hunting is a scum tell. So be careful when you say things like that.

Yes yes yes, I understand you say you've done it. You haven't got much to back it up there, though.

That's kind of difficult to prove without ruining the results. However, go back and take a look at some people you haven't been thinking about or dismissed as non-issues/town. Think about when you would have focused on them, and look to see if I have a post near that point; odds are, it's the post that starts people voting for me.

[Varee]

Well if both me and flabort is to be trusted then only thing that could have happen is someone randomised me.
As flabot is immune too all power and if someone were to target toaster it should hit flabort too. Unless the pirtiy is kinda weird and weird thing happen if i and flabort both target toaster, at least flabort should get the power.


Still i find it hard to lynch flabort. Am pretty sure we cant kill him without atleast one othe player dying.


So if we need to kill him twice in a day. Assuming he got lynch and he use his power you would have to kill his target too to kill him unless someone can stop him from using power.... Which is unlkely as it would be a waste without a block

[flabort]

Assuming he got lynch and he use his power you would have to kill his target too to kill him unless someone can stop him from using power.... Which is unlkely as it would be a waste without a block

I like how you're talking about getting the mafia to help the town to kill me, or vice versa. Unless there's a vig, but that's an assumption that we can't make yet.
Basically, I like how you're asking opposed factions to work together to kill me. Unless what you mean by

Still i find it hard to lynch flabort.

is that you don't want to kill me.

[TolyK]

Now, Flabort. There's this thing... Can you link your role claim? I haven't read up to it, but I feel this is currently more important than reading through.

Varee, how does your power decide who to give the house to? If you don't know, ask Wuba (privately).


Also, Flabort, maximizing personal utility is a bad idea? :p

[flabort]

No, it's just that you were getting close to crossing that line where you're being effective and being lazy.

And here is where I claimed.

[TolyK]

I have Latvian Dream (I barely understand where this power is coming from after a google search). Using it makes me immune to all incoming powers, but I need to select a target. Any powers targeting this target (was going to be Toaster) also target me. Also, the target's own powers are unblockable, unredirectable, unrandomizable, giving the target a power buff for that night.

So, you targeted Toaster this night, which made him true-hit his target and made you invulnerable to actions other than those copied from Toaster.

Meanwhile Varee targeted Toaster with building-a-house, which gives a power (right?) to whoever he used it on. And it should've given both Toaster and you a power, which it didn't. Thus, he didn't actually hit you, which could be either lying, randomization, blocking, redirection.

Did anyone else target any of those three? Actually, those two who are not Flabort. Or if you know someone else targeted, but then don't say who.

Mystery almost solved.