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Author Topic: [MOD] Race and Ethnicities Mod  (Read 8905 times)

Azerty

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[MOD] Race and Ethnicities Mod
« on: August 04, 2014, 11:45:31 am »

Hello,

Presentation of the mod:

several months ago, I proposed the inclusion of race and culture as an attribute of the personanages in Liberal Crime Squad.

Then, after assisting, at my electronics engineering school, to courses of C language, I wanted to test my new-acquiered knowledge in programming and projected to make a LCS mod when I will have the time to both going in this website and coding.

Finally, in July, I found the time to code this mod.

Description :

This mod introduce five different races and ten cultures, now only used for name generation:

  • The White race, composed of the Anglo-Saxon, Jewish, East, West and South European cultures
  • The Black race, composed of the Anglo-Saxon culture
  • The Asian race, composed of the Chinese and the Japanese cultures
  • The Latino race, composed of the Latino culture
  • The "Eastern" race, composed of the Indian and Middle-Eastern cultures

If it does sound limited, this is only a Beta and demonstration version.

Downloading : Here

Special thanks to : this thread, and especially to ed boy for learning me how to share my eventual mods.

PS: This is my hundredenth post on this forum!
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Azerty

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Re: [MOD] Race and Ethnicities Mod
« Reply #1 on: August 04, 2014, 11:47:25 am »

[Reserved for eventual future use]
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Liberal Elitist

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Re: [MOD] Race and Ethnicities Mod
« Reply #2 on: August 04, 2014, 08:29:15 pm »

Good job on programming your own mod, I list the mod authors and their mods in the main project's AUTHORS file and now you're in it too. Not sure if this will be in the main game or not. Race is a sensitive issue after all, it has to be dealt with in a non-offensive way, like the way the game deals with gender identities.

I might point out you left out Native Americans, who are actually the native ethnic group here in the United States of America. Also there are mixed race people, and people who identify with more than one culture. I know plenty of people like that, like Steve... you don't know him, but he's from multiple ethnic backgrounds and multiple cultures, part Jewish, part Hispanic, part white, part black, part Native American... his dad's a white Jew and his mom's a mixed-race Puerto Rican, who like most Hispanics was from a Catholic background but she converted to Judaism to get married. Steve might LOOK like a white guy but he isn't one, he's mixed-race, and grew up in a mix of Jewish and Puerto Rican cultures. So, your mod's a little incomplete if it doesn't account for people like Steve. People from different races and cultures do marry and have children together, ya know... just look at our current President for instance... and I personally am someone with parents from different countries, with both sides of the family having different cultures. My dad's a white Anglo-Saxon American with English/Irish/Scottish mixed ancestry and my mom's a white Hungarian from Hungary with some Jewish and German ancestry along with the Hungarian and maybe a little Slovak and Ukrainian too. So judging by the description, your mod isn't quite as inclusive as a Multicultural Liberal Elitist like myself would like. When I go to family reunions on my dad's side of the family it's all-American and the people are all typical white Americans from the heartland, mostly folks who vote Republican and live in rural areas. At those family reunions you're bound to hear people spouting Conservatism. When I go to family reunions on my mom's side of the family there's Hungarians and people from other countries and it's very sophisticated and European, mostly folks who vote Democrat and live in urban areas. At those family reunions you're bound to hear people saying unintelligible gibberish in foreign languages that obviously means something to them but doesn't make any sense to me. Now I might not be multi-racial, I suppose all those ethnic groups I'm descended from can be classified as "white", but I certainly am multicultural, since my mom's an immigrant from Hungary and my dad was born in the U.S.A. just like me.

I just hope that your mod takes into account that people of mixed ancestry or mixed cultural heritage actually exist. I worked for 4 years doing data entry for New York State's Worker's Comp system and let me tell you, there are a LOT of people whose first names would seem to indicate one race but whose last names would seem to indicate a totally different race. For instance, someone with a Chinese first name and Puerto Rican last name, or any other combination you can think of, you see that kinda stuff all the time if you do data entry that involves the entering names of random people living in New York. I might live in the upstate part of the state of New York, but even here there's a good amount of multiculturalism... I know a Laotian guy and a white girl descended from Germans who got married and had a bunch of mixed-race kids. The husband is Buddhist and the wife is a lapsed Catholic who now practices witchcraft. Not kidding... she's serious about the witchcraft stuff, really believes in it... she's way too superstitious if ya ask me. The husband believes in magic, ghosts, demons, and whatnot too but not as strongly. Oh, and she also believes she is the spawn of Satan. When she was a baby in the hospital, each baby got a number before the parents named them, and her number at the hospital was 666. She always tells everybody that. And if I believed Satan existed, then given her personality I'd believe he was her dad. Oy vey. I actually used a Ouija board with them a couple times and they were really into it, and one time, we were supposedly talking to Satan, and someone asked Satan if he was her dad, and the response was "yes". Of course I don't believe in any of that superstitious nonsense. But if I did, than that would make her half-white and half-demon, while her husband is pure-blooded Laotian. So then their kids are half Laotian, one quarter white, and one quarter demon. And given the way those kids act, that's actually kinda believable... those kids are the most misbehaved little tykes I've ever encountered, always swearing and demanding money. I think the first words they learned were ALL swear words. And their mom has them trained so if they see any dollar bills or coins or anything they demand it, and cry if they don't get it, and then she tells you you have to give them the money, and the little kids are demanding the money and acting all upset. It's ridiculous, the people I have to deal with. The kids do LOOK cute though. Anyway, I don't hang around those people anymore, they're nothing but trouble. The last time I saw them was when my dog was a really young puppy and they had a puppy too but bigger and meaner, and my dog had a very traumatic experience, almost got killed by the other dog, and they wanted me to come back again with my puppy so the dogs could "play" again... yeah right, that was the last straw, no way am I bringing my cute little innocent puppy over there to get viciously murdered by a nasty, vicious, evil attack dog who's 10 times as big... that's not my idea of how dogs should "play" or how responsible pet owners should take care of their animals. And that dog was ginormous even when it was a young puppy, I can't imagine how massive in size it is now, it's probably 300 pounds of pure vicious nasty evil. I had a pure evil vicious attack dog myself, previously, but he was only 13 pounds, very small, but that didn't stop him from attacking and biting every other dog in the neighborhood, even ones much bigger than him, and once he bit another dog the same size as him really hard on the neck as hard as he could, trying to kill it, and I had to pry his jaws off the other dog's neck with my bare hands and then apologize to the other dog's owner (the other dog was thankfully unharmed, at least physically, although it had been screaming out in pain and fear at the top of its lungs). I like my current good-hearted benevolent dog much better than that vicious dog I used to have, or that vicious dog that woman who thinks Satan is her dad has.

But I'm sure not all mixed-race people are as messed up as the kids in that family, and plenty of them are fine, upstanding citizens, like our current President for instance. The guy I know who is a mix between Puerto Rican and Jewish that I mentioned, he's almost as messed up as those other people... he's in and out of jail all the time... he collects his own urine in bottles for some strange reason... he keeps getting into car accidents that ALMOST kill him, and keeps getting his driver's license suspended, but keeps on driving a car regardless, and he's like the worst driver ever... he is always talking about how he is going to revive the Occupy Wall St. movement and achieve a Trotskyist populist overthrow of the U.S. government that he will be part of the top secret collective leadership team of, a leadership team that that ordinary members of the group won't know about because the group will have a cell-based structure and local cells won't know any more information than they need to know, in order to make it possible for the group to survive even if members are captured and interrogated when the group is on its way to overthrowing the government which will end with a decisive march on Washington, DC in which his group will physically take over control of all government buildings such as the White House and Capitol Building and then announce a new government based on the principles of Trotskyism and the Populist Movement of the late 1800s... in short, he is nuts, and he wants to do the same thing as Liberal Crime Squad but in real life and he's serious about it. But his brother in Connecticut, with the same parents, also mixed-race, is a fine upstanding citizen. Needless to say, the 2 brothers aren't on speaking terms, so messages between them have to be relayed by their 93-year-old father, a World War II veteran, who is somehow still alive. Like for instance, every time this guy gets in a car crash and totals his car and almost dies, his 93-year-old dad has to arrange for his brother to pay for a replacement cheap used car since he's not on speaking terms with his brother who pays for everything. I've actually told him about this game Liberal Crime Squad and suggested that he try it, since it's basically a simulation of exactly what he's planning on doing in real life, but he's not interested in petty things like video games, he says. I think he is on the borderline for schizophrenia... he has basically all the symptoms, except for hallucinations, he doesn't get those, but other than that, he'd be a textbook example of a paranoid schizophrenic. The ironic part is, his loony behavior, as someone who may or may not be a paranoid schizophrenic (not sure if he meets all the diagnostic criteria, as I'm not a psychologist or psychiatrist), his behavior alienates other people and makes them suspicious of him and often hostile towards him, and this makes it so everyone REALLY IS out to get him, which makes his paranoia actually justified and NOT a sign of insanity. When he was younger, the crime he went to prison for was being the leader of a gang... this gang didn't sell drugs or attack people, they just robbed houses, but only rich people's houses. The police found some of the people working for him in his gang and they ratted him out immediately, and he was the only one charged with any felonies who had to go to prison, the rest of 'em all got off on misdemeanors. This guy's like a real-life Liberal Crime Squad founder... definitely has VERY low wisdom. After one of his recent car crashes where he broke his neck, bled a lot, had a broken ribcage and a collapsed lung, and almost died, he was in a nursing home for awhile, with doctors and nurses caring for him, trying to help him recover. But in his paranoia he thought they were trying to kill him, so he arranged for me to come "rescue" him and drive him to a new dirt-cheap ghetto apartment he was renting. He spouted all sorts of nonsense about how the doctor was trying to kill him, and about how he was plotting his revenge and was going to go back there and beat the doctor to a bloody pulp, in the car ride outta there. He never follows through on any of the nonsense he spouts though. Once he gets to his apartment he can't carry any of his stuff, too heavy, since he only has one lung fully functional and his ribcage isn't entirely healed, and he has neck and back problems, so I have to carry it all up for him, and he keeps mentioning how he needs some oxygen containers like he had at the nursing home, and that was the one thing he was saying that actually made sense. I wondered where I could get him some but he told me not to bother and that he'd get them himself. The next time I saw him he had plenty of oxygen containers and was using them to help him breathe, and was going to physical therapy, and within 6 months his health was back to normal. I swear, his life is exactly like this game... he even stayed at my house earlier this year in February and March when he had to carry out a sentence to do community service that required him to show up at the county jail at 7 am every Saturday and Sunday for 2 months, and it just so happens my house is just down the street from the county jail in easy walking distance. He got to choose between that and spending a month in the county jail. Having him stay in the house with me was a nightmare, I eventually kicked him out and arranged for him to stay in the apartment of some "friend" of his who does drugs, but that "friend" couldn't stand him anymore after a couple days and kicked him out too, so after that he had to drive all the way from his apartment in the next county over to the county jail in this county. I really wish he had just gone to jail instead of community service... what he actually ended up doing in community service was he and the other criminals were all put to work shoveling snow, this was right when the "polar vortex" was happening and the temperatures were at record lows. I dunno how he managed to survive all that snow shoveling out in such cold weather, at his age and with his health problems. Then again both his parents are still alive, his dad at 93 and his mom at 90, it seems people in his family are built pretty tough... like cockroaches... almost impossible to kill... not even nukes can get rid of them. That's kinda like this game too, where the founder of the LCS is quite hard to kill, compared to ordinary people in the game. I swear, this dude is like, ridiculous. He also stole the vacuum cleaner from my house and then lost it... well he didn't exactly steal it, he asked if he could borrow it, I said yes, I gave it to him to borrow, and every time I ask for him to return it he says he can't find it. It's a small vacuum cleaner, handheld, so yeah, it's something someone could lose, especially someone as messy as him... every place he lives turns into such a pigsty, with all the urine bottles and bags full of garbage that he doesn't take out for some reason, and messes left everywhere that he doesn't clean up. He belongs in a psychiatric hospital but thanks to Ronald Reagan they no longer incarcerate lunatics like him for years on end in insane asylums, oops I meant psychiatric hospitals, like they ought to be doing. And now that I'm adding the Stalinist Crime Squad into the game, it kinda makes sense that this guy is a Trotskyist... Stalinists and Trotskyists can't stand each other, they're like arch-enemies, it'd make perfect sense for a Trotskyist to lead the LCS as it combats the twin scourges of Conservatism and Stalinism. But the Populist movement of the late 1800s, which he wants to personally revive and be the leader of, and have it overthrow the government... I don't see how the Populist movement fits into this... ah I just looked it up... yes they were quite the radical movement in the day, wanted to do lots of reforms, but they became quite unpopular and it ended up being that any idea they supported, the majority of the population opposed... they came up with the idea of direct election of U.S. Senators, for instance, but that idea didn't get implemented until years after the Populist movement was gone, because any idea they supported got tainted by its association with them... they were sort of like a left-wing version of the Tea Party, they were grassroots and from rural areas and a bunch of left-wing radicals. Another of their ideas, the government nationalizing the railroad industry, eventually happened too, now it's called Amtrak. Most of their ideas ended up being implemented in the long run, except their cornerstone idea regarding monetary policy, which was to switch from the gold standard to the silver standard. That never happened, we never had a silver standard as the basis for U.S. currency.... the gold standard eventually was replaced with fiat currency instead. But they hadn't thought of the idea of fiat currency back then, and if they knew about it, they would've thought it was even better than the silver standard, mostly they just wanted to get off the gold standard, so I guess that's also one of their goals that eventually was achieved. Nowadays the Tea Party is saying we should go back to the gold standard... it's like a mirror image of the Populist movement... regardless, that dude I know is totally nuts. He's like an LCS founder you have if you are really really bad at the game. And right now I'd say his Juice is at -50 and all his stats are 1, to put his failure at overthrowing the government, health problems, legal problems, mental health problems, and lack of any followers into the terms of Liberal Crime Squad. He completely lacks any persuasive abilities, but apparently he must've had them in the past... he was part of Students for a Democratic Society back in the day, and he knew a lot of the people that went into the Weather Underground and other groups like that... he was a real radical back then, back when it was popular, but now most of those SDS-type radicals have moved on and are more moderate and mainstream. He told me he knew Bernardine Dohrn and that he was not impressed at all with her, that she was a total phony, an upper-middle-class yuppie not really committed to the cause, and he knew none of her plans would work and he told her that back then. I would think that the most likely outcome of this interaction was Bernardine Dohrn would feel insulted but also be more determined than ever to engage in radical left-wing action just to prove this guy wrong, so in a way, this guy I know might've been indirectly responsible for the violence carried out by the Weather Underground. He was never actually a member of the Weather Underground though, he disapproved of them, but he was part of the leadership of the SDS.

OK so that family's a total mess too... but at least my own family is perfectly fine! Anyway, that might have been SLIGHTLY off-topic... but I WAS talking about mixed-race people and their lives and their families, which is SORTA relevant, because my original point was to point out that mixed-race people exist and you aren't accounting for them in your mod. So getting back on topic, you should add mixed race people to your mod.
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Azerty

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Re: [MOD] Race and Ethnicities Mod
« Reply #3 on: August 05, 2014, 08:01:23 am »

Good job on programming your own mod, I list the mod authors and their mods in the main project's AUTHORS file and now you're in it too. Not sure if this will be in the main game or not. Race is a sensitive issue after all, it has to be dealt with in a non-offensive way, like the way the game deals with gender identities.

The bolded part is why I'm hesiting to bluntly indicate any racial slurs in future scenes of pursuits and trials, and will instead put froms such as "Prosecutor evoked the accused's racial predisposition to crime" or "The pursuers were shouting abuses related to the ethnicity of the Liberals" to replace "Let's fry this nigger" or "Hands up, you wetback!"

I might point out you left out Native Americans, who are actually the native ethnic group here in the United States of America. Also there are mixed race people, and people who identify with more than one culture. [..]

OK so that family's a total mess too... but at least my own family is perfectly fine! Anyway, that might have been SLIGHTLY off-topic... but I WAS talking about mixed-race people and their lives and their families, which is SORTA relevant, because my original point was to point out that mixed-race people exist and you aren't accounting for them in your mod. So getting back on topic, you should add mixed race people to your mod.

  • I didn't know then how Native cultures should be implemented (tribes such as Navajo ot Apache or areas such as South-West or Plains) and, this, I reported this implementation to a later release
  • Mixed race people are sort-of already available during the generation of the founder, given race and culture rolling are separated; in future releases, the ethnicity algorithm could give a proportion, depending of Civil Rights (0% at C+ vs. 10% at L+) of people for whom culture would be outside of the ones expected from their race
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Neonivek

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Re: [MOD] Race and Ethnicities Mod
« Reply #4 on: August 06, 2014, 05:33:18 pm »

Quote
Not sure if this will be in the main game or not. Race is a sensitive issue after all, it has to be dealt with in a non-offensive way, like the way the game deals with gender identities

That and it has been absent from the game for so long that it has long since felt intentional. That race is either illusion or that Liberals can't see race.
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Jonathan S. Fox

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Re: [MOD] Race and Ethnicities Mod
« Reply #5 on: August 06, 2014, 11:31:40 pm »

Quote
Not sure if this will be in the main game or not. Race is a sensitive issue after all, it has to be dealt with in a non-offensive way, like the way the game deals with gender identities

That and it has been absent from the game for so long that it has long since felt intentional. That race is either illusion or that Liberals can't see race.

This was originally true of gender as well, and for a time I didn't want to implement it for exactly that reason. I've since come to feel that both race and gender can be done in LCS, they would just need to be handled Liberally.

I think the way LCS could do race in the main game is with a large splash of ethnicity and culture thrown into the possible labels. It would be neat if on generation a character was given an internal group used for mechanics (white, black, asian, latino...), but also generated a list of possible labels. You could have an option to fix a character's label by toggling through these options, unique to each person. A character might be internally modeled as White, but have the option of toggling through Irish, Irish Protestant, White, Bostonian, and American for their label. Another white character might have Italian, White, Floridian, and American. A dog might have Dog, Canine-American, and Rottweiler.

I talked about this in the previous thread, but I think any implementation of race in the main game would have its mechanical ramifications limited to flavor text, biases in character generation (like racial chances based on profession, more or less severe depending on the laws), and allowing your people to be subjected to racism and prejudice. I wouldn't base skills or stats on it directly, or make a character better or worse at certain activities. At L+ laws, all character generation biases would disappear and the game would be completely colorblind with the exception of some benign flavor text.
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FinetalPies

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Re: [MOD] Race and Ethnicities Mod
« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2014, 02:33:16 am »

Canine-American. Yes. I want this

Also Liberal Elitist didn't you say once that your dad was a mad scientist complete with wandering into the forest to eat weird plants and document their effects? Also gosh, you sure know some interesting people. Though I have to agree with Reagan that stripping people of their freedom is immoral and should be reserved for only the time where you can absolutely prove that they are a danger to society. Also, I believe in witchcraft, but Satan is a Christian figure and that directly opposes what witchcraft is aboot so that confuses me.
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a1s

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Re: [MOD] Race and Ethnicities Mod
« Reply #7 on: August 07, 2014, 09:46:48 am »

  • The Black race, composed of the Anglo-Saxon culture
Spoiler: "right" (click to show/hide)
I'm also not sure if jews shoudn't be Eastern (aside from being the poster child(ren?) for the Semitic people, they're also a target of long standing prejudice in a way that Saxon,Germanic, or Slavic people are not)
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Azerty

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Re: [MOD] Race and Ethnicities Mod
« Reply #8 on: August 10, 2014, 07:34:59 am »

Hello!

Having resumed my work on this mod, I would like to know how to update the source code with TortoiseSVN of my mod to put here the updates from after April 7th so as to get the bugfixes and other additions.
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Casei

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Re: [MOD] Race and Ethnicities Mod
« Reply #9 on: August 10, 2014, 02:43:30 pm »

If Race is included, it should be handled (as Mr. Fox noted) Liberally - that is, Diversity is Celebrated. If you do not have Diversity (a cross-section of many cultures), and your racial choices during recruitment are too homogenous, there should be a penalty -  to your Juice score, perhaps.
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SlatersQuest

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Re: [MOD] Race and Ethnicities Mod
« Reply #10 on: August 12, 2014, 03:39:24 pm »

Azerty, can you post the source code in a format other than .rar? Thanks!

*

The Terra Vitae mod does account for Amerindians.

Amerindians in the TV mod are job classes, which ideally would be exchanged for a separate race variable later down the line. However, since job mainly is important because of its effect on skills, it works for the moment.

Amerindian skills depend on the Amerindian Rights laws. At C+, they are a discriminated minority and have criminal-type skills (e.g. Street Smarts, Stealth, Security, Seduction), but as the laws improve they become factory workers, and then finally scientists and businessmen when the laws are L+, implying that they have fully equal rights.

I would suggest that the same be done with other races, using Civil Rights of course instead of Amerindian Rights (and possibly Immigration for Latin Americans). The more liberal the laws, the less discriminated against they are, and so the more likely they are to be found in high-paying respected jobs such as lawyers, scientists, businessmen, and so on, while at extreme conservative laws they'll be gang members, prostitutes, crackheads, and so forth. Their stats will vary according to race, but only because stats are driven by jobs, and jobs are connected to race in less-than-elite-liberal society.
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Azerty

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Re: [MOD] Race and Ethnicities Mod
« Reply #11 on: August 13, 2014, 12:32:03 pm »

Azerty, can you post the source code in a format other than .rar? Thanks!

How and in which format? (I'm running on Windows 7)

The Terra Vitae mod does account for Amerindians.

Amerindians in the TV mod are job classes, which ideally would be exchanged for a separate race variable later down the line. However, since job mainly is important because of its effect on skills, it works for the moment.

Amerindian skills depend on the Amerindian Rights laws. At C+, they are a discriminated minority and have criminal-type skills (e.g. Street Smarts, Stealth, Security, Seduction), but as the laws improve they become factory workers, and then finally scientists and businessmen when the laws are L+, implying that they have fully equal rights.

I would suggest that the same be done with other races, using Civil Rights of course instead of Amerindian Rights (and possibly Immigration for Latin Americans). The more liberal the laws, the less discriminated against they are, and so the more likely they are to be found in high-paying respected jobs such as lawyers, scientists, businessmen, and so on, while at extreme conservative laws they'll be gang members, prostitutes, crackheads, and so forth. Their stats will vary according to race, but only because stats are driven by jobs, and jobs are connected to race in less-than-elite-liberal society.

I will look at your source to see how you managed to make the makeup of the profession depend from politics; I will probably introduce variables such as WASP_ASCENDENCY or MIGRANT_BACKGROUNG for the generation of the races and, later, the culture.
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SlatersQuest

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Re: [MOD] Race and Ethnicities Mod
« Reply #12 on: August 13, 2014, 05:20:51 pm »

How and in which format? (I'm running on Windows 7)

I am having trouble opening the package at all as a .rar file.

What I want to do is see how you did it so that I can plan incorporating it into the TV mod, which I'd like to keep updated.


I will look at your source to see how you managed to make the makeup of the profession depend from politics; I will probably introduce variables such as WASP_ASCENDENCY or MIGRANT_BACKGROUNG for the generation of the races and, later, the culture.

The only thing that it does is adjust the probabilities of where you find Amerindians (which are in newencounter.cpp), and the skills that they get in makecreature(). I also have an additional function which changes the names of Amerindians depending on the laws.
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Azerty

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Re: [MOD] Race and Ethnicities Mod
« Reply #13 on: August 14, 2014, 12:48:24 pm »

How and in which format? (I'm running on Windows 7)

I am having trouble opening the package at all as a .rar file.

What I want to do is see how you did it so that I can plan incorporating it into the TV mod, which I'd like to keep updated.

In which compression format can I send you the sources?

I will look at your source to see how you managed to make the makeup of the profession depend from politics; I will probably introduce variables such as WASP_ASCENDENCY or MIGRANT_BACKGROUNG for the generation of the races and, later, the culture.

The only thing that it does is adjust the probabilities of where you find Amerindians (which are in newencounter.cpp), and the skills that they get in makecreature(). I also have an additional function which changes the names of Amerindians depending on the laws.

Thanks for the tip!
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Crinkles

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Re: [MOD] Race and Ethnicities Mod
« Reply #14 on: August 14, 2014, 12:54:31 pm »

Being that "reverse discrimination" is a modeled issue, I'd say that it's moderate laws that should be colorblind. True liberal laws would make race and ethnicity more important to society, where traditionally oppressed groups fill the ranks of the courts, media, etc. to a greater extent than their relative population would suggest. If possible, perhaps some such people should get a heart bonus, but a penalty to the skills and attributes of their profession (modelling affirmative action)?
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