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Author Topic: Melee Combat  (Read 29250 times)

Cryxis, Prince of Doom

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Melee Combat
« on: September 06, 2014, 07:19:59 pm »

Me and my friends like to do a sort of LARPing without the dressing up and acting. We like to, I would almost say, train in real melee combat
I was wonder if any of you do this and if anyone knows a few links to some free combat technique videos

Currently I am trying to learn how to use Escrima sticks (philipeno combat baton type things that are duel wielded) I'm using this to learn dual wielding because that is one of my worst skills

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Elfeater

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Re: Melee Combat
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2014, 08:39:56 pm »

Dual wielding is in nearly all ways less effective than single weapon. Or a single weapon and a shield.
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Re: Melee Combat
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2014, 08:56:37 pm »

They aren't combat technique videos, but Lindybeige on youtube knows quite a bit about melee weapons.
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LordBucket

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Re: Melee Combat
« Reply #3 on: September 06, 2014, 09:05:53 pm »

We like to, I would almost say, train in real melee combat

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Dual wielding is in nearly all ways less effective than single weapon. Or a single weapon and a shield.

I would call that a gross simplification. Though yes, it generally more difficult for an untrained fighter to pick up a pair of weapons and do very well with them, if that's what you mean. Also, be careful with shields. They create a massive blindspot that can hinder you as much as help.

penguinofhonor

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Re: Melee Combat
« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2014, 09:20:50 pm »

They aren't combat technique videos, but Lindybeige on youtube knows quite a bit about melee weapons.

Yeah, if your first interest in melee combat is dual wielding then you should probably check this guy out.
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EnigmaticHat

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Re: Melee Combat
« Reply #5 on: September 06, 2014, 10:01:25 pm »

I would call that a gross simplification. Though yes, it generally more difficult for an untrained fighter to pick up a pair of weapons and do very well with them, if that's what you mean. Also, be careful with shields. They create a massive blindspot that can hinder you as much as help.

No it physically doesn't work.  You can only effectively swing one weapon at a time because physics, so carrying two identical weapons is a waste of time.  Especially since the effort of carrying a second weapon could be better spent on armor, rations or ammo.  Even those few times historically when people carried two blades it was sword + parrying dagger, which is basically a less effective shield anyway.

The only times dual wielding has been effective in real life, outside of a few martial arts-ish things meant for civilian use, is when the two weapons are different.  And the VAST majority of that is weapon+shield, a tried and true combination that has worked for most of human history.
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SalmonGod

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Re: Melee Combat
« Reply #6 on: September 06, 2014, 10:18:06 pm »

In casual boffa weapon play-fighting with friends, I've generally done better with sword + dagger than with sword + shield.  I feel like the dagger is easier to manuever, and the crossguard gives me more control.  I was the only one in our group who took to it naturally, though.  Maybe because I'm kinda sorta should be ambidextrous.

But that's with (good quality Ed Hellen) foam weapons in untrained hands, so doesn't mean much.
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Funk

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Re: Melee Combat
« Reply #7 on: September 06, 2014, 11:13:28 pm »

They aren't combat technique videos, but Lindybeige on youtube knows quite a bit about melee weapons.

Yeah, if your first interest in melee combat is dual wielding then you should probably check this guy out.
+1 to that.

Some other good youtubers are
scholagladiatoria
Skallagrim,
ThegnThrand and finally
Lindybeige.
Mosty there focused on HEMA stuff, but most of the points translate in to LARP any way.
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Neonivek

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Re: Melee Combat
« Reply #8 on: September 06, 2014, 11:19:24 pm »

Dual wielding effectiveness probably takes the biggest nosedive if you factor in armor.
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Jimmy

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Re: Melee Combat
« Reply #9 on: September 06, 2014, 11:20:20 pm »

Yes, Skallagrim discussed the idea of dual wielding in depth with historical references in the video below:

http://youtu.be/hGbWli1-Q0g

tl;dr: Shield is the ideal off-hand item in melee warfare. Off-hand weapons such as parrying daggers were used when carrying a shield was impractical. Dual wielding was only used for performance and entertainment, never as a legitimate fighting style outside of fantasy literature.
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Neonivek

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Re: Melee Combat
« Reply #10 on: September 06, 2014, 11:22:28 pm »

Well for the Japanese and a few other Asian cultures dual wielding was used because shields were... well... out of the question.

In the place I cannot remember they dual wielded wooden sticks because of a weapon ban.

In Japan's case saying "Dual wielded" is somewhat of an exaggeration because you GENERALLY didn't attack with your shield sword... it was considerably shorter then the one you used for hitting people with.
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mainiac

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Re: Melee Combat
« Reply #11 on: September 06, 2014, 11:25:37 pm »

Well for the Japanese and a few other Asian cultures dual wielding was used because shields were... well... out of the question.

IIRC, the Japanese mostly carried two swords because they had crappy iron and not enough coal and needed a backup if the first one broke.
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Jimmy

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Re: Melee Combat
« Reply #12 on: September 06, 2014, 11:27:32 pm »

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_wield

The use of weapon combinations in each hand has been mentioned for close combat in western Europe during the Byzantine, Medieval, and Renaissance era. The use of a parrying dagger such as a main gauche along with a rapier is common in historical European martial arts. Traditional schools of Japanese martial arts include dual wield techniques, particularly a style of classical Japanese swordsmanship conceived by the Miyamoto Musashi involving the katana and wakizashi, two-sword kenjutsu techniques he called Niten Ichi-ryū. Eskrima, the traditional martial arts of the Philippines teaches Doble Baston techniques involving the basic use of a pair of rattan sticks and also Espada y daga or Sword/Stick and Dagger. Okinawan martial arts have a method that uses a pair of sai. Haidong Gumdo, which is a form of Korean martial arts, mentions the use of two weapons simultaneously. Chinese martial arts involve the use of a pair of Butterfly swords and Hook swords. Gatka, a weapon-based martial art from the Punjab region, is known to use two sticks at a time. The Thailand weapon-based martial art Krabi Krabong involves the use of a separate Krabi in each hand.
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Itnetlolor

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Re: Melee Combat
« Reply #13 on: September 06, 2014, 11:33:19 pm »

Ever try dual-wielding shields for aggressive combat purpose, instead of defensive? What about a sword and a dagger? Parry with either one, throw the dagger into someone's head, grab it out of them, and keep re-using it. I dunno; would look cooler in movies and anime, rather than actually being effective in real life.

mainiac

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Re: Melee Combat
« Reply #14 on: September 06, 2014, 11:35:09 pm »

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_wieldTraditional schools of Japanese martial arts include dual wield techniques, particularly a style of classical Japanese swordsmanship conceived by the Miyamoto Musashi involving the katana and wakizashi, two-sword kenjutsu techniques he called Niten Ichi-ryū.[/i]

That's one mention to a guy training in that style as well as the conventional longsword and shortsword.  Did anyone ever use it in combat?
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