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Author Topic: ☼Elves☼: The start of a project.  (Read 5735 times)

Chevaleresse

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☼Elves☼: The start of a project.
« on: September 09, 2014, 09:39:09 pm »

So, yeah. I created an mod for elf mode in vanilla, with the goal of doing nothing that would affect dwarf mode. (This goal was largely successful, with the only effect being that elves can show up with whiffle bats warhammers.) I planned on creating another version that fleshed out the elves further and dropping the restriction of not affecting dwarf mode (so elves might show up with stronger, modded equipment), but I dropped that idea in favor of creating Elf Mode in MDF.


There's just one problem: I've never played MDF. I've never even looked at a MDF raw. Anyone willing to help me create this?
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Re: ☼Elves☼: The start of a project.
« Reply #1 on: September 09, 2014, 09:47:36 pm »

First of all, download the mod, open the manual, and look at the features of the other races. If your idea for elf mode has a similar scope of features and some unique game mechanics, I am all ears.
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Chevaleresse

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Re: ☼Elves☼: The start of a project.
« Reply #2 on: September 09, 2014, 10:02:22 pm »

I think the mechanics would change quite a bit. MDF uses DFhack scripts, right? I know there are a few of those that would definitely help with making elves more elfy. For now, though, the main features are these:

-Instead of woodcutting, you generate logs at a heartwood shrine. Hearts take 10 logs to make at a shrine.
-The only digging you can do is using picks traded for from the dwarves or humans.
-You have access to most non-evil plants via the seed shrine, allowing a farming industry to be set up basically anywhere.
-Wooden weapons and equipment can be created at the relevant shaper's shrine, including mechanisms for traps. You'll have to trade for the better ones, however, as elves only have access to spiked balls, giant corkscrews, and giant axe blades.
-Rather than metalworking, you can infuse wood with any in-game metal (other than procedurally-generated ones) given the right ingredients, including alloys.
(-Not really a feature, but elves are generally better at hand-to-hand combat and get things accomplished faster due to higher agility.)
-A limited but highly effective selection of weapons

Main problem is that I know I want to add more features, but don't know precisely what.
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Re: ☼Elves☼: The start of a project.
« Reply #3 on: September 09, 2014, 10:10:42 pm »

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slay_mithos

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Re: ☼Elves☼: The start of a project.
« Reply #4 on: September 09, 2014, 10:24:24 pm »

While I like the idea of the elven race being playable, I think MDF elves are not quite the same as their vanilla conterpart (just like humans were quite a bit different).

For starters, they use a metal as their primary weapon/armour material (no wood armour).
The human race also has a few interractions with the elves, mostly around growing plants faster, it might be nice to see a magic user of sorts that does this kind of things (maybe not just on nature, but also on farm plots?).

As for wood, one of the features of MDF is tree farming (basically growing logs in farm plots), so you might want to reuse it.
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LMeire

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Re: ☼Elves☼: The start of a project.
« Reply #5 on: September 09, 2014, 11:10:18 pm »

Ideas:

I think orc mode references elves "tree-singing" to acquire and work with mithril, so how about farming mithril items like plants? Basically a workshop that requires boulders of mithril in it's construction, that slowly produces mithril stuff for free or at a low cost.

Maybe a late-game building that spawns pet forest spirits like dryads, sprites and treants to defend the retreat?

You also might want to consider borrowing the druid-animal-taming system used by the gnomes and hermits.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2014, 11:12:40 pm by LMeire »
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smakemupagus

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Re: ☼Elves☼: The start of a project.
« Reply #6 on: September 10, 2014, 12:10:31 am »

I have a ~25% complete prototype of an elf mod for MDF, which I don't particularly have time to pursue because of my current work schedule (especially the parts of the mod which are for me, time consuming, like creating the building art and doing syndrome and DFHack related stuff) at the moment.  I think our working concepts are pretty different, because you focus on Sylvans and plan to go pretty deep into that area, while my prototype also has Deep (Noldor), Ashland (Chimer/Dunmer), High (Fae), and Grey (Sindarin/Pro elf ;) ) castes and quarters.  And Falmer (Gollum/Falmer) which I had intended to cave_adapt syndrome when anybody other than a Deep elf stays underground.

Just for your background information, Masterwork elves have historically gone to war in mithril arms and armor, not wood.

You are more than welcome to take a look and use what you like. 
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=9346

Even if nothing else matches your plan you will find a copy of K33N's Elves which i've modified slightly for the MDF custom professions, I'm sure it is still OK but I would suggest that you ask him again for permission if you plan to use them, if he's around; it's been over a year since I talked to him.  And, even if you don't use K33N's tileset you might find my graphics raw file a useful reference to MDF's custom professions.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2014, 12:24:47 am by smakemupagus »
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Meph

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Re: ☼Elves☼: The start of a project.
« Reply #7 on: September 10, 2014, 12:43:30 am »

Smake, I love doing building designs, if you send me a list of building names, I am happy to do them. ;)
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Meph

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Re: ☼Elves☼: The start of a project.
« Reply #8 on: September 11, 2014, 12:38:14 am »



There you go. :)

Spoiler: raws part1 (click to show/hide)
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Meph

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Re: ☼Elves☼: The start of a project.
« Reply #9 on: September 11, 2014, 12:39:53 am »

Spoiler: raws part 2 (click to show/hide)

I did not make the full building raws, only the designs. So no hotkeys, building tags or buildmats yet. Mostly because I didnt know in which order they go into the menu and which ones are just concepts, and which will be added in the end.

I made all pagodas greenish and similar in style (Sylvan), all yurts brownish and similar in style (Ashlanders), and the high-elven stuff white. I think a few drow-buildings would be fine as well, removing the drows as a race, having them as a caste for the elves instead.

All of the buildings are square and can be accessed from all sides. The workshops are all small, while the more high-end things that you only make once, like the Silmaril Forge and the Feary Ring and Treant Moot are larger.

Edit: Typo in SIETCH, I forgot the T. ^^
« Last Edit: September 11, 2014, 12:44:45 am by Meph »
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smakemupagus

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Re: ☼Elves☼: The start of a project.
« Reply #10 on: September 11, 2014, 12:44:55 am »

WOW, those came out nice  8)

smakemupagus

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Re: ☼Elves☼: The start of a project.
« Reply #11 on: September 11, 2014, 01:28:59 am »

Yeah, I think i agree with you on magma. 

Well, sounds like we need some drow buildings then.  What did you have in mind?
Brainstorming;

Assassin's Grotto (poisons, pistol crossbows, etc.)
Bloodsteel Grotto
Nethermill (processes cavern plants/wood)
Adamantine Forge
Cult of the Webweaver

Dark blue color theme; netherwood as a buildmat?

Meph

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Re: ☼Elves☼: The start of a project.
« Reply #12 on: September 11, 2014, 01:51:27 am »

Not sold on pistols. Warhammer orcs have them, yes, but the elves here are not eldar. Drow come from D&D, they dont have pistols either. Daggers, scimitars, bows only.

Same goes for Adamantine. I think thats only for dwarves. But drow would allow a subterranean elf version. I know you had the idea of falmer, but they were created over generations with the help of toxic mushrooms, its not that any elf that goes into a cave for 3 years turns into a pale monster. :P

Bloodsteel Grotto, Nethermill, Assassins Grotto for poisons and something for silk/webs/spiders sound good. Not sure if that should stop at silk production or if it should go all the way to giant cave spiders, driders and draegloths. Honestly strikes me as a bit too evil for the good elven race when it comes to Lolth...

Just throwing around ideas, just suggestions. If you want I can 4-5 drow designs as well. That would mean we have forest elves (vanilla DF), ashland elves (TES dumner), high-elves (LotR elben), seelies (RL irish scottish elves) and dark elves (D&D drow). Anything missing? Some high-magic stuff for the high-elves maybe?
« Last Edit: September 11, 2014, 01:57:49 am by Meph »
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Violaceus

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Re: ☼Elves☼: The start of a project.
« Reply #13 on: September 11, 2014, 02:14:26 am »

Elves shouldn't be combined with drows. In dnd they were banished into underworld by elven pantheon, and they hate each other by all means.  I know that masterwork world isn't Greyhawk or Faerun, but if you take drows from them, at least keep their place in world.

Maybe save thm for another playable race in future, with priestesses, dark magic, demon pacts, war spiders, etc.
« Last Edit: September 11, 2014, 02:16:38 am by Violaceus »
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IndigoFenix

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Re: ☼Elves☼: The start of a project.
« Reply #14 on: September 11, 2014, 02:36:15 am »

It would be great if elves could do with multi-tile trees... unfortunately it seems that LUA scripts can't access the connection between a particular tree and its associated tiles, so true tree-shaping will require someone who knows how to work with dfhack plugins.  I can make scripts that create generic, brown 'tree' tiles though.  Removing branch tiles from living trees and turning them into items directly may also be possible, although I'm not sure how this will affect future growth.

I feel that I should point out that while, in LOTR mithril was often associated with elves, they didn't have any power to produce it - they usually got it by trading with dwarves, and the dwarves were the ones who made the light and strong armor with it.  But elves could make star moon runes out of it once they got it.  Maybe give elves the ability to make a special effect metal with mithril, like something that does extra damage against certain enemies.

I'm interested in Silmarils.  What ideas do you have planned for that, I wonder?

Edit: an idea for mithril: Make mithril only be a little better than silver for armor and weapons by default.  Give dwarves a forge reaction that lets them produce the light and strong mithril form, and port the evil-slaying moonsilver to elves as a mithril based alloy.
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