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[than402]

heydude, how would you go fixing the "no drones dying" bug? i have this bug and a loyalty cascade the cause of which i still don't know to take care of, and then run a few more test hives to assure that:

a)the bugs are fixed properly
b)there are no more huge bugs around

[heydude6]

Well what happened was that I made the drones code before I knew about the IT_AFFECTED_CREATURE tag and so I had to make a huge workaround, also the no drones dying bug only happens occasionally, usually it works fine. I just have to remove my overcomplicated drone code and replace it with the simple version. I plan on doing this in the beta version because at the current moment it's doing it's job.

Also I think the root cause of bug may also be that the drone-killing interaction is in the temporary transformed creature that is only onscreen for 5 ticks meaning that it only has 5 ticks to fire off the interaction. A simple fix for that would be to simply extend the transformation duration to something longer like 1000.

So who is the first person that attacks in the loyalty cascade bug? Is it the summons, the queens, the pets? I have that not encountered this in my version but remember that my version is a modified version of 53 without the queen berzerking interactions in place.

[than402]

what causes the cascade is that new migrants sometimes turn opposed to life and fight with their pets. best case scenario, we have a corpse and the issue stops there. worst case scenario, a full loyalty cascade. luckily, i found what causes it:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[INTERACTION:WASP_CRAZYNESS1]
   [I_TARGET:A:CREATURE]
      [IT_LOCATION:CONTEXT_CREATURE] [IT_CANNOT_HAVE_SYNDROME_CLASS:NO_TRANSFORM]
      [IT_MANUAL_INPUT:self]
   [I_EFFECT:ADD_SYNDROME]
      [IE_TARGET:A]
      [IE_IMMEDIATE]
      [SYNDROME]
      [CE_CAN_DO_INTERACTION:PROB:100:START:1209600]
          [CDI:INTERACTION:WASP_CRAZYNESS2]
            [CDI:TARGET:A:SELF_ONLY]
            [CDI:TARGET_RANGE:A:50]
            [CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:806400]


[INTERACTION:WASP_CRAZYNESS2]
   [I_TARGET:A:CREATURE]
      [IT_LOCATION:CONTEXT_CREATURE] [IT_CANNOT_HAVE_SYNDROME_CLASS:NO_TRANSFORM]
      [IT_MANUAL_INPUT:self]
[IT_CANNOT_HAVE_SYNDROME_CLASS:IMMUNE]
   [I_EFFECT:ADD_SYNDROME]
      [IE_TARGET:A]
      [IE_IMMEDIATE]
      [SYNDROME]
      [CE_ADD_TAG:OPPOSED_TO_LIFE:PROB:100:START:0]

you don't have the bug because back in 53 we didn't had these interactions. i will try toying around with them, but if i can't put them to work i suggest removing them. they are not very important anyway, just for flavor. or we can replace the opposed to life with a speed penalty so that at least you won't have to fear a loyalty cascade.

i also have good news, however. your fix for the makeown is working, so that takes care of the other huge bug

how are the graphics going, by the way?

[heydude6]

I finished the entire craftswasp group, smiths group, masons group, woodworkers group, rangers group, jewellers group, the mechanic, woodburner, grower, undead wasp, skeletal wasp, undead praetorain, skeletal praetorian, undead abherrant, ghost, fleshwarper, 2 out of 3 of the fishing group, and the brewer.

I need to finish the farmers group, nobles, mechanics group, medical group, and few miscellaneous citizen sprites (prisoners, drunks etc.). Then I have to begin working on the animals

[than402]

i've fixed pretty much everything i listed and could be fixed (except for the drone thing), but come to think of it i'm not 100% sure about the loyalty cascade thing. i mean, it might as well have been a queen going crazy. the migrant was coming from a hill and therefore there was a possibility he could have had line of sight with my already existing queen, it was killed by pets and so the cascade wouldn't happen berserk or not, and finally it was a solitary case that happened after i had appointed a queen. not before, not with the rest of the migrant wave, but in one case with a queen already existing.

here's how i suggest fixing it:

• change the CRAZED tag into OPPOSED_TO_LIFE in the queen fighting interactions to make a loyalty cascade harder to happen in circumstances like that
• make the wasps start to suck instead of going crazy in the absence of a queen

what do you say?

[Boltgun]

i've fixed pretty much everything i listed and could be fixed (except for the drone thing), but come to think of it i'm not 100% sure about the loyalty cascade thing. i mean, it might as well have been a queen going crazy. the migrant was coming from a hill and therefore there was a possibility he could have had line of sight with my already existing queen, it was killed by pets and so the cascade wouldn't happen berserk or not, and finally it was a solitary case that happened after i had appointed a queen. not before, not with the rest of the migrant wave, but in one case with a queen already existing.

here's how i suggest fixing it:

• change the CRAZED tag into OPPOSED_TO_LIFE in the queen fighting interactions to make a loyalty cascade harder to happen in circumstances like that
• make the wasps start to suck instead of going crazy in the absence of a queen

what do you say?

The later would be the best.

CRAZED is a state you should not recover from because you are garanted to get a loyalty cascade.

OPPOSED TO LIFE does not suffer from that, but might cause issues with with the military and noble screens.

[Vitellozzo]

So... is this playable in any manner?
It seems very interesting, it's working with masterwork in any manner?

[than402]

that's what i'm trying to find out. i'll upload a new version in a few hours with several bugs fixed. it should be playable.

So... is this playable in any manner?

that's what i'm trying to find out. the files currently uploaded have some pretty serious bugs, but i'll upload a new version after i finish a couple of small tweaks. this one should be playable.

It seems very interesting, it's working with masterwork in any manner?

yes it is. our goal is for the wasps to be a fully fledged masterwork race eventually.

The later would be the best.

CRAZED is a state you should not recover from because you are garanted to get a loyalty cascade.

OPPOSED TO LIFE does not suffer from that, but might cause issues with with the military and noble screens.

yeah, on hindsight making the queen go CRAZED was not the best idea. i didn't knew OPPOSED TO LIFE causes troubles as well.

[than402]

update! several tweaks and bug fixes. also, i removed the craziness interactions (for now at least) because they seemed to cause troubles.

http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=9734

[Vitellozzo]

Wow, so fast!
In the meanwhile I've started a new fortress to test those wasps... the concept seems very interesting.
I just hope the new files are compatible with my save, even if I just started the fortress I taked a good spot and I would like to stay with it.
Let's see how DF handle this changes.

[than402]

glad you like it.

if you want to continue your save, just installing the new files won't do. here's what you should do: in the data/save file you will find your save file. if you click on it, you will find a raw folder. that's where the raws of your save are stored. go and replace that raw with the new one. i still don't know if all the changes will work, however.(there's also a chance it will mess up your save, so beware. make a backup)

if you encounter any bugs just let us know.

[Vitellozzo]

glad you like it.

if you want to continue your save, just installing the new files won't do. here's what you should do: in the data/save file you will find your save file. if you click on it, you will find a raw folder. that's where the raws of your save are stored. go and replace that raw with the new one. i still don't know if all the changes will work, however.(there's also a chance it will mess up your save, so beware. make a backup)

if you encounter any bugs just let us know.

Ok I'll try it, thanks again (I didn't know how to update saves).
Anyway dfhack told me of an error about slugsnakes: the game cannot find "slugsnake drone" so no males for this big amazing terror.
Again, I have no idea where one must change the itemname so the game can read it succesfully. Aside from a patch, could you tell me where to look for those wasp pets, and how to change this error into a right object? It seems hermit mode suffers from the same error, since no chickens (there the game search for a "chicken" pet, while chickens are "bird_chicken").

[than402]

thanks for pointing that out. i though i had fixed it but apparently i missed a few scripts. here's a new file:

http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=9734

 most wasp pets should be available on embark or on waspen caravans. you can also call a random waspen pet (and some vanilla insects) from a building called Hive Caller. the exception are a few extra late game pets that you can summon from another building called Shrine To The Depths. These extra pets are either distorted versions of normal wasps to be used as cannon fodder or megabeast sized abominations made of pure hate and mayhem. beware with the latter ones and with Praetorians, because there is a chance they'll come out hostile and will wreck your hive. Then there's the infectory where you can turn "slave pets"(i don't know how to call them, basically versions of normal races with the PET tag which are used as cattle or for transformations) into Hive Thralls, cannon fodder which explodes with poisonous gases upon death. Lastly, in the Hive Call you can make smaller hives of red wasps to be used as bait, nuisance or decoration. They are dirt cheap anyway.

there is a manual on the wasps. Just don't expect a getting started section until i have some experience on wasping.

https://sites.google.com/site/hivemanual2/home

[heydude6]

Well the first thing I recommend is embark with cages and an experienced mechanic, cages will allow you to capture hosts. Than did you implement the bleeding syndrome we talked about yet?

[than402]

yes i did. and yeah, cages are a very good plan. aside from hosts, soul, meat and leather usage is all over the place.