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Author Topic: Credit Card stuffs  (Read 6412 times)

Meph

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Re: Credit Card stuffs
« Reply #15 on: September 20, 2014, 02:11:08 pm »

Its a credit card. I also have debit cards.  ;) When I use them, it goes directly off my account. If I use the credit card, it shows -X on the credit card, and is automatically deducted from my account after a month or so. I guess I could spend more than I have on my account, but that would be... insane? At least extremely unusual. The credit cards are all linked to specific accounts though, have to be. They are issued by the banks themselves.

If people have bad credit, e.g. not much money, they raise the interest? That seems counter productive. In Germany you can get loans, but you have to go to the bank and ask, not just get a 25.000€ credit card. :P And depending on your income etc. you get it or you dont. If you have no income, no one would loan you money, you would just end up in debt.
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LordBucket

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Re: Credit Card stuffs
« Reply #16 on: September 20, 2014, 04:12:29 pm »

If people have bad credit, e.g. not much money, they raise the interest?

Yes. Tough "bad credit" and "not much money" are different things. Here, anyway.

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In Germany you can get loans, but you have to go to the bank and ask, not just get a 25.000€ credit card. :P And depending on your income etc. you get it or you dont. If you have no income, no one would loan you money, you would just end up in debt.

It's entirely possible to have credit cards with no income here in the US provided you have a good credit rating.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Income_No_Asset
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_doc_loan

sneakey pete

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Re: Credit Card stuffs
« Reply #17 on: September 21, 2014, 04:19:21 am »

Has the system not been modified of late to take into account more factors?

Eg i'm pretty sure here in Australia, at least, that if you can even just show bank statements that you've been putting away a certain amount of money every set period and not touching any of it for a long time, that would be just as good as it proves you have means and discipline to pay off debt. Of course that's hearsay, but it makes sense to me.
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Sappho

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Re: Credit Card stuffs
« Reply #18 on: September 21, 2014, 07:58:27 am »

Not really. I mean, if you're going to walk into a bank and ask for a loan, you *might* be able to persuade them by showing them you have money, but it's not likely. There's a national agency that tracks everyone's credit ratings, and everyone who is considering giving you a loan or credit card or anything like that will look at that number as the main factor in their decision. You can improve the rating by just paying your bills on time, but it can be faster to build it higher if you have a credit card, I guess. Everyone gets a credit score, but if you've never done anything to improve it (say, for example, you've always paid cash for everything and don't have any contracts or loans to pay off), you have no rating and most companies won't trust you with a loan, even if you are very responsible with money and have a steady income.

The worst part is, you don't even get to know what your score is. You have the right to request your current score ONCE per year from the rating agency, but the process can be complicated. If you want to see it again, you have to pay for the right to look.

The whole system is a little insane, really. I much prefer the system here: you buy things you can afford and that's about it. If you want to buy a house or car, you can get a loan, but you have to have a large portion of the total to pay up front. No one has credit cards, just debit cards that are linked to their bank accounts, and almost everyone uses cash for everything (partly because paying with a card takes ages). There's no need to worry about your lifelong credit rating, no motivation to get loans (and get yourself into debt) unless you really want to buy a house or something (which most people don't do, because property gets passed down through families).

aenri

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Re: Credit Card stuffs
« Reply #19 on: September 22, 2014, 06:44:25 am »

The whole system is a little insane, really. I much prefer the system here: you buy things you can afford and that's about it. If you want to buy a house or car, you can get a loan, but you have to have a large portion of the total to pay up front. No one has credit cards, just debit cards that are linked to their bank accounts, and almost everyone uses cash for everything (partly because paying with a card takes ages). There's no need to worry about your lifelong credit rating, no motivation to get loans (and get yourself into debt) unless you really want to buy a house or something (which most people don't do, because property gets passed down through families).

I will just add that if you really want something like a house here, the bank is the very last place you go for a loan. You exhaust every option with family members and friends and THEN you go to bank (banks are traditionally viewed like money vampires here). It is always better to have interest free loans (rather than 12% a year interest from bank) from family/friends then to overpay big time on loans from bank. Also banks don't give loans out just because of your pretty eyes, you have to have a financial stability (job, savings, bonds).
« Last Edit: September 22, 2014, 12:25:13 pm by aenri »
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Sappho

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Re: Credit Card stuffs
« Reply #20 on: September 22, 2014, 10:22:40 am »

Yeah, that's a big cultural difference. In the USA there's a lot of pressure to separate from your parents as quickly as possible and start earning your own way. People move away from their parents as soon as they are able, taking out loans to pay for their needs, rather than living at home and saving up money until they have enough to get started. Living with your parents after age 18 or so is considered a sign of laziness or general failure, although it is becoming somewhat more common these days with the economy the way it is. I know that if I, as an adult, approached my parents or other family and asked for a loan, it would be a terribly embarrassing and shameful thing to do. Always better to get the money from a bank or something first, to prove that I'm an independent adult and can take care of myself.

Again, I like the Czech (and Slovak!) culture better in this respect. People live at home until they have enough money to move out (and a good reason to do so), or they just move into property owned by family members (something that doesn't often happen in the USA, where families tend not to hold on to property through generations -- each generation gets their own property, and it's expected that when someone dies, their house will be sold by surviving family members). Families take care of each other and there's nothing embarrassing about having parents and children living all together, even as adults. Again, though, it also helps that you don't have to take out loans to go to university (that will take you 10-20 years to pay back), so you don't start out your adult life in debt.

breadman

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Re: Credit Card stuffs
« Reply #21 on: September 22, 2014, 06:35:23 pm »

But that only applies to people that have debt, no? Those who want to spend money that they currently do not have?

Mostly, yes, though credit scores can also be checked by organizations offering a monthly payment contract, like apartment rental or cellphone service, partly to determine whether they want you as a customer and partly to calculate a reasonable security deposit.  Banks have been known to refuse to open even savings accounts for people with certain problems listed in their report.  In addition, the housing market here has become so corrupted by easy long-term loans that it's nearly impossible to purchase a house without one, and your credit rating determines the interest rate.

I do have 3 credit cards myself, one for Europe and two for worldwide, the second one of those as a backup if something happens to the first one, like getting stolen/lost. At the end of the month the money I got from ATMs by using the credit card gets substracted from my account, with a maximum of 2000€. This is preset, and I knew the amount before I got it, different credit card companies offer different amounts. So in America this amount could be higher or lower depending on how often/how well you pay off debt?

This sounds like a cross between a bank card and a credit card.  ATMs here accept the former, and both can be used by the same credit card system, but banks here typically process transactions from bank cards within a few business days, and the limit is approximately your current balance, subject to some overdraft protection and/or fees.

Credit cards are not typically associated with a bank account, have an interest rate and credit limit that can be raised or lowered at the whim of the issuing company with sufficient notice, and a minimum monthly payment much lower than that limit.  People have been known to get credit card balances into a state where paying off the minimum is insufficient to cover the interest charges, much less reduce the balance.

Has the system not been modified of late to take into account more factors?

Eg i'm pretty sure here in Australia, at least, that if you can even just show bank statements that you've been putting away a certain amount of money every set period and not touching any of it for a long time, that would be just as good as it proves you have means and discipline to pay off debt. Of course that's hearsay, but it makes sense to me.

There are plenty of interesting events that can impact your credit score, including closing accounts and applying for credit (both slightly negative).  Saving money on a monthly basis doesn't seem to help directly, but having a fair amount in an account might.  Having a consistent paycheck helps even more, but might not be reflected in the score itself.

There's a national agency that tracks everyone's credit ratings, and everyone who is considering giving you a loan or credit card or anything like that will look at that number as the main factor in their decision. You can improve the rating by just paying your bills on time, but it can be faster to build it higher if you have a credit card, I guess. Everyone gets a credit score, but if you've never done anything to improve it (say, for example, you've always paid cash for everything and don't have any contracts or loans to pay off), you have no rating and most companies won't trust you with a loan, even if you are very responsible with money and have a steady income.

The worst part is, you don't even get to know what your score is. You have the right to request your current score ONCE per year from the rating agency, but the process can be complicated. If you want to see it again, you have to pay for the right to look.

Three such agencies, and you never know which one(s) will be checked.  It's not hard to check the information they have on file for you, provided you remember all of your addresses, banks, and other financial information, but they won't usually distill it into a score for you without payment.  We were shown ours when the mortgage company requested it, though.

I will just add that if you really want something like a house here, the bank is the very last place you go for a loan. You exhaust every option with family members and friends and THEN you go to bank (banks are traditionally viewed like money vampires here).

That's partly frowned upon here because it can put a major strain on a relationship, particularly if it can't be paid back in a timely fashion.  I've heard that it can help, though; some families have been able to pay off two houses within ten years by accepting temporarily cramped conditions and combining incomes.  I'd be lucky to pay off mine within fifteen years, and my parents are still working on theirs.
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MaximumZero

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Re: Credit Card stuffs
« Reply #22 on: September 23, 2014, 12:13:30 am »

A missing tidbit of information: Most credit cards have annual fees and some have minimum balances you have to maintain or get charged a fee. Yes, some banks will charge you for not owing them money. Store credit cards often have lower limits, higher interest rates, but no annual fee or minimum balance, and can be a good way to get started.
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Thief^

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Re: Credit Card stuffs
« Reply #23 on: September 23, 2014, 04:03:00 am »

A missing tidbit of information: Most credit cards have annual fees and some have minimum balances you have to maintain or get charged a fee. Yes, some banks will charge you for not owing them money. Store credit cards often have lower limits, higher interest rates, but no annual fee or minimum balance, and can be a good way to get started.
O.o

I'm pretty sure a "minimum balance" would be illegal over here!
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Meph

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Re: Credit Card stuffs
« Reply #24 on: September 23, 2014, 04:14:11 am »

In Germany you have this. I pay a nominal fee each year for the credit card, unless I use it for large purchases. After a certain amount of money paid with the credit card, the fee is removed.
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Thief^

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Re: Credit Card stuffs
« Reply #25 on: September 23, 2014, 04:44:17 am »

In Germany you have this. I pay a nominal fee each year for the credit card, unless I use it for large purchases. After a certain amount of money paid with the credit card, the fee is removed.

Do you get any bonuses with your card? Mine is free.
All the cards (or bank accounts) I've seen that have a monthly fee offer some kind of "advantage", which clearly works out as being worth less than the fee, or the bank would lose money :)
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It's not an embark so much as seven dwarves having a simultaneous strange mood and going off to build an artifact fortress that menaces with spikes of awesome and hanging rings of death.

Thief^

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Re: Credit Card stuffs
« Reply #26 on: September 23, 2014, 04:48:25 am »

Its a credit card. [...] If I use the credit card, it shows -X on the credit card, and is automatically deducted from my account after a month or so.
Wikipedia calls this a "charge card". The difference seems to be that charge cards don't have a "credit limit" or charge interest, but have to be paid off in full each month. Although I have my credit card set up to pay off in full automatically, because borrowing money on a credit card's interest rate would be insane (even on my "low" 7.9% card).

My credit card is only used for fuel, something I would be buying anyway. That way I get the advantage of building credit history and a very good credit rating without the risk of overspending :)
« Last Edit: September 23, 2014, 04:55:18 am by Thief^ »
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Dwarven blood types are not A, B, AB, O but Ale, Wine, Beer, Rum, Whisky and so forth.
It's not an embark so much as seven dwarves having a simultaneous strange mood and going off to build an artifact fortress that menaces with spikes of awesome and hanging rings of death.

Xantalos

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Re: Credit Card stuffs
« Reply #27 on: September 23, 2014, 04:51:47 am »

Yes, some banks will charge you for not owing them money.
I'm just gonna sig this and then never use a credit card if I can help it.
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Meph

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Re: Credit Card stuffs
« Reply #28 on: September 23, 2014, 05:08:06 am »

In Germany you have this. I pay a nominal fee each year for the credit card, unless I use it for large purchases. After a certain amount of money paid with the credit card, the fee is removed.

Do you get any bonuses with your card? Mine is free.
All the cards (or bank accounts) I've seen that have a monthly fee offer some kind of "advantage", which clearly works out as being worth less than the fee, or the bank would lose money :)
Worldwide fee-less ATM usage. I can get money anywhere from an ATM, dont pay the usual 5% (with a minimum fee of 5€). So I get money once or twice, and I already saved more money... and since I spend most of my time not in Germany, its pretty good for me.

PS: My credit card is only used for two things: Getting cash from ATMs, and paying silly stuff in the US that can only be paid by credit cards, which is the only place I have ever seen things like that. ;) Things like "We dont accept cash, you have to pay by card." ... ... ... You dont accept money? Actual money can not be used to pay here? ^^
« Last Edit: September 23, 2014, 05:10:33 am by Meph »
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Thief^

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Re: Credit Card stuffs
« Reply #29 on: September 23, 2014, 06:03:10 am »

Oh thanks for the reminder!

As a warning to the OP: Normally withdrawing cash from an atm via a credit card is a massive no-no on your credit record, it's treated as "this person is terrible with money and has no savings, don't lend them money under any conditions".
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Dwarven blood types are not A, B, AB, O but Ale, Wine, Beer, Rum, Whisky and so forth.
It's not an embark so much as seven dwarves having a simultaneous strange mood and going off to build an artifact fortress that menaces with spikes of awesome and hanging rings of death.
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