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Author Topic: Forging How To?  (Read 687 times)

ragincajun

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Forging How To?
« on: September 19, 2014, 04:13:16 pm »

I seem to gen a lot of worlds that have no lignite or bituminous coal for forging.

Current world gen has none on any squares.  And that means 1 for 1 wood use for a forested area.  There is a volcano but no wood. 

The concern is that there are two civilizations showing but one has just 1 square and the other appears to be dead. 

Is this just bad luck in genning a world?
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StagnantSoul

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Re: Forging How To?
« Reply #1 on: September 19, 2014, 04:58:22 pm »

Magma smelter and forge. Ship in wood from the dwarves and elves. Burn that for charcoal for making steel. Then, kill the elves.
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Dunamisdeos

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Re: Forging How To?
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2014, 09:17:34 am »

Remember: The elves must die for the forging process to be complete.
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Rude

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Re: Forging How To?
« Reply #3 on: September 21, 2014, 03:29:16 pm »

With the new multi-tile trees, I find that a just a bit of wooded area makes plenty of coal.
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vjek

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Re: Forging How To?
« Reply #4 on: September 21, 2014, 03:42:42 pm »

I seem to gen a lot of worlds that have no lignite or bituminous coal for forging.

Current world gen has none on any squares.  And that means 1 for 1 wood use for a forested area.  There is a volcano but no wood. 

The concern is that there are two civilizations showing but one has just 1 square and the other appears to be dead. 

Is this just bad luck in genning a world?
Not really bad luck.  As per the wiki, Lignite and Bituminous Coal are found in sedimentary layers.  Volcanos require igneous extrusive layers.  They are often mutually exclusive in DF, that is, it's rare/challenging/difficult to find them in the same embark tile.
The lack of wood is caused by low rain, low drain.  Increase rain/drain, you'll have (yes, literally) thousands of logs available on the tiniest embark.

With multi-tile trees on even a shrubland embark, there's often so many logs, it's absurd/ridiculous/comical.  To say nothing of a temperate coniferous forest or tropical moist broadleaf forest.

Finally, people often want a volcano so they can use magma forges.  Ok, fair enough.  You can also build magma forges on the magma sea.  It is trivial to generate a world with magma within 20 Z of the embark level.  It's often closer to dig straight down 20Z than it is to build a magma forge on a surface volcano, which are almost always more than 20 steps away, on the surface.
Point being?  If the point of the volcano is to have a magma forge, you can achieve that goal faster & quicker with a shallow world.  The best part is, without the need for a volcano, you can reduce volcanism to zero and generate 100% sedimentary worlds and get all those tasty things like iron bearing ore, 4/5 OTHER kinds of flux, and coal and lignite by the thousands. 

Then you can focus on fun things like finding embarks with all of that PLUS adding large amounts of bauxite, kimberllite, and similar for rare & precious stone generation.  :o

Xinael

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Re: Forging How To?
« Reply #5 on: September 22, 2014, 11:11:03 am »

Remember: The elves must die for the forging process to be complete.
No dwarf-forged blade can be finished until it has been quenched in the heart's blood of a tree-worshipper!

It is trivial to generate a world with magma within 20 Z of the embark level.  It's often closer to dig straight down 20Z than it is to build a magma forge on a surface volcano, which are almost always more than 20 steps away, on the surface.
Point being?  If the point of the volcano is to have a magma forge, you can achieve that goal faster & quicker with a shallow world.  The best part is, without the need for a volcano, you can reduce volcanism to zero and generate 100% sedimentary worlds and get all those tasty things like iron bearing ore, 4/5 OTHER kinds of flux, and coal and lignite by the thousands. 

Then you can focus on fun things like finding embarks with all of that PLUS adding large amounts of bauxite, kimberllite, and similar for rare & precious stone generation.  :o
Could you explain in a bit more detail what exactly you're saying should be done to get magma within 20z of the embark? You say it's trivial but don't give instructions :(

If you're proposing simply that we gen shallow worlds so the magma sea is close to the surface, doesn't that limit options for vertical fortresses, chances for layers containing interesting stuff, and reduces the number and size of caverns? Are there other drawbacks? Are they worth it, in your experience?
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vjek

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Re: Forging How To?
« Reply #6 on: September 22, 2014, 11:33:43 am »

... Could you explain in a bit more detail what exactly you're saying should be done to get magma within 20z of the embark? You say it's trivial but don't give instructions :(

If you're proposing simply that we gen shallow worlds so the magma sea is close to the surface, doesn't that limit options for vertical fortresses, chances for layers containing interesting stuff, and reduces the number and size of caverns? Are there other drawbacks? Are they worth it, in your experience?
Instructions for a thinner world.

Depends on what you mean by vertical, interesting and the purpose of the caverns, and what they might mean to others.  To re-iterate what I mentioned above.. 
In my experience, many people ask for embarks with volcanoes simply because they want to use magma forges, while there are better ways to achieve that goal without the complications, cost and consequences that a volcano introduces.
As far as the caverns go, given HFS generation occurs now with a single cavern, I see no value in having more than one, but that's just my personal preference.  I also like "dry" caverns with no moss, and only bloodthorns.  Go figure.  :D

Quietust

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Re: Forging How To?
« Reply #7 on: September 22, 2014, 03:13:59 pm »

Getting a shallow embark isn't actually that difficult - you do need to do a Custom worldgen, but the main important thing you need to do is select one of the REGION templates instead of the ISLAND ones, then adjust the ending year (and any other special things like mineral density). You'll still get all 3 cavern layers (and thus have access to more subterranean flora and fauna), but they won't be nearly as tall (or spaced out) as they are in ISLAND worlds. The result probably won't be quite as shallow as vjek's instructions, but the magma should still be within 50 Z-levels of the surface, which isn't too bad.
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