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[letsdance]

inspired by a mace vs war hammer discussion, i wonder if it's possible to make war hammers 2-handed. if i did these changes:
size 400 -> 800
two_handed 37500 -> 65000
material_size 3 -> 6

it's now a 2-handed weapon (due to can-wield size bug no dwarf can use it one-handed) that needs 2 bars to make. doubling it's size  should also significantly increase damage (more mass). is that correct?

edit: added arena testing data
all battles 10 vs 10, A:B giving the number of survivors

A
iron mace + wooden shield
proficient mace, shield, fighter, discipline

B
iron warhammer
proficient hammer, fighter, discipline

results:
4:0 (all heavy damaged)
7:0 (mostly undamaged, some light damage)
7:0 (1 heavy damage, 6 light damage)

--> mace better if skills low and no armor

A
iron mace + wooden shield
grandmaster mace, shield, dodger, discipline
proficient fighter, wrestler, fighter, kicker, biter

B
iron warhammer
grandmaster hamer, dodger, discipline
proficient fighter, wrestler, fighter, kicker, biter

results:
0:9 (medium damage) - mace did usually only bruises, while hits with war hammer caused real injuries
0:4 (medium damage)

--> war hammer better if skills are higher. i assume dodge is the big difference (macedwarves need it less because they have a shield). i also assume using silver as weapon material would shift this towards the maces (war hammer had more hard hits already)

A
silver mace, wooden shield, iron mail shirt, chain leggings, low boots x2, gauntlets x2, helm
proficient mace, shield, dodger, armor user

B
silver war hammer, iron mail shirt, chain leggings, low boots x2, gauntlets x2, helm
proficient hammer, dodger, armor user

results:
0:4 (medium damage)
0:4 (heavy damage)
6:0 (medium damage)

--> with some armor and low skills it seems to be quite even

A
silver mace, wooden shield, steel breastplate, greaves, helm, high boots x2, gauntlets x2
grandmaster mace, shield, dodger, armor user, discipline
accomplished fighter, wrestler, fighter, kicker, biter

B
silver war hammer, steel breastplate, greaves, helm, high boots x2, gauntlets x2
grandmaster hammer, dodger, armor user, discipline
accomplished fighter, wrestler, fighter, kicker, biter

2:0 (light damage)
0:6 (medium damage)
0:4 (medium damage)

--> full steel and high skills favors war hammers

all in all maces are better if skills are low and armor is weak (or non-existant), while war hammers seem to be the better choice in the long run. but also then, the mace is still performing ok. this also gives me the option to create a mixed squad, giving the "expendable" dwarves war hammers while increasing the survival chance of those that are dear to me by letting them use mace+shield.

i'm quite happy with the result.

[vjmdhzgr]

Yes.

[StagnantSoul]

Well, yes. No dwarf will be able to wield it at all though. Can-wield is kind of broken.

[Putnam]

Well, yes. No dwarf will be able to wield it at all though. Can-wield is kind of broken.

The problem is when the average dwarf size isn't big enough to carry the weapon at all, not when it's not big enough to carry them two-handed.

[Orange Wizard]

Making the weapon size 600(zeroes) instead of 625(zeroes) will solve that issue.

Alternatively, increase dwarf size to 625(zeroes).

[letsdance]

Making the weapon size 600(zeroes) instead of 625(zeroes) will solve that issue.

Alternatively, increase dwarf size to 625(zeroes).

the way i understand it, if i decrease two_handed to 60000, they will be able to use it one-handed (the two_handed tag actually defines the sized for one-handed use). currently no dwarf can use it one-handed, but they can use it two handed because the minimum size is small enough (contrary to all 2-handed weapons in the unmodded game, which i think is causing confusion here).

i didn't test it though, still in an old game. any more voices/votes on this?

[Orange Wizard]

Two-handed size indicates the maximum size of a creature that can only use the weapon in two hands. I think.
I might of course be talking out of a certain hole in my backside, however.

[scamtank]

He got it right in the first post stop confusing the poor boy.

[Findulidas]

Isnt there a maul already though? Then again I guess that cant be used by dwarves looking at the raws. It also seems to be quite shite compared to the hammer.

[Dirst]

It still has a contact area of 10?  Yeah that would be pretty painful.  The DF war hammer isn't a brick on a stick, it's more like a biggish claw hammer used backward.  If it seems overpowered in the arena, try dialing up the contact area to something between 10 and 20.  Any bigger than 20 and it's actually more like a maul than a war hammer.

[letsdance]

added arena test data in the initial post. the result is very satisfying for me.