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Author Topic: Military combat completely broken  (Read 11602 times)

kaen

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Re: Military combat completely broken
« Reply #45 on: December 16, 2014, 11:48:35 am »

I've finally found a reliable work around (at least for my specific flavor of this bug...). Issuing the orders, waiting for the dwarves to get near the target, then canceling the orders and not issuing them again allows my military to attack the target. Obvious downsides are that if you cancel too soon, not all dwarves will be in range to attack without orders, but canceling too late means putting your frontline dwarves in peril while they are defenseless.

This is like a game-breaking issue with quite a few people able to reproduce the problem. I would expect it to be a higher priority :C

Could someone who doesn't regularly hit this bug check out http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=10240 and tell me if it happens for you? I'm trying to verify that my own install isn't just broken.
« Last Edit: December 16, 2014, 01:19:05 pm by kaen »
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Kuikka

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Re: Military combat completely broken
« Reply #46 on: December 16, 2014, 01:37:46 pm »

I tried that method without any positive results... ordered squad to go near enemies and cancelled the order via squad menu. Nothing.

Does this happen only when fps is low (I had 23-26 during that siege, 200 citizens + about 80 gobs), or does it bug in the early game as well?
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kaen

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Re: Military combat completely broken
« Reply #47 on: December 16, 2014, 03:41:07 pm »

That technique has been working for me over the last ~4 invasions/FBs. Unfortunately, it seems to only help a handful of the dwarves, while the rest exhibit the buggy "hugging" behavior. Sometimes I wish I could step through the method with some debug symbols...

I've hit the problem in every fortress, and every engagement since I started playing again about two weeks ago regardless of size or FPS.
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tussock

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Re: Military combat completely broken
« Reply #48 on: December 17, 2014, 05:39:40 am »

kaen, why is the save 117mb? My saves are, like, 10-30, 40 tops. Have you just reached a memory limit with the background activity in a massive world or something? Could that be what's doing this, or does the game crash when it fails to allocate during play?
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Sergarr

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Re: Military combat completely broken
« Reply #49 on: December 17, 2014, 05:40:12 am »

It's probably not compressed.
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._.

bluephoenix

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Re: Military combat completely broken
« Reply #50 on: December 17, 2014, 06:19:51 am »

It is that large because he probably doesn't compress his saves (you can set it in the init file, it is set to compress by default).
I highly recommend anyone who has the hard drive space to NOT compress the save file as this can lead to corrupt saves.

I also experience this "dwarves not attacking" issue quiet a lot, I am really surprised that Toady hasn't even mentioned looking at that bug, even though it is so game breaking and common.
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kaen

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Re: Military combat completely broken
« Reply #51 on: December 19, 2014, 10:40:17 am »

I have COMPRESSED_SAVES:YES in my init file. That upload was also zip'd. Not really sure why it's so massive, but it is a really old fort.
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Kuikka

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Re: Military combat completely broken
« Reply #52 on: December 27, 2014, 09:20:49 pm »

I'm losing my third fort to this f#)2#/("(!!/)(½!!@@11!!!king bug. I mean, this is a free game so no complaining... but this is ridiculous. Easy victory turns into a disaster as FRIENDLY units suddenly lose all offensive skills. Wouldnt be that annoying if the bug woulnt exclude ENEMIES.
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BoogieMan

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Re: Military combat completely broken
« Reply #53 on: December 28, 2014, 01:46:27 am »

Yeah, it's a game breaking critical issue.

It kept happening EVERY game I played.. Which is why I stopped playing even though I'd really like to check out the recent changes. :(
« Last Edit: December 28, 2014, 01:48:20 am by BoogieMan »
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se5a

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Re: Military combat completely broken
« Reply #54 on: December 28, 2014, 01:55:45 am »

it does appear to have something to do with the Z level as someone else already pointed out.
if you give your dwarfs a station order to the same spot they seem to fix themselfs.
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utunnels

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Re: Military combat completely broken
« Reply #55 on: December 28, 2014, 02:20:34 am »

Well that is why I have them assemble in a room behind the gate before sending them to the enemies.
This bug is quite annoying when you need to attack the enemies right away.
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se5a

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Re: Military combat completely broken
« Reply #56 on: December 28, 2014, 05:07:59 am »

This is true. then again, dwarfs have never been good at attacking enemies right away. you know, they have to go put on that one sock first. and take all their armor off to do so.

but yeah, I do hope toady fixes it soon.
I've started to find other dwarfs are starting to get less scared of things they should be as the game progresses now. I  had two engravers and a miner climbing around in the underground to take on (and get killed by) a forgotten beast. some marksdwarfs and swords dwarfs did the same thing without striking it.
I wonder if the dwarfs not attacking things might be some sort of "I think I'm still climbing and don't have hands to attack" thing. if that is a thing.
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Kuikka

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Re: Military combat completely broken
« Reply #57 on: December 29, 2014, 01:55:54 pm »

New siege came and it's really hard to avoid this bug now. My bridge's havent been linked to levers so I _have_to fight, and currently I have tried this 5 times. Each time my soldiers fall asleep before hitting anyone. They just stand there, dodging and blocking strikes until they fall asleep. And die. I really hope this will bug be recognized by devs asap.
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Naryar

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Re: Military combat completely broken
« Reply #58 on: December 29, 2014, 03:42:37 pm »

In my latest siege (in 40.23) I have only had minor bugs, like soldiers lagging to go to a kill/standing order. Soldiers worked but seemed less ready to go than in the previous versions.

No major issues though.
« Last Edit: December 29, 2014, 03:48:14 pm by Naryar »
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tussock

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Re: Military combat completely broken
« Reply #59 on: December 30, 2014, 04:12:55 am »

I finally got the bug to trigger (40.23). Stationed inside a locked door, paused, unlocked the door, issued the kill order, unpaused, got the bug and everyone standing around like idiots. Told them to station again, they wake up and kill folks, or enough of them to get the job done. Going directly to kill works fine. Station works fine. Telling folk to kill when they're on station is dodgy.

I'm setting up a bunch of cage traps to get some on-queue fights set up to see if I can reliably trigger it. Now awaiting a siege. Oh, wait, I've still got a couple caged enemy dorfs. BRB.


OK. Soldiers stationed in sight of an enemy when it appears will attack it on their own. No trouble, give or take for personal sight range and stealth issues. Soldiers off duty and told to attack will attack, no problem. Soldiers on station but not yet attacking because they haven't seen the enemy, when told to attack they have pathing problems, often failing to path, never doing that quick movement, and when they do get near an enemy they say they can't reach the target and rarely attack (though they do rarely, shown against KO'd enemies, so I think they've just failed to enter combat-time).


So what if it's failing to enter combat mode (including the pathfinding-to-enemy code) because the game assumes they're already in it? They will actually wander "close" to the x-y-z of the location given for the attack order as if they're stationing, but never enter combat time.

Right, I repeated it a few times. When under station orders, a dorf will flick to combat mode on seeing an enemy. When under kill orders directly from training or idling or anything else, a dorf is always in combat mode. When shifted directly from station to kill orders, a dorf does not and then cannot flick to combat mode and just tries to station near enemies and only rarely attacks. That repeats for me, regardless of on-duty or off-duty.

Possible workaround: 1: Station, 2: Cancel orders, 3: advance 1 tick, 4: Kill?

ARHGHGH. That doesn't work. They need to take up another job first, otherwise they're still stuck. Someone wandered off and did something or other and then immediately got into combat mode and killed the target. There's something left set from station orders that breaks the kill order until they do some other job.


Huh. Stone traps can hit an enemy multiple times, the stone sort of bounces around and keeps on bashing them. Is that new?


[...]

I bet it's a function pointer. The station order will change the link for each dorf's pathing function to the stationing one where they move to a place scattered around the target on the same floor level and then stand there, and if they sight an enemy from there it's changed to the normal pathfinder and flicks on a combat time switch for it (that's why different z-levels bug it worse). The job assigner sets the path function back to the normal one too, but kill orders don't, they just flick on the combat time switch, and that doesn't work with the station pathing function (because you're not supposed to be in station pathing mode any more with combat time, so it chucks a vague "can't path" error). Anyone moving to station, or doing anything with alternate pathing functions will fail to enter kill orders correctly.

So the more often a formerly-stationed dorf gets hit, the more they trigger their pathfinder, and the worse it bugs out. When I get them near KO'd enemies (thus the rock traps) they can still attack if they happen to end up pathing over the square of the enemy. Cool, seems to fit.
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