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Author Topic: [0.42&0.43] The Earth Strikes Back! v2.15 - It's a mine... it's-a not yours!  (Read 45512 times)

Teneb

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Well that's still not going to be all deities, probably not even half unless it's a really long world with lots of vampires.
As far as I can tell Nunur never cursed anyone nor raised any spires.  I wonder if the [IMMOBILE] tag on the creature (which prevents any use of interactions) has an effect on the deity.
I don't think so. It's just that gods have a random chance of freeing a demon. And for that, a worldgen demon needs to be created by the game in the first place. There are always more gods than demons, so of course only a few will ever do that. Vampires/werecreatures happen when temples are defiled by a creature for whatever reason. From the devlog, we should be seeing a lot more of that soon.
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Muffinator

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PTW I'm trying out 1.30 now, i really like the mod :D

Edit: Is it possible to use TESB with the more stones metals and gems mod? I'm gonna find out :D
« Last Edit: August 07, 2015, 10:16:50 am by Muffinator »
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Dirst

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PTW I'm trying out 1.30 now, i really like the mod :D

Edit: Is it possible to use TESB with the more stones metals and gems mod? I'm gonna find out :D
I'm glad you like it.  I haven't tried that other mod, but I did try to compartmentalize this one to make it play well with others.  You would need to insert some stuff by cut-and-paste rather than just dropping in the files, but it should all just work.  (I really wish the people making mod-merge tools got together with the people making the visualizer tools, but no ever confused DF with being easy.)

Only oddity might be if the other mod adds new layer stones that TESB doesn't recognize.  They would be barren without any Hidden Gems or Awakened Stones.
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On hiatus. Feel free to adopt or update:
(0.42 & 0.43) The Earth Strikes Back! v2.15 - Pay attention...  It's a mine!  It's-a not yours!
(0.42 & 0.43) Appearance Tweaks v1.03 - Tease those hippies about their pointy ears.
(0.42 & 0.43) Accessibility Utility v1.04 - Console tools to navigate the map

Muffinator

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I made a fort and everything seems to be going okay, The barren layers are fine, I believe it adds some layer stones too... I'm beginning to forget what is vanilla now. I actually havent found any hidden or awakened gems yet.

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Muffinator

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I just want you to know, dwarves adopting pet rocks is the cutest thing I've ever heard. :3
I love your mod!
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Dirst

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I checked the More Stone, Metals, Gem Mod, and the only new layer stone is Feldspar.  Add Feldspar variants of Awakened Stones and Pet Rocks would spam error messages at anyone not using that mod, so the correct answer seems to be leaving that stone barren.

And glad that you're enjoying the Pet Rocks :)
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On hiatus. Feel free to adopt or update:
(0.42 & 0.43) The Earth Strikes Back! v2.15 - Pay attention...  It's a mine!  It's-a not yours!
(0.42 & 0.43) Appearance Tweaks v1.03 - Tease those hippies about their pointy ears.
(0.42 & 0.43) Accessibility Utility v1.04 - Console tools to navigate the map

Jazzeraint

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Do the Awakened Stones have fleshy innards / organs in order to make them die more easily in combat, or for some other, more arcane reason?
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The silver is responsible for this How?

Dirst

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The idea was that the ember turned everything around it into living flesh, and the stone coating is the boundary where it tore itself free from the surrounding rock.  I didn't want to just do Gabbro Men with a different body shape.
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On hiatus. Feel free to adopt or update:
(0.42 & 0.43) The Earth Strikes Back! v2.15 - Pay attention...  It's a mine!  It's-a not yours!
(0.42 & 0.43) Appearance Tweaks v1.03 - Tease those hippies about their pointy ears.
(0.42 & 0.43) Accessibility Utility v1.04 - Console tools to navigate the map

Jazzeraint

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The idea was that the ember turned everything around it into living flesh, and the stone coating is the boundary where it tore itself free from the surrounding rock.  I didn't want to just do Gabbro Men with a different body shape.

I have difficulty wrapping my imagination around this creature, but I appreciate the differentiation.

My only personal dis-preferences with this mod are the 1) mass proliferation of gem types with the hidden versions, and thus clutter / etc (further cluttering with the layer-specific gem vine farming), 2) the tribute system feeling similarly cluttery due to its layer-specific design, and 3) the general uselessness of benign awakened stones (though lots of vanilla creatures are similar in their lack of explicit uses, so~).

Regardless, it's an excellent mod, and the scripts are more than high-five worthy.
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Dirst

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I have difficulty wrapping my imagination around this creature, but I appreciate the differentiation.
The Pet Rocks are made of just stone, if that makes you feel better :)

My only personal dis-preferences with this mod are the 1) mass proliferation of gem types with the hidden versions, and thus clutter / etc (further cluttering with the layer-specific gem vine farming), 2) the tribute system feeling similarly cluttery due to its layer-specific design, and 3) the general uselessness of benign awakened stones (though lots of vanilla creatures are similar in their lack of explicit uses, so~).

There are some really neat tools for de-cluttering raws (Rubble, PyDwarf, etc.) but I couldn't find any way to de-clutter the interface.  I made a single reaction that deftly handles processing every kind of gem cluster, but unfortunately I couldn't do the same for the Tributes.  The alternative is to make a one-size-fits-all Tribute, but it would either need 72 distinct reactions or 26 and a heroic amount of micro-management from the player.

I made a suggestion to let modders reference the workshop's building material in a reaction, which would allow for a single Tribute workshop on the building menu that simply did different things depending on its material.  Since this suggestion would benefit approximately one modder on the planet, I understand it's unlikely to happen.  Though now that I think about it, I can probably achieve that with DFHackery.

The mod expands the types of gems by 20% and the types of underground plants by a lot.  It did bother me hidden gems crowded out ordinary small clusters, but I was able to fix that in version 1.30.  Now they are a rare random drop from mining a tile of layer stone.  I was less worried about living stone crowding out ordinary single-tile clusters because no vanilla gems would compete for the same tiles, but the solution for hidden gems also made living stone spawn awakened stones more reliably (and who knows what other mod might be trying to add single-tile cluster gems?).  The random drop method also slimmed down the mod by 24 materials and a material template.

The gem vines do clutter things up a bit, and if you prefer you can delete plant_tesb.txt to remove them.  You'll end up with a redded-out menu choice on your still and the "extract gem seed" operation at a Tribute will simply destroy the rough gem.

Regardless, it's an excellent mod, and the scripts are more than high-five worthy.
Thanks, I appreciate that.  The original motivation for the mod was to do something that hadn't been done before in DF.  That means I've been learning a lot about how DF works, and that almost all of it requires DFHack sleight-of-hand (it is possible to spawn creatures with raw modding, but it was so unreliable that I didn't release the mod until I'd duct-taped together a 0.40 version of spawn-unit.lua).  Right now, the only feature 100% in the raws is the gem vine, and even that depends on you getting your hands on a rough hidden gem that can only appear due to a script.

Probably not in 1.31, but watch out for a single Tribute building to take on all of the Tribute functions.
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On hiatus. Feel free to adopt or update:
(0.42 & 0.43) The Earth Strikes Back! v2.15 - Pay attention...  It's a mine!  It's-a not yours!
(0.42 & 0.43) Appearance Tweaks v1.03 - Tease those hippies about their pointy ears.
(0.42 & 0.43) Accessibility Utility v1.04 - Console tools to navigate the map

Meph

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Quote
The original motivation for the mod was to do something that hadn't been done before in DF.

Quote
Three harder mining creatures:
All rocks/ores have a chance to spawn 1-3 rock/metalwraiths.
In igneous-intrusive, the deepest layer, you might hit a balrog or soggoth.
You miner will transform, drop his gear and stand still for a time (shocked and motionless from fear)
Then the creature will spawn, with a little delay, to help your miner to get away.
Rockwraiths are weak, even copper kills them easily. Punches/Kicks wont help though.
Metalwraiths are slightly stronger, you need bronze or iron to kill them.
Balrogs are like little megabeats, send your military.
Soggots need special tactics. They multiply when an apendage gets cut off. If you send your military, you get overrun.
Use cave-ins, magma, fire, ice, obsidian, wall-ins, or kill it otherwise instantly.
(From Masterwork DF, April 2013)

:P
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::: ☼MASTERWORK DF☼ - A comprehensive mod pack now on Patreon - 250.000+ downloads and counting :::
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Dirst

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Quote
The original motivation for the mod was to do something that hadn't been done before in DF.

Quote
Three harder mining creatures:
All rocks/ores have a chance to spawn 1-3 rock/metalwraiths.
In igneous-intrusive, the deepest layer, you might hit a balrog or soggoth.
You miner will transform, drop his gear and stand still for a time (shocked and motionless from fear)
Then the creature will spawn, with a little delay, to help your miner to get away.
Rockwraiths are weak, even copper kills them easily. Punches/Kicks wont help though.
Metalwraiths are slightly stronger, you need bronze or iron to kill them.
Balrogs are like little megabeats, send your military.
Soggots need special tactics. They multiply when an apendage gets cut off. If you send your military, you get overrun.
Use cave-ins, magma, fire, ice, obsidian, wall-ins, or kill it otherwise instantly.
(From Masterwork DF, April 2013)

:P

Yes, I know, I found Masterwork's "warpstone" feature after I'd sunk quite a bit of work into the raws-only method... if I recall correctly it was the first example I'd seen of raws-only spawing that actually functioned, though it was over-complicated for my purposes.  There is a ridiculous amount of creative content for DF.

That said, I am so glad that warmist came along with the spawn-unit script  :)
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On hiatus. Feel free to adopt or update:
(0.42 & 0.43) The Earth Strikes Back! v2.15 - Pay attention...  It's a mine!  It's-a not yours!
(0.42 & 0.43) Appearance Tweaks v1.03 - Tease those hippies about their pointy ears.
(0.42 & 0.43) Accessibility Utility v1.04 - Console tools to navigate the map

Jazzeraint

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Quote
The original motivation for the mod was to do something that hadn't been done before in DF.

Quote
Three harder mining creatures:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
(From Masterwork DF, April 2013)

:P

We already know you're awesome, Meph. ;)
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The silver is responsible for this How?

Jazzeraint

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The Pet Rocks are made of just stone, if that makes you feel better :)

It's my own personal failing of imagination, so I don't blame you at all.

There are some really neat tools for de-cluttering raws (Rubble, PyDwarf, etc.) but I couldn't find any way to de-clutter the interface.  I made a single reaction that deftly handles processing every kind of gem cluster, but unfortunately I couldn't do the same for the Tributes.  The alternative is to make a one-size-fits-all Tribute, but it would either need 72 distinct reactions or 26 and a heroic amount of micro-management from the player.

Thinking about it now, I'd probably just add a [REACTION_CLASS] tag to all of the hidden gems, then make a tribute cost 3 cut hidden gems (any), but have that make them wholly 'tributed' to all awakened stones. Less clutter and micromanagement all around. If that's too 'generous', the cost in hidden gems could also be increased.

It did bother me hidden gems crowded out ordinary small clusters, but I was able to fix that in version 1.30.  Now they are a rare random drop from mining a tile of layer stone.  I was less worried about living stone crowding out ordinary single-tile clusters because no vanilla gems would compete for the same tiles, but the solution for hidden gems also made living stone spawn awakened stones more reliably (and who knows what other mod might be trying to add single-tile cluster gems?).  The random drop method also slimmed down the mod by 24 materials and a material template.

All of which I appreciate!

The gem vines do clutter things up a bit, and if you prefer you can delete plant_tesb.txt to remove them.  You'll end up with a redded-out menu choice on your still and the "extract gem seed" operation at a Tribute will simply destroy the rough gem.

Per my thoughts with tributing, I'd probably slim this down to 1 to 4 crops in total, and make it produce a random hidden gem at chance when brewing, especially since all of the hidden gems have the same material value. The side effect of that would be having multiple gems occasionally show up, I think, but I don't mind that kind of randomness.

Probably not in 1.31, but watch out for a single Tribute building to take on all of the Tribute functions.

Looking forward to seeing more!
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Dirst

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Thanks for the feedback.  It's really helpful.

As an aside, fleshy innards actually make awakened stones a bit hardier in combat.  Without internal organs, fracturing a stone upper body seems to be an insta-kill.

There's nothing mechanically preventing all stone types from accepting a single tribute, or splitting it to sedimentary, metamorphic, igneous extrusive, and igneous intrusive classes.  The current system's reasoning is that these creatures are only semi-intelligent and they're being lulled by the rocky equivalent of pheromone perfume, which seems to call for fairly specific tributes.*  Version 1.31 will add a second way of attaining "favor" status (mostly for color, since Tributes will still be the most reliable solution), and it could apply at the same level of breadth/detail.  The gem vines could follow suit, though it would probably entail re-arranging the hidden gem types to allow for meaningful groupings.  As it is, all of the hidden ___ opals are associated with sedimentary stones but the others are just "this kind of gem can appear in this kind of rock".

The stumbling block, for the moment, is that there would still be 24 different types of Tribute building anyway, since I can't specify "this building can be made from any of these six specific materials."  I can have a script that deconstructs the building if its materials are wrong, but if I'm going to script it I might as well go with a single building type and script the outcomes of reactions.

I'm curious what everyone thinks about keeping each tribute and gem vine distinct vs. grouping them into 4 classes or even 1 class.  In any case, there will still be 24 types of awakened stone and 24 types of pet rock (even the Modest Mod, which is merciless in reducing material counts, retains all of the layer stones).

*My original concept was more god-based, and was going to require sacrificing a dwarf to build the Tribute that would lull all awakened stones of that type anywhere on the map.  That turned out to be beyond my DFHacknomancy at the time, and the implemented version makes more sense anyway.
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On hiatus. Feel free to adopt or update:
(0.42 & 0.43) The Earth Strikes Back! v2.15 - Pay attention...  It's a mine!  It's-a not yours!
(0.42 & 0.43) Appearance Tweaks v1.03 - Tease those hippies about their pointy ears.
(0.42 & 0.43) Accessibility Utility v1.04 - Console tools to navigate the map
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