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Author Topic: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art  (Read 156616 times)

Max™

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #150 on: March 12, 2015, 12:15:07 am »

The fact that a wrestle doesn't commit until you move/attack/jump/advance time is how I do this:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Hack the lower body and spill the guts, bite them, then target them, wrestle > shake guts > attack lower body + multi > attack lower body with offhand > feed on target > hit comma, laugh at how awful it is.

Oh, use img width=650 or so and you can click them to enlarge but they don't break tables and such.
« Last Edit: March 12, 2015, 02:18:54 am by Max™ »
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Random_Dragon

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #151 on: March 12, 2015, 12:35:18 am »

I've found a few more clever uses for this. owo

The inexperienced combatant falls into a common trap of taking a single-minded approach to combat. Defend, attack, one thing at a time. But being able to exploit simultaneous defense and counter-attack allows the practitioner to regain the initiative.

Urosh Otad - Wraith Hand:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

In this instance, the counterattack is more psychologically damaging than physically, but it demonstrates the technique of combining defense and attack in one swift movement.

Another use of this technique is a modification of the Cavein Strike. In the classic example the practitioner takes control of weapon and shield before leaping away.

Subet Korumid Abod - Swift Cavein Strike:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

In this instance, we trade a thorough disarming for affording the opponent less time to secure his weapon.

However, we also have a third use for this, in many ways a simplification of Dragonfall, not requiring a full run to build up speed, yet still being reasonably effective.

Zêvutfesh - Dreadwing:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

EDIT: images spoiler'd due to hugeness.
« Last Edit: March 12, 2015, 01:00:20 am by Random_Dragon »
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Magnus

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #152 on: March 12, 2015, 01:24:02 am »

That lower one is by definition a cave-in strike I think. Grab their weapon, then jump at them.
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That Wolf

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #153 on: March 12, 2015, 01:29:19 am »

You would have to interrupt by catching and then lock the joint I think, so it would be at least a couple steps.

Does breaking a neck kill?
Late reply: yes it can, you become paralized and suffocate because your lungs arnt getting the spinal cords signals, that is of course if the cords are severed.
It isnt fun.

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I will often look at the spoilered images if the description is interesting enough.

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Here comes the image gestapo
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Random_Dragon

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #154 on: March 12, 2015, 01:33:00 am »

That lower one is by definition a cave-in strike I think. Grab their weapon, then jump at them.

True. Though in the example originally posted, he grabbed the enemy's weapon and shield before jumping, which would've taken at least one turn more to pull off. Though chances are he did exactly that after the SECOND grab, so I am a dummy. =w=

The first technique at least seems new.

[1:02:48 AM] Chaosvolt: This, basically. I just ported a founding Krav Maga technique to DF.
[1:09:58 AM] Kallin Argentclaw: Punching peple in the face? <_<
[1:10:58 AM | Edited 1:11:09 AM] Chaosvolt: Technically the technique here is the "simultaineous defense and counterattack" part, but "punch them in the face" is a core Krav Maga element too. o3o

EDIT: And to add yet another addition to the many uses of jumpslams...

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: March 12, 2015, 01:44:36 am by Random_Dragon »
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Max™

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #155 on: March 12, 2015, 02:20:33 am »

A shame you don't get to maintain possession in that case. "ha ha, got your leg!" *holds between fingers like the 'got your nose' joke*
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Magnus

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #156 on: March 12, 2015, 04:10:16 am »

Max, I still can't do it. If I jump without attacking I simply get the "enemy jumps out of your flight path". And whenever I confirm a jump, I can't do anything else until the jump has landed and the enemy has gone flying.

Can anyone confirm that the Dragonfall is possible with lower speeds?
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miauw62

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #157 on: March 12, 2015, 10:08:52 am »

Yeah, this is a dwarven technique called the Shield Wall[Not sure what that'd be in actual dwarven]. It lets you hold an infinite number of objects in one hand. Usually its used to hold a fuckton of leather shields so you get a bajillion blocks per turn. Although I once saw that technique used by an old and grizzled veteran in fort mode who'd lost a hand and a leg to hold his hammer, shield and crutch in the same hand.
Huh, I thought that was fixed.

Also, this seems to be THE adventure thread of this version, which is great.
« Last Edit: March 12, 2015, 10:10:30 am by miauw62 »
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Random_Dragon

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #158 on: March 12, 2015, 10:09:39 am »

Max, I still can't do it. If I jump without attacking I simply get the "enemy jumps out of your flight path". And whenever I confirm a jump, I can't do anything else until the jump has landed and the enemy has gone flying.

Can anyone confirm that the Dragonfall is possible with lower speeds?

See my lower-speed variation on the general concept above.

You also need a high enough wrestling skill, at the least. I tested it with grand master skill and it works reliably, but couldn't pull it off with no skill. Not sure what the minimum skill for reliable results is.

Also don't forget that the dodge skill of your target plays into it, unsure how high your skills have to be to beat the average bandit's dodge. o3o
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Max™

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #159 on: March 12, 2015, 11:06:46 am »

Max, I still can't do it. If I jump without attacking I simply get the "enemy jumps out of your flight path". And whenever I confirm a jump, I can't do anything else until the jump has landed and the enemy has gone flying.

Can anyone confirm that the Dragonfall is possible with lower speeds?
Yeah, as our local chaotic firelizard mentioned you gotta be able to beat their dodge with wrestling or reaction (possibly observer skill related) with your speed... I suppose you could use stealth from outside their sight cone, but that might count as being different enough to be a separate thing since you're using your brain+sneaking rather than just barreling up at someone like a little steel freight train.
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Random_Dragon

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #160 on: March 12, 2015, 11:55:58 am »

Exactly as Max put it, though I'm unsure how the AI uses the observer skill. It'll definitely come into play if you use stealth, but...

Anyone got any !!SCIENCE!! on whether the observer skill affects the AI's ability to avoid attacks?
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Broseph Stalin

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #161 on: March 12, 2015, 02:26:23 pm »

I'm currently consolidating the techniques and principles of Kisat Dur but I'm also a sleepy sleepy boy so please be patient.

Random_Dragon

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #162 on: March 12, 2015, 03:58:02 pm »

I'm currently consolidating the techniques and principles of Kisat Dur but I'm also a sleepy sleepy boy so please be patient.

Broseph Stalin cancels kick elven ass: interrupted by sleep.

Is fine. owo
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That Wolf

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #163 on: March 13, 2015, 01:06:12 am »

quote author=Broseph Stalin link=topic=148015.msg6096078#msg6096078 date=1426188383]
I'm currently consolidating the techniques and principles of Kisat Dur but I'm also a sleepy sleepy boy so please be patient.
[/quote]
I have an adaptation of this syle that I kinda didnt want to share because i feared its power and if it was even possible to use.
I shall share.
MINECARTS: yes attempt a cave in while riding a minecart into another enemy.
I was going to try a martial arts style based on use of minecarts. Perhaps lava filled minecarts for extra Armok worship
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Broseph Stalin

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Re: Kisat Dur: the Dwarven Martial Art
« Reply #164 on: March 16, 2015, 04:10:42 pm »

The Principles of Kisat Dur
The warrior is what remains when the weapon is gone.

Unarmed combat is often ignored as a discipline of warfare. A warrior who depends on his weapon can fight no better than a man who depends on his crutch can walk. Kisat Dur is the Dwarven art of unarmed combat and it's masters are feared by even the greatest soldiers. A casual practitioner may use the techniques in conjunction with a weapon or to resolve conflicts wear drawing a weapon is undesirable. The focus of Kisat Dur is to render the enemy incapable of or uninterested in harming you. This can mean death, unconsciousness, or surrender. This is achieved by blending offense, defense, and knowledge into every move the practitioner makes.

Ikorottan (Warrior Mind)

Ikorottan is knowledge which makes the warrior more deadly without necessarily requiring a specific technique to be used. The Ikorottan school is what separates the Kisat Dur practitioner from a common warrior and gives him his deadly edge.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Nonub (The Punch)

A punch is faster than a kick and only slightly weaker. Dwarves are born of the stone and can more safely sacrifice some strength than some speed. Keep the feet on the ground to allow quick movement while striking with the fists.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Thak (The Lock)

The purest expression of raw power, taking an enemy's limbs and using one's muscle to manipulate them. This can take the form of throwing the enemy or twisting the limb until they are destroyed. An arm, leg, fist, or foot is grabbed and gripped tightly. This body part is then bent in the lock until it gives out, usually rendering the enemy unconscious. Mostly influenced by strength even a very skilled opponent can be defeated with a lock as long as the practitioner is sufficiently strong.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Toradadom (The Body Crush)
The practitioner jumps into their opponent using their mass as a weapon. An enemy may be staggered, wounded, or even killed by these techniques. A skilled practitioner my even use them to disarm an enemy or strip them of their armor.


Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The list so far.
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