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[Bumber]

They're averages. Creatures can be much smaller or much larger.

I would assume by (at most)* 56.25% of the creature average, given the height and broadness vary by ±25% each (0.75^2 to 1.25^2 = 56.25% to 156.25%.)

*43.75% smaller, 56.25% bigger. Frickin' proportions, how do they work?

[bahihs]

They're averages. Creatures can be much smaller or much larger.

I would assume by (at most)* 56.25% of the creature average, given the height and broadness vary by ±25% each (0.75^2 to 1.25^2 = 56.25% to 156.25%.)

*43.75% smaller, 56.25% bigger. Frickin' proportions, how do they work?

Possibly Gaussian?

In other news, it seems size is extremely important in determining throwing ability. I did some tests using different sized combatants (it took while to generate them) and smaller people have great difficulty in take-downs, throws and even joint-locks. Though I imagine this difference becomes trivial once strength is high enough (and perhaps the skill gap).

Also, is there any real difference between kicking and striking? Or are they essentially the same thing but with different body parts?

[Broseph Stalin]

Kicks are slower than punches, I'm not sure if they're more powerful but if they are it's not super significant.

[Broseph Stalin]

Something I've noticed happen. Sometimes when a grab for an incoming limb misses you still get the "catch" and the grab behaves as it's successful.

Just "missed" a lock.

edit: Might have been an autoattack that ignored manual attack.

[a smiling bearded cretin]

In other news, it seems size is extremely important in determining throwing ability. I did some tests using different sized combatants (it took while to generate them) and smaller people have great difficulty in take-downs, throws and even joint-locks. Though I imagine this difference becomes trivial once strength is high enough (and perhaps the skill gap).

From what I recall (as I haven't had a fully powerleveled character since 34.11), sizing still counts. A fully powerleveled dwarf demigod with superdwarven strength and legendary wrestling won't do more than repeatedly adjust a grips versus a larger opponent like a dragon.

That powerleveled dwarf demigod with superdwarven strength can, however, pulp the dragon's head.

Also, is there any real difference between kicking and striking?

The prepare and recover is longer for kicks.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[ATTACK_VERB:punch:punches]
[ATTACK_PREPARE_AND_RECOVER:3:3]

[ATTACK_VERB:kick:kicks]
[ATTACK_PREPARE_AND_RECOVER:4:4]

Which means more can happen during the in-between.

[Arcvasti]

Kicks also use a different skill and have substantially more force behind them then a punch does.

[Broseph Stalin]

Kicks also use a different skill and have substantially more force behind them then a punch does.

How much more force? The difference doesn't seem very practical.

[Arcvasti]

Kicks also use a different skill and have substantially more force behind them then a punch does.

How much more force? The difference doesn't seem very practical.

Haven't checked the raws, but in my experience, a heavy kick to the head of an unconscious dwarf kills them instantly. It takes 2-3 heavy punches to kill the same unconcious dwarf.

[Broseph Stalin]

Haven't checked the raws, but in my experience, a heavy kick to the head of an unconscious dwarf kills them instantly. It takes 2-3 heavy punches to kill the same unconcious dwarf.

I tried to test it scientifically (hard because of variance in arena creatures) but it wasn't notably easier to collapse an upper body with a kick than it was with a punch.

[Uzu Bash]

I've rolled characters smaller and larger than average for their race, but not in the arena. If you could set height/mass variations in the arena, then you could test their effects with all other variables equal.

[bahihs]

From what I can tell then, kicks are vastly inferior to punches (recovery time and prep time are rather important to combat). Though I still have the gut feeling that kicks should be more powerful than punches if only for balance. I need to check this in arena, though if Broseph Stalin's results are repeated then that's the end of that.

(@Broseph Mind showing us your experimental setup so I can try to reproduce it?)

Also, I feel like gauntlets should allow more powerful blows, albeit slower punches (imagine taking a heavy metal fist to the cranium), is there any way to mod this in (if it isn't in already?)

[vjmdhzgr]

From what I can tell then, kicks are vastly inferior to punches (recovery time and prep time are rather important to combat). Though I still have the gut feeling that kicks should be more powerful than punches if only for balance. I need to check this in arena, though if Broseph Stalin's results are repeated then that's the end of that.

(@Broseph Mind showing us your experimental setup so I can try to reproduce it?)

Also, I feel like gauntlets should allow more powerful blows, albeit slower punches (imagine taking a heavy metal fist to the cranium), is there any way to mod this in (if it isn't in already?)

You can't mod in armor affecting damage, and it isn't in the game. Though I suppose one could make a mod where you can use workshops to transform a dwarf into a different caste which has a layer of metal added to their hand that's done at the same cost as gauntlets, but that probably woulnd't function in an anywhere near similar way to gauntlets, and would probably not be a very good punching bonus.

[Broseph Stalin]

I've rolled characters smaller and larger than average for their race, but not in the arena. If you could set height/mass variations in the arena, then you could test their effects with all other variables equal.

One dead arena elf does not weigh the same as another implying some difference in size.

From what I can tell then, kicks are vastly inferior to punches (recovery time and prep time are rather important to combat). Though I still have the gut feeling that kicks should be more powerful than punches if only for balance. I need to check this in arena, though if Broseph Stalin's results are repeated then that's the end of that.

(@Broseph Mind showing us your experimental setup so I can try to reproduce it?)

Also, I feel like gauntlets should allow more powerful blows, albeit slower punches (imagine taking a heavy metal fist to the cranium), is there any way to mod this in (if it isn't in already?)

One elf choked unconscious and struck only with punches or kicks to the upper body then note how many strikes before chest-splosion. I did it four times before I thought about the impact of size and gave up.

Punches 17, 14
Kicks 15, 10

Kicks may be more powerful but the difference seems to be mostly academic.

[Uzu Bash]

Was the size difference significant enough to show up in their descriptions?

[Broseph Stalin]

Was the size difference significant enough to show up in their descriptions?

I didn't mark the descriptions but that will happen in arena mode.