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[BlackFlyme]

travelling/traveling

Both are acceptable forms, depending on where you are from.

[Ruludos]

Both are acceptable forms, depending on where you are from.

Ah, I apologize then.

[AceSV]

Having a lot of trouble generating a world. Even after giving Vulps more freedom to spawn (a start biome of ANY_FOREST), I'm going through hundreds of rejects because the game can't place them. Has anyone had any luck generating a playable world?

[NAME:traveling staff:traveling staffs]

Should be travelling staff, two 'l's.

If you haven't downloaded them again within the last couple hours, try again, I found a couple syntax errors that prevented them from being generated (at least some were related to the new weapons, so make sure you redo those too).  I also had to make dwarves unplayable to make them guaranteed to show up. 

Also I don't know if this is the issue, but it didn't work for me to just drop the new .txt files into the raw/objects folder, I had to copy and paste the text into one of the existing files. 

@Nirur, I appreciate the info, but I don't really enjoy modding or reading status descriptions enough to want to bother doing that if there's no physical change that having fur would provide, like resistance to cold or bug bites.  However, I invite everyone who enjoys the fuzz to write it up and I'll add it to the final product. 

[King_of_Baboons]

Let's see how many years Vulps can last before they are wiped out by goblins and megabeasts......

[AceSV]

Alright, so Vulps are pretty hardcore. 

The plains titan Nar Beardeserts the Raw Shores showed up at my doorstep and killed a bunch of Vulps before they could scurry inside.  It breezed past my trap corridor and paused for a bit outside a forbidden door.  I looked away for a second, and when I looked back, it was gone.  So was the door.  Apparently, the plains titan Nar Beardeserts the Raw Shores stumbled into a major traffic area and a crowd of Vulps and exotic pets ripped him to shreds before he could do any serious damage to them.  I had ordered my 15 raw recruits to kill it, but it looks like they didn't do that much.  Luckily, such things are recorded:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

That was the last combat report.  Apparently it bled out.  The Miner, Unib Romlamdoren "Cloakdiamonds" then spake the words: "I have a part in this.  I cannot just stand by.  There is no need to feel vengeful.  I was near to a Door.  It's very interesting."  He didn't feel anything after seeing the plains titan Nar Beardeserts the Raw Shores die. 

[Eric Blank]

Actually, since the thorax would be the upper body on an insect creature, smashing it into a lump of gore should simply be an instant k.o. swarms and swarms of unarmed losers always make quick work of single beasts, by the way, unless they are made of a material which the farmers simply can't penetrate unarmed. Or breath fire/spit webs.

What you need is to put some trained soldiers up against goblin sieges and find out how well hey do on the battlefield.

[TheDorf]

I'm not a huge fan of furries and the like, but I have to give you credit for starting what seems like a rather ambitious project for someone who's new to modding. Also, amazing job with those sprites! :O

[AceSV]

I'm not a huge fan of furries and the like, but I have to give you credit for starting what seems like a rather ambitious project for someone who's new to modding. Also, amazing job with those sprites! :O

Modding's a bitch, but not as hard as actually making games.  Making 16x16 sprites on the other hand, is about the same difficulty level as doing this, yet less impressive, so I don't know how far I'll go with those. 



Also, it seems that a lot of my Vulp immigrants are being generated with the Crossbow skill, even though Vulps cannot produce crossbows and so far I haven't encountered any Dwarves or Humans.  Anyone know if that's something I could fix?

[~Neri]

Give them a ranged weapon that functions with the crossbow skill. Technically traditionally in Japan, they used archery extensively. Samara were meant to be one on one skirmishers and ranged support. The average army had more people trained in ranged combat then melee.

[scamtank]

I've personally made my dwarves' unarmed attacks all follow the Wrestling skill, but I still get immigrants with kicker/biter/striker skills too. I don't think you can restrict that per se.

Dwarves never, ever, ever get any random Pikeman skills, so maybe it's just about what weapons they are physically able to use? Restricting crossbows into massive hand ballista contraptions that only the brawnier races can use might work, if it's just vulp skills that are bothering you.

[AceSV]

Okay, I tried my hand at Lagomers, you can download them from the share folder:  https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B5_Jm8L6GFwcfnRvc19IczQzb1lleVVVWENURlVlSFVxV1VQeGp6bFlWYXVuRC1jVC1LT2c&usp=sharing

Unfortunately, I can't actually define the rabbit-people as herbivores or stop them from eating meat.  They are ethically opposed to the killing of animals, but you can still build Butcher shops and mark animals for butchering, and you can start with meat or butchery skill at embark.  I'll have to see what happens if you do this, since killing an animal is supposedly punishable by exile.  Ordering squads to kill wild cave animals doesn't seem to result in exile, though this may be because they become "enemies" instead. 

Oh right, native Lagom weapons:
Staff - Same as the Vulps' staff.  Omit this is you copy both into your weapons file. 
Tuck Sword - An extra long sword with no blade but a sharp tip.  Comparable in size to the Long Sword.
Black Bill - A beefed up axe capable of stabbing.
Forest Bill - Larger version on a longer pole.  Uses the Pike Skill. 
Long Bow - Twice the size of a bow, 1.5x the SHOOT_FORCE.  I'm not sure how that will work, since I don't know if size has an impact on ranged weapons like it does on melee weapons or if SHOOT_FORCE is the token to approach. 

[scamtank]

The [USE_ANIMAL_PRODUCTS] tag handles all the meat-havery. There's no way to to designate a civ as a vegetarian, it's either full-on-fuck-you-vegan or paving the roads with lamb skulls. No intermediate setting.

Also, SHOOT_FORCE is the one you want to adjust. The size of the bow only matters when you're dragging it along or pounding someone's head in with it.

[AceSV]

Yeah, it became apparent quickly that an herbivorous civilization would be yet another mechanic that mods are not equipped to handle. 

So, I'm not sure what's going on with this, but my Lagomer squad never equipped wooden staffs when going into combat.  Fun times, I decided to go straight for the magma, so the first weapons grade metal I dug up was adamantine.  At first I thought the wooden staffs were too heavy, but they have no trouble equipping adamantine black bills.  In Arena mode, Lagomers had no trouble equipping iron staffs or forest bills, so I don't know what's going on. 

The Tuck proved to be a pretty nasty weapon in Arena mode.  If it hits, it does gruesome damage.  I tested a Vulp with iron Katana against a Lagomer with iron Tuck, both with iron buckler, helm, mail and greaves.  The katana started off causing numerous injuries to the Lagomer, including a blow to the hand that severed the nerves and forced her to drop her buckler, while the Tuck never got close to any soft parts on the vulp.  For a looooong time neither weapon managed to land any killing or dismembering blows.  The Lagomer collapsed from exhaustion a few times while the Vulp fruitlessly slashed at the armor achieving nothing.  Then out of nowhere, the Tuck landed a hit to the vulps arm, severing it, and the Vulp bled out before she could strike back. 


UPDATE:  For fun, I decided to remove the [USE_ANIMAL_PRODUCTS] token and I can't tell any difference.  They still fish, hunt, butcher, milk, etc.  I think what I will do then is just let them have the same industries as omnivores and see how that goes.  This makes me suspect that the carnivore races may have similar problems.  Komodos are next, we'll see how it goes. 

[Grimlocke]

The only way to make metal-using entities use wooden weapons (if this is what you were going for with the staffs) that I know of is to make it a tool with [TOOL_USE:MEAT_SLICING], [TOOL_USE:MEAT_BONING] or [TOOL_USE:MEAT_CARVING]. Civilians characters carry these around, which seems like a sensible way for staffs to be used to me.

Spoiler: here's an example from my mod: (click to show/hide)

[ITEM_TOOL:ITEM_TOOL_MACE_SHILLELAGH]
   [NAME:shillelagh:shillelaghs]
   [VALUE:12]
   [WOOD_MAT]
   [TILE:'/']
   [TOOL_USE:MEAT_CARVING]
   [SIZE:2500]
   [SKILL:MACE]
   [TWO_HANDED:145000]
   [MINIMUM_SIZE:42500]
   [MATERIAL_SIZE:5]
   [ATTACK:EDGE:50:0:bash:bashes:NO_SUB:2900]58
      [ATTACK_PREPARE_AND_RECOVER:3:3]
   [ATTACK:BLUNT:50:0:prod:prods:NO_SUB:2250]45
      [ATTACK_PREPARE_AND_RECOVER:3:3]
   [ATTACK:BLUNT:35:0:strike:strikes:butt:1750]50
      [ATTACK_PREPARE_AND_RECOVER:5:1]

You can add the other two tags if you want to increase the frequency of their use.

Also you may want to keep stabbing attack contact surface between 8 and 18. 8 seems to be the minimum the game can process right, 18 is 10% less then the size of a dwarf's hand. Any larger sizes cause that weird 'stabbing arms off' thing.

For general reference: an average dwarf's hand has a contact surface of 20, an average human has an upper body with contact area of 117. Stab attacks with 500 surface area could potentially bisect a horse in one stab, which might not be desirable.

Also 'tuck sword' is a bit funny, a bit like 'halberd polearm'. Just 'tuck' would suffice. Though adding 'sword' does make it easier to see what the item is.


For general reference on weapons balance you can check out this mod: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=147241.0 which rebalances the vanilla weapons to make more sense, or mine which overhauls just about everything involving combat (mine won't be drop-in compatible with the vanilla game though).

[AceSV]

I'll have to think about setting the wooden weapons as tools.  That's not really the flavor I was going for and it still doesn't allow military dwarves to bring them into battle, which is what I really wanted.  The staff is supposed to be a cheaper weaker alternative to metal weapons. 

I called it a Tuck Sword because I didn't think most people would recognize the word Tuck, and I know people are already going to say "a what?" when they look at black bills and forest bills.  Speaking of which, I might change those to Billhook and Longbill or Billglaive. 

Thanks for the stabbing info, I thought the numbers were just ratios against each other, didn't realize they were actually related to creature size.  Good to know. 



I played around with the Lagomers a bit more and found that the animal products and job restrictions are locked at embark, but if you load one of the LNP's preset embark set ups, any meats or tanning skills that were saved will be loaded in no problem.  So basically, your civilization would spring into existence with no knowledge of animal products, but as soon as the player constructs a fortress, you can have them hunt and milk and so forth with no penalty as far as I can tell.  The Lagomer civ should still refuse trading with you if you offer animal products, live the elf civ does if you trade wood, but I haven't actually seen that in action. 

Not sure how I want to deal with that yet.