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Author Topic: Weapon Balancing?  (Read 899 times)

SenorMeltyface

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Weapon Balancing?
« on: February 23, 2015, 03:16:14 pm »

I've made some new weapons, and I was wondering if anyone knows how to rebalance them so that people who are hit with them stay conscious longer (i.e. less pain), but die quicker.

It seems from arena mode testing that any humanoid hit with them gives in to the pain after only one or two hits, but takes many (in excess of 20) to kill. This obviously does not lead to exciting gameplay.

Help would be greatly appreciated.
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Sver

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Re: Weapon Balancing?
« Reply #1 on: February 23, 2015, 04:36:32 pm »

In my opinion, it's more like the problem of DF combat system itself. AI hits enemys bodyparts quite randomly and never misses if the target is disabled (given into pain, for example). The result is a lot of succesful blows in different bodyparts, right until the one in the head/neck. Other wounds are also essential, of course, but they require some time to take effect. So, the problem is that creature cannot die from the pain shock. Just that.
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vjmdhzgr

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Re: Weapon Balancing?
« Reply #2 on: February 23, 2015, 07:32:12 pm »

In my opinion, it's more like the problem of DF combat system itself. AI hits enemys bodyparts quite randomly and never misses if the target is disabled (given into pain, for example). The result is a lot of succesful blows in different bodyparts, right until the one in the head/neck. Other wounds are also essential, of course, but they require some time to take effect. So, the problem is that creature cannot die from the pain shock. Just that.
If the target is unconscious the AI alwasy goes for the head, so the problem isn't randomness it's that the weapon isn't strong enough to break the skull or sever the head.
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Sver

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Re: Weapon Balancing?
« Reply #3 on: February 24, 2015, 04:38:32 pm »

In my opinion, it's more like the problem of DF combat system itself. AI hits enemys bodyparts quite randomly and never misses if the target is disabled (given into pain, for example). The result is a lot of succesful blows in different bodyparts, right until the one in the head/neck. Other wounds are also essential, of course, but they require some time to take effect. So, the problem is that creature cannot die from the pain shock. Just that.
If the target is unconscious the AI alwasy goes for the head, so the problem isn't randomness it's that the weapon isn't strong enough to break the skull or sever the head.
"Gives into pain" is not the same as "Unconcious". But I can't really try to argue there, because the author doesn't show any combat log as an example.
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Grimlocke

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Re: Weapon Balancing?
« Reply #4 on: February 24, 2015, 05:44:36 pm »

DF characters seem to have a complete lack of adrenaline, which is probably your main problem. My mod has an interaction that serves as makeshift adrenaline, keeping creatures fighting until they are safe and free to pass out.

Beside that you haven't posted any raws so there is not much I can do for you there.
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vjmdhzgr

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Re: Weapon Balancing?
« Reply #5 on: February 24, 2015, 08:41:38 pm »

In my opinion, it's more like the problem of DF combat system itself. AI hits enemys bodyparts quite randomly and never misses if the target is disabled (given into pain, for example). The result is a lot of succesful blows in different bodyparts, right until the one in the head/neck. Other wounds are also essential, of course, but they require some time to take effect. So, the problem is that creature cannot die from the pain shock. Just that.
If the target is unconscious the AI alwasy goes for the head, so the problem isn't randomness it's that the weapon isn't strong enough to break the skull or sever the head.
"Gives into pain" is not the same as "Unconcious". But I can't really try to argue there, because the author doesn't show any combat log as an example.
If you cuase an enemy to give into pain then look at them at the top of their inventory it will say unconscious. I personally only realized recently that giving into pain might not mean actually unconscious, but the game definitely treats it as such.
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Max™

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Re: Weapon Balancing?
« Reply #6 on: February 24, 2015, 11:52:52 pm »

Yeah, would kinda make sense for pain to give stages, winded, stunned, unconscious, or something like that from "having the breath knocked out of you", "stars flashing before your eyes", to finally "blacking out in agony" rather than just "a-ok" *stubs toe, fracturing it* "OH DAMN, GOODNIGHT FOLKS" *thud* as it is now.
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vjmdhzgr

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Re: Weapon Balancing?
« Reply #7 on: February 25, 2015, 12:18:46 am »

Yeah, would kinda make sense for pain to give stages, winded, stunned, unconscious, or something like that from "having the breath knocked out of you", "stars flashing before your eyes", to finally "blacking out in agony" rather than just "a-ok" *stubs toe, fracturing it* "OH DAMN, GOODNIGHT FOLKS" *thud* as it is now.
There kind of are stages, just most of the time they're not noticeable because giving into pain happens too easily. Those pain and extreme pain statuses do have actual effects. Many times I've had competent adventurers get brought to extreme pain and have them suddenyl completely lose all ability to hit anything.
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