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[gnome]

Excellent, this sounds like a lot of fun. The combined forces of learnable magical knowledge and now unique magical items adds a lot more incentive to explore and loot places, and I like that a lot. Not to mention it serves a lot of unexpected surprises like a goblin bandit who is randomly able to throw lightning bolts.

[Eric Blank]

Getting them to have effects naturally at random has been a huge problem actually. At the moment the general population just doesnt have any powers available. Only historical figures under specific circumstances will, as a matter of fact. I kinda like that because it keeps the magic level toned down a bit, but i do want to be able to change that

The enchantmemts can be better distributed though. It gets a little crazy actually, because these things are available to everyone. So working on the balance.

[gnome]

I've noticed a lot of the wizards die off and then goblins or kobolds will take over their towers, but don't continue to write (perhaps because they aren't literate). I found one that had three or so wizard corpses being used as ritual sacrifice - they didn't have any blood but I found a workaround - butchering apparently leaves blood on your weapon perhaps even if the corpse is empty of blood. So I licked it off my blade and was granted instant wizardom. So at least it's still possible to become one even if there aren't many wizards around. Most commonly I find summoner towers.


I agree though I actually kind of like having it be a bit sparse.

[Eric Blank]

I think summoners and necromancers are the only ones that can build towers right now actually. Nobody else can raise undead to serve them at the moment, i removed most of those in lieu of working out better ones for them

[gnome]

Ahhh gotcha - do wizards then decide to occupy abandoned ones?

[Eric Blank]

Ive never seen that happen before, no. From what I know everyone that resides in a tower was an apprentice to one of the previous residents. Secret-bearers who cant raise the dead typically become bandits living in camps if they dont stay in their civ and store their slab in a site, which I've never been able to find I think thats just broken if there isnt a library in the site. you can get quests to kill them, and usually theyre carrying the slab and/or other books on their person. At least that's what I usually find.

[gnome]

Ive never seen that happen before, no. From what I know everyone that resides in a tower was an apprentice to one of the previous residents. Secret-bearers who cant raise the dead typically become bandits living in camps if they dont stay in their civ and store their slab in a site, which I've never been able to find I think thats just broken if there isnt a library in the site. you can get quests to kill them, and usually theyre carrying the slab and/or other books on their person. At least that's what I usually find.

Yeah typically I try to kill them but a lot of the time they turn me into a kobold, didn't think to check their person though after the fact. I'll check out their inventory next time I'm in one of those.

[Eric Blank]

I'm working on doing the little bit necessary to update this for the newest version (it practically works fine right now)

Enchantments might not be available though, it's proven quite difficult to create something useful and actually balance it. But the polymorphy school is done. Still no luck on a post-transformation sickness, so that will be scrapped for the moment as well.

[hertggf]

In my adventure (44.02 + this + adventurecraft + random raw scripts) I have some pretty weird stuff going on.  Most of the towers were made by nature summoners and are full of "ritual"s instead of zombies. One nature summoner created 21 different groups, 9 of which built towers.  The rituals start suffocating immediately upon loading the tower, because 90% are missing lungs and rituals do not have the NOBREATHE tag.  One sorcerer made about 35 (I lost count) groups, but only one of those built a tower (the rest of the groups are described as nomadic).  Some HFs who gain the secret goal of immortality are moving to these towers, but they are not being taught any  secrets.  In towers where there are actual zombies with the opposed_to_life tag these would-be apprentice tower residents are attacked and killed by zombies as soon as the tower loads into view.

[Eric Blank]

Ok, i know about the rituals thing, i actually did that intentionally; its a two step process where first a ritual is created/performed, and then after that dies a creature can be summoned from it. That isnt final by any means, but it does serve a purpose; since the rituals are immobile, harmless and will quickly suffocate they arent a huge threat to the player, which is important because the creatures summoners actually "summon" have magical powers and attacks of their own. Imagine walking into a fire summoners tower and being pelted by hundreds of fireballs simultaneously. Not a chance in hell youd survive even if you were a legendary dodger and shield user wearing full coverage armor and nothing flammable; something would get through just because the rng hates you today. So once they start suffocating the summoners can create a smaller number of summoned creatures that pose a challenge (i at least get killed by them all the damn time) but arent overwhelming. They also come in unique castes which prevents summoners of one type (fire) from stealing corpses already in the ritual stage that would have been used by their respective summoner (wind, say)

Ive never heard of one secret-bearer making multiple groups before so maybe thats a thing in the new version? I certainly didnt notice that but ill have to check legends mode on my saves again. I know a deity can create new slabs for new worshippers whenever, but it sounds like you mean the same mortal people having multiple apprentices. And yes, some of them never get the chance to build a tower, because they start out in a camp and have to collect so many corpses from worldgen battles and graveyards (i think?) before the game gives them a tower and in particularly peaceful and small civs that might never happen. And not all of my secrets have raising interactions that even allow that, so theyll probably sit in their camp or stuff their slab in a library at a town or something.

Some of them not gaining the secret is probably a bug, i have no idea how that could happen but ill try to find out.

Update imminent, at least. Polymorphy is working well enough

[hertggf]

OK that makes sense about the rituals.  I guess it just seemed like a glitch because none of the tower dwellers had been properly apprenticed so they couldn't cast spells on the dead rituals. Next time I'm at a tower I'll give the tower dwellers secrets manually and see how that works.

A couple more things: even though I copied that block of text into the human and dwarf entities, there are no aether focuses showing up anywhere.  I even made a script to look for them in world.items.all and there is not a single one in any site I've been to.  Athames are being generated correctly though.  Maybe bad luck on my part since warehouses only infrequently contain tools.  Maybe it would be better to make the aether focuses a type of jewelry?
The stoneskin spell currently has the speed reduction CE set to be permanent.
There are a bunch of instances of "spirit" being typoed "spirirt" across several files.

Anyway I'm really enjoying this mod, and looking forward to the update!

[Eric Blank]

Thanks for finding the little mistakes too! Now i can fix them.

Ill double check to make sure the entity raws matches the tool ID too, that could be the problem

[hertggf]

A couple more observations... The first is brief: the animal sphere SECRETs are not being used at all.  I assume DF is silently choking on the two-target sex-split interactions you're supplying to it.

Second, it appears that when two SECRETs share the same sphere, the game only uses the IS_NAME label from the last one defined. This bit of lua code demonstrates this:

Code: [Select]

for _,v in pairs(world.artifacts.all) do if (getmetatable(v.item) == 'item_slabst' and v.item.engraving_type == 6) then print(_,v.item.description,world.raws.interactions[v.item.topic].name);end;end

Here's the output from one world:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Code: [Select]

4       The secrets of healing magic    SECRET_HEALING_MAGIC
5       The secrets of fate and resurrection    SECRET_FATE_MAGIC
7       The secrets of life and death   SECRET_24
8       The secrets of summoning elementals of the winds        SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_WIND_SUMMONER
9       The secret powers of the vampire hunter SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_SUN
10      The secret of summoning elementals of metal     SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_METALS_SUMMONER
12      The secrets of granting intelligence    SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_WISDOM
13      The secrets of the beast warrior        SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_NATURE_SUMMONING
14      The secret powers of the vampire hunter SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_SUN
15      The secrets of healing magic    SECRET_HEALING_MAGIC
16      The secrets of summoning elementals of the winds        SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_WIND
19      The secrets of summoning elementals of the winds        SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_WIND
20      The secrets of life and death   SECRET_34
21      The secrets of the beast warrior        SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_NATURE_WARRIOR
22      The secrets of healing magic    SECRET_HEALING_MAGIC
24      The secret powers of the vampire hunter SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_SUN
26      The secret gift of speech and persuasion        SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_SPEECH
27      The secret to silence others    SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_SILENCE
29      The secrets of life and death   SECRET_12
30      The secrets of granting intelligence    SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_WISDOM
32      The secret strength of the depraved     SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_DEPRAVITY
38      The secret to silence others    SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_SILENCE
40      The secrets of causing nightmares       SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_NIGHTMARES
44      The secrets of enthralling others to your will  SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_THRALLDOM
47      The secrets of life and death   SECRET_70
49      The secrets of summoning elementals of the water        SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_WATER_SUMMONER
52      The secret powers of the vampire hunter SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_SUN
57      The secrets of summoning elementals of the water        SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_WATER_SUMMONER
59      The secrets of thunder as a magical weapon      SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_THUNDER
65      The secrets of thunder as a magical weapon      SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_LIGHTNING
69      The secrets of stone as a magical weapon        SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_EARTH
74      The secrets of healing magic    SECRET_HEALING_MAGIC
79      The secrets of healing magic    SECRET_HEALING_MAGIC
130     The secrets of summoning elementals of the winds        SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_WIND_SUMMONER
146     The secrets of the beast warrior        SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_NATURE_WARRIOR
151     The secrets of healing magic    SECRET_HEALING_MAGIC
166     The secrets of lightning as a magical weapon    SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_LIGHTNING
194     The secrets of summoning elementals of the water        SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_WATER
501     The secrets of stone as a magical weapon        SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_EARTH_SUMMONER
1158    The magic of the underground    SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_CAVERNS
1265    The secrets of summoning fire   SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_FIRE
1354    The secrets of the beast warrior        SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_NATURE_SUMMONING
1880    The secrets of lightning as a magical weapon    SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_LIGHTNING
2717    The secrets of summoning fire   SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_FIRE_SUMMONER
3665    The secrets of life and death   SECRET_11
7536    The secret strength of the depraved     SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_DEPRAVITY
9964    The secrets of enthralling others to your will  SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_THRALLDOM
9979    The secrets of the beast warrior        SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_NATURE_WARRIOR
16216   The secrets of granting intelligence    SPELLCRAFTS_SECRET_SPHERE_WISDOM


For example both NATURE_WARRIOR and NATURE_SUMMONING are being labeled "beast warrior", same with all of the other secrets that share a sphere.* I think this is Toady's bug because the interactions are otherwise being applied in the way you seem to have expected.

*Anomalously, the lightning secret is sometimes labeled lightning and other times labeled as thunder...and those secrets don't even share a sphere 

[Eric Blank]

Thats interesting. Ill see what i can do about that

Okay, I've fixed what I can of the issues you pointed out. Animals secrets now only have one target and one effect, combining the options for transforming into males or females of a species. They need fleshed out more, like everything else. I didn't do anything about the name issue and cant figure out what's up with the lightning/thunder secrets either.
I havent switched the aether focuses and the new beast runes to a clothing item or anything, though I might in the future if youre still having issue. I know ive found them before in loot from bandits, night creatures etc. so they should be showing up.
And I cant even confirm what's up with apprentices not getting their secrets let alone do anything about it. Still very much working on spotting them. If you can upload a save where youve seen it happen and tell me who and where they are (I dont use DFHack and frankly i'm terrible with it) maybe that would give me an idea where to start. The closest I've gotten is a tower full of zombies but no necromancer or books/slab. Other towers in the area had their necromancers and nothing unusual going on.

I've uploaded the new version with the polymorphy school. There's a whole bunch of sub-categories of creatures you can transform into. Enchantments havent made it in because they're a massive bitch to balance still and the polymorphy sickness is so unreliable that although it's there in the non-polymorphy schools you'll probably only see the attributes/speed reduction in-game. But if by some miracle it decides to work and you get sick then have fun with that... Shouldnt be too fatal.

New version is here as usual.

[gnome]

I'll try it out! Thanks, Eric.


So far I am running into a consistency of all meadhalls being dominated by sorcerers or tower wizards, I've not run into any lords yet at all. I'll keep exploring though and try out another world generation to see if I get any different results.