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[NullForceOmega]

I have never, ever seen a Dungeons and Dragons title that ever included the abstract concept of levels in it (but then I rarely read the novels, as most are drivel.  And while I watched the first movie, I wrote the rest off as the same kind of mindlessness.)

The alignment axis exists as a method of determining where in the greater cosmological spectrum of the game setting your characters' actions lands them.  There are entities of absolute good, neutrality, and evil in this universe, and while mortals aren't those beings, their actions align them towards one of the three forces.  A deity of good is very unlikely to resurrect (or even aid) an evil character (without substantial cause), and the same is true of an evil deity.  Likewise, a creature of good alignment (as in one that is predisposed to good upon birth, like a unicorn) may even instinctually attack a being of an opposed alignment.

It isn't an arbitrary mechanic.

It isn't an absolute rule.

It is a method for the DM to use regarding the characters place in the universe.  If the PCs start off good and are on a mission to complete some greater deed that benefits the powers of good, they can expect to receive reasonable aid in that task from said good entities, but if their actions along the path show substantial deviation from 'Good', and begin the veer into Neutral or Evil territory, that aid is going to dry up very quickly, and they may find themselves actively opposed by the forces of good.

[Sergius]

It's a crutch. Even D&D deities have their own spheres of influence. Like trade or hunt or sickness. It would make way more sense that each of these deities would reward behaviors that favored their own, rather than some nebulous Nice vs Icky axis just to help people know that they aren't supposed to like those deities and people that are Icky.

[NullForceOmega]

Only in the Forgotten Realms, and I leave those exactly where they belong, forgotten.  All other settings (like there are oh so many of them) just use the evil-good, chaos-law system.  Not liking the system does not equate to it being bad, unusable, unworkable, or wrong.  It just means you don't like it.  I've been using it for twenty years, and I have no issues with it.

[Sergius]

Having no issues with it doesn't equate to it being good or workable, or right. It just mean you don't dislike it.

It's a quite backwards system that fails to convey anything that is found in reality, in favor of fairy-tale morality or values. People only start having issues with those when they start trying to figuring out the alignment of people that are less clear cut, that may act for the greater good but do it via "evil" actions. It's fine if you're always going to play the goody-two-shoes mighty hero trying to defeat the evil forces of darkness and undead and demons and devils and hell and other things with horns and bad breath (or, even introduce a "twist" and play the evil side). Otherwise, everybody's Neutral and there's no point to any of it.

It's also unnecessary, used to keep score of who's "roleplaying right", because killing the innocent Dominated blacksmith in self defense was an evil... wait, no, good action. Or... it wasn't evil, but it was not-good. Or something silly like that. Or it gets ignored completely until someone has to cast Circle of Protection, in which case it's the DM's job to keep track of all the actions to determine if the PCs get alignment shifts, which won't get roleplayed anyway.

And IF it gets roleplayed, it means trying to figure out if something's Good-approved before doing it instead of trying to figure out "how would my hero react to X" or try to do something heroic. Then it turns out Heroic is good, so that bloodthirsty Orc Warmonger that jumped across the lava chasm to save his loved ones just got too many shifts towards Good and now suddenly his Anti-Paladin minions get the urge to eviscerate him.

In the end, it's just an excuse to go attack the Evil mastermind just because he's probably up to no Good, and slaughter whole tribes of goblins without having to think too much about it.

[NullForceOmega]

You know what, I'm just gonna leave it.  You're entirely too wrapped up in your opinion of it and I am never going to agree with you.

[Sergius]

You know what, I'm just gonna leave it.  You're entirely too wrapped up in your opinion of it and I am never going to agree with you.

Projection.

[Sergius]

You don't like my stance on grey morality?  Fuck you.  I think grey morality is a bullshit excuse for people who are afraid to do the right or wrong thing. Your assertions regarding alignment keep coming back to the same bullshit argument that alignment can be used to justify evil deeds, and I reject that argument, as any DM worth a fuck would never allow it.  Your bad RP experiences are just a worthless as a gauge as my good experiences.  I am done with this fucking shithole argument, and I am done with you.

Well, that explains a lot.

[GiglameshDespair]

Is that from a pm? If so, just report it to Toady. He's sent similar things to me and others.

[Bauglir]

Dude, if he sent it to you in PM, he was at least being reasonable enough to take it out of this thread. Which is a damn sight more mature about this whole thing than you're being by dragging it back in. Clear it out of your post and, if you really think it's out of line, send a report to the Toad. You're not going to win public opinion points this way.

EDIT: On further reflection, I agree that it definitely was out of line for him to send that PM, and I'd spend more time criticizing him for it if I thought it would make a difference.

[Sergius]

It's completely on-topic, in fact it was on-topic stuff that was dragged into my Personal Inbox Space, which isn't a safe-haven for personal attacks. I'm putting it back to where it belongs, in the thread about Alignments.
Also I'm not running for office so I don't know what you're on about public opinion points. Where am I in the polls?

FAKEDIT: Ninja'd by EDIT, but my point stands. Which I forgot what it was. Something about you thinking that trolling my inbox was reasonable and mature.

Anyway, this is all very exhausting. Back to Topic?

[highmax28]

I'm playing a 5e game and SOMEHOW, the neutral characters have committed more evil acts than my evil character. In fact, I'm pretty sure in order to keep his alignment a secret since he's manipulative, he's done more good things than bad (or made it seem that way). Its strange how neutral characters always pull off the stupidest shit and get away with it because they're neutral

[Neonivek]

I kind of wish the evil deities weren't super evil most of the time.

You could count the number of evil deities who actually help their followers, as opposed to making short/long term deals for an eternity torturing them, on one hand.

Tiamat and... uhhh... well that is it. Tiamat is the only evil God or Goddess... Who is evil (In fact she is probably one of the few "Of evil" deities) but who actually cares for her followers to some degree.

It just hurts the whole "Why do they keep getting followers?"

[Sergius]

Well, sometimes alignments make no sense even by their own standards. Like: Drow are Chaotic Evil. They live in this highly ordered and hierarchic society with social castes and all that crap, they have laws up the wazoo and it's very tightly controlled. But they are Chaotic, because they like to spread chaos or something...? Their deity is Chaotic Evil, which would mean something like evil for its sake, or manifestations of anger or something. But Lolth is actually a fallen goddess, with a clear agenda. She probably owns a trapper keeper with a long list of all the evil she's planning to do. Yet, she's Chaotic Evil, because she likes chaos or manages chaos or represents chaos or whatever. Yet she doesn't act "Chaotic" at all. So she's "Team Chaotic" just because she has a membership card.

I mean, she doesn't care for her followers but makes deals with them a lot and apparently respects those deals to some extent, otherwise she wouldn't have a huge underground society willing to keep making deals with her.

And apparently chosing to ignore gods in FR is worse than worshipping evil ones because... you go to some purgatory? Or become nonexistential or something, which is worse than getting tortured forever by demons for some reason. Wait, NVM, actually worshippers become servants of their deities and get level ups after death if they keep being specially helpful. Only the Faithless get dissolved into a moss-covered wall as punishment, regardless of if they're Good or Evil. Another thing that made Character Alignment even more pointless

[Twinwolf]

I'm playing a 5e game and SOMEHOW, the neutral characters have committed more evil acts than my evil character. In fact, I'm pretty sure in order to keep his alignment a secret since he's manipulative, he's done more good things than bad (or made it seem that way). Its strange how neutral characters always pull off the stupidest shit and get away with it because they're neutral

Maya hasn't done much bad since the game started, besides steal stolen property back from rich people, which is technically against the law.

[GiglameshDespair]

I also assumed it was because the Drow were constantly betraying and scheming and all that.
In pretty much every group there's going to be tiers - slaves and the other dregs, ordinary, big cheeses.

Lolth encourages her disciples to scheme and betray each other. There's lots of rules, but if you can break them without getting caught she encourages her minions to do so. She'll only intervene if it's a scheme that actually threatens drow society as a whole.