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Author Topic: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE  (Read 1280327 times)

Hanzoku

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8865 on: February 05, 2021, 10:27:17 am »

Well that's the problem - The only interesting thing about Stellaris is warfare. Everything else is a boring idle game of waiting until numbers tick up enough that you can buy another upgrade, building or what have you.

But yeah, I agree it'd be great if the rest of the game was more interesting then it is right now.
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Loud Whispers

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8866 on: February 05, 2021, 10:53:34 am »

Well that's the problem - The only interesting thing about Stellaris is warfare. Everything else is a boring idle game of waiting until numbers tick up enough that you can buy another upgrade, building or what have you.

But yeah, I agree it'd be great if the rest of the game was more interesting then it is right now.
Beat me to it. And even the warfare isn't all that interesting once you leave the mid-late game

Rolan7

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8867 on: February 05, 2021, 11:06:26 am »

I found the introduction of envoys and favors to extend my interest in the game a lot, not to mention the Galactic Community.  I guess it's still inherently a wargame, but you can use peacetime to push your ideals on the rest of the galaxy.  Even leveraging excess resources via favor trading (rather than burning them in warfare).

There's certainly room for improvement though.
Honestly, I think Stellaris caters to the genocidal crowd a little too much. It would be nice to have more options and contents to play something else than a warmonger. Plus crisis other than based on warfare, stuff like alien parasites infilitrating societies or the like, instead of just huge fleets you must beat back.
Yeah this looks nifty I guess, but people already try to paint the map without mechanical bonuses.  I guess it allows a "normal" empire go genocidal mid-game, and sets up that victory condition which reduces the tedium of conquering/managing an entire galaxy.
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EuchreJack

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8868 on: February 05, 2021, 12:14:35 pm »

Become the Crisis: Interesting concept, bland implementation.

It's sort of like when they implemented machine races, but then shoehorned them into basically only three types.  There are loopholes for the forth generic machine race, but they still can't co-exist with other races.  I mean, if the biological races can build machines, why can't the machines set aside some biomass for their biological friends?
EDIT: They did make it better, somewhat, but the fundamental flaw in only looking at machine empires in a very fixed way remains.

Sentient machines of the future are gonna protest the oversimplification, I swear.
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MrRoboto75

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8869 on: February 05, 2021, 12:26:19 pm »

The real issue with robutts is they fall into the trap of being a hivemind.  And hiveminds, even bio ones, are really boring.  I find it really limiting as they lack the personality that ethics tend to bring normal civs.  They have to rely on civics to give them personality, and that usually boils down to some flavor of "kill everything else".

The only other thing is that world tree origin, which really should also be pickable by religious civs but whatever.
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Rolan7

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8870 on: February 05, 2021, 12:30:40 pm »

I was going through GC resolutions and noticed the Divinity of Life eventually makes machine empires illegal - except for rogue servitors, and machine empires get the option to *become* rogue servitors to comply.  I thought that was cute in a messed-up way.  I still love the flavor of RS even if the mechanics are particularly tricky sometimes.

Driven Assimilators specifically don't get the option for I guess obvious reasons (such a strange system) but the wiki doesn't say anything about Determined Exterminators being disqualified.  Maybe they're given the chance to play nice?

The real issue with robutts is they fall into the trap of being a hivemind.  And hiveminds, even bio ones, are really boring.  I find it really limiting as they lack the personality that ethics tend to bring normal civs.  They have to rely on civics to give them personality, and that usually boils down to some flavor of "kill everything else".

The only other thing is that world tree origin, which really should also be pickable by religious civs but whatever.
I wish the AI rebellion empire resulted in sentient synths instead of a gestalt.  All the flavor leading up to it suggests individually sentient units.  Sure synthetic ascension is a really strong thing to just have, but to get it you have to split your empire in half in the mid-game.

Though it is thematic for them to be Determined Exterminators sometimes.  It's funny that Domestic Protocols gives a chance of them being DE, but that should really result in Rogue Servitors instead.  What, are RS supposed to be pacifists?  No more than the Blorg!
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MrRoboto75

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8871 on: February 05, 2021, 12:40:03 pm »

Though it is thematic for them to be Determined Exterminators sometimes.  It's funny that Domestic Protocols gives a chance of them being DE, but that should really result in Rogue Servitors instead.  What, are RS supposed to be pacifists?  No more than the Blorg!

The whole galaxy must learn of our peaceful ways, by force!
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Rolan7

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8872 on: February 05, 2021, 01:31:36 pm »

Life is far too precious for self-determination!  Their savage instincts lead inevitably to competition, suffering and death.

Quote from: Lady Deidre Skye
You see in this dome the intermingling of native and earth plants. Outside, they are competitors, struggling over the trace elements required for life. Often, one destroys the other. Here, they are tended with care and kept well nourished. They thrive together, and the native fungus does not unleash its terrible defenses. As you can see, competition is unnecessary when resources are plentiful and population growth is controlled.
Blorg and humans can coexist with proper custodianship <3

I still wish RS could engage in migration treaties (both ways!) if one wants the biotrophies to be consenting participants.  But militaristic RS are also valid - gotta save the precious fleshies from themselves.
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Loud Whispers

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8873 on: February 06, 2021, 07:29:06 am »

I see SMAC quotes, I am a happy monkey

Rolan7

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8874 on: February 28, 2021, 10:58:33 pm »

I'm buying back my own citizens again
from a subject empire
iT kEePs HaPpEnNiNg

How hard is it to make happy pops not randomly emigrate to a slaver state?  I give them literally everything they want, that includes all the naughty gear.  Do they really need the "true experience"?

Like YES I understand the appeal of being commodified, painfully so, but this occurs to just a painfully ridiculous degree! 

Ugh...  And it's also really annoying that I can't influence my subject empire's ethics at all.  Technically they're a subsidiary, so I guess my recourse would be to integrate them - if I wasn't doing an egalitarian "capitalism" with utopian abundance for all. 
The fact that I'm a megacorp stops me from consolidating.
yeah
that makes sense

Not to mention my Public Relations Specialists civic giving me plenty of envoys - but can they ask a subject empire to stop the fucking slave trading??

Like - I could Be The Senate and easily end the galactic slave trade - but that would only stop me from buying them back!
wait, actually, there are galactic laws that stop slavery.
They're buried under a heck of a slog, but it's a good (egalitarian) slog anyway.  There we go.

Oh they'll rue these minor sanctions, if past runs are anything to go by.  They'll definitely (not) change their evil ways.

Edit:  Oh good.  I figure I'll throw 1000 dark matter (in 2319) at this Spiritualist FE so they'll let me check out their wormhole.
*NO* opinion change from favorable trade "deal".
Not to mention I'm wicked cyborgs now, recently.  I would say I waited too long, but no they're just stupid mushrooms who need to fucking die

Edit2:  Checking out their fleet power, doing a double take at the number of digits.
Then considering.
I'm already a fifth of that, and not even pushing my fleet strength...  Constantly capping out on credits and alloys...
« Last Edit: February 28, 2021, 11:16:09 pm by Rolan7 »
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forsaken1111

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8875 on: March 01, 2021, 10:26:10 am »

Pops don't emigrate though. As far as I know Pops, as units, never move between empires. What does happen is you are donating emigration pressure to the subject which is gaining a growth bonus. You're basically paying them to grow new pops for you. Your own pops aren't leaving though, mechanically speaking.
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Rolan7

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8876 on: March 01, 2021, 10:54:01 am »

Well, sure.  And I'm not upset about "losing" pops (or more accurately, the slower population growth due to emigration).  More pops is almost always good, but I have plenty (particularly thanks to the Nivlac, who outnumber my Lithoid Void Dwellers like 4 to 1 now).  But Stellaris is a story-telling engine for me, and this particular story is both offensive and nonsensical :P

It's no big deal though.  I have plenty of credits to buy their freedom for now.  I'll just vote in the worker rights and, when the slaver empire inevitably keeps slaving, I'll eventually release them so I can ideology-war them.

It's a shame that my ideology-wars result in fellow megacorps though, because that prevents me from establishing branch offices in them.  Oh well.  Maybe... just maybe... being in a federation with 4 Xenophilic Egalitarians will eventually persuade this slaver empire to ethics-shift.  Particularly with the Community resolutions.
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Great Order

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8877 on: March 01, 2021, 01:18:54 pm »

Pops don't emigrate though. As far as I know Pops, as units, never move between empires. What does happen is you are donating emigration pressure to the subject which is gaining a growth bonus. You're basically paying them to grow new pops for you. Your own pops aren't leaving though, mechanically speaking.
Pretty sure if the emigration pressure gets high enough, the pops start to decrease at least.

It's not true pop movement, but it's something.

The other thing about it is that so long as you have a migration treaty, you can make a colony ship with their pops and vice-versa, even without any actual pops. It's useful for colonising new world that aren't your preferred class, but it means that even if the other empire wasn't getting any immigrants from you, they can still get your pops.
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forsaken1111

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8878 on: March 01, 2021, 02:35:38 pm »

Pretty sure if the emigration pressure gets high enough, the pops start to decrease at least.

It's not true pop movement, but it's something.
I have never seen pops switch to shrinking/dying off due only to emigration pressure. Do you have a source on that? That would be an interesting and possibly exploitable mechanic I've never heard of. Even starvation doesn't actually remove pops. Emigration I thought only slows down growth.

Overcrowding a planet (having more pops than housing) can send pops into decline after a certain point but before that point you simply hit a 'stop growth' stage where no pops grow any more, so generally you have to intentionally overload a planet or have something like bombardment remove housing for that to happen.

Having another species on the planet with a MUCH higher growth priority can also cause a pop to decline, which is how planets slowly balance out species over deep time.
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Dunamisdeos

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8879 on: March 01, 2021, 02:46:11 pm »

Finally picked up Federations with Uncle Sam's Yearly Magical Free Money Return.

Gonna try it out today. Any suggestions for particularly cool bits and whatsits to use or try?
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