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Author Topic: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE  (Read 1188614 times)

Dunamisdeos

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8280 on: November 19, 2019, 02:51:34 pm »

Which is kinda sad as it used to give you passive automatic (but very slow) ship repairs

I really liked this.

It would be nice to get that back as an edict. Do we have that as an edict? I use it for megastructures.
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Sartain

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8281 on: November 19, 2019, 06:42:25 pm »

In my experience smaller vassals have done more for me than entire federations. Which is to say they actually participate in the wars I get called into by the only two jerkoffs in the galaxy that share my ethics. They don't always accomplish anything but by god do they try.

"I may have been banging rocks together in a cave last week, but I'm taking this system's outpost with my three corvettes if it's the last thing I ev--"
*Fleet lost*

I guess, but unless they've upped the capability of the AI 1-system vassals will happily sit around for a 100 years tanking their own economy and not even expanding to available, neighboring systems. Which I suppose explains why they only have 3 corvettes...
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EnigmaticHat

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8282 on: November 19, 2019, 06:48:40 pm »

Has there ever been a situation where a human took control of a one system vassal and tried to develop them?  I'm wondering if its even possible...
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Dunamisdeos

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8283 on: November 19, 2019, 07:08:19 pm »

I mean I saw one where someone came back after the Big Bad Shroud Event happened, with their one planet and all.

So yeah, it should be possible, if very, very time-consuming.
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Sentient Bowtie

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8284 on: November 20, 2019, 02:06:28 am »

I guess, but unless they've upped the capability of the AI 1-system vassals will happily sit around for a 100 years tanking their own economy and not even expanding to available, neighboring systems. Which I suppose explains why they only have 3 corvettes...

Vassals, protectorates, and the unique names Awakened Empires use (but pointedly not tributaries) are actually mechanically incapable of spreading to new systems without their overlord having the Feudal Society civic.
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amjh

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8285 on: November 20, 2019, 02:23:01 am »

If there's a system you think would be really good on your vassal, you could take it yourself and gift it.
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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8286 on: November 20, 2019, 05:15:10 am »

Sigh. Every time I get back into this game the same stupid crap makes me want to uninstall it. I see migration is still horrifically stupidly broken.

Made a migration treaty with another empire solely so I could use their pops to populate my dry worlds since they're desert. What I didn't realize is they happen to have pops of a different species which are adaptable. Cue my ENTIRE EMPIRE growing nothing but that species, even on worlds where my species is 80 hab and they are 30. I didn't notice this until my economy was tanking due to all the 30 hab pops on my main worlds. Literally every single world is growing nothing but them and they are already over 1/3 of my empire after a few short years. Moved them all to worlds they actually have good habitability on and turned migration controls on. Still my entire empire insists on growing them. Had to cancel the migration treaty with my neighbor to stop them.

The entire time, not a single pop of their main species migrated over. So I still don't have desert pops. Sadly I didn't wait to colonize the world's so I can't do it that way. So now I have one world with 80 pops and the rest of my empire has stagnated, and I didn't even get the desert loving pops that I wanted.

In short, migration treaty results in my entire species becoming sterile and being replaced by useless adaptable species that I only have one world they can even live on at high habitability.
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Sentient Bowtie

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8287 on: November 20, 2019, 11:21:27 am »

If your Population Controls policy is set to Allowed you can manually select a specific pop type for growth on a specific planet (including ones that can only grow via migration), so you can have only their desert species grow on your dry worlds and only your own species grow on your other worlds.
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Sartain

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8288 on: November 20, 2019, 12:30:41 pm »

I guess, but unless they've upped the capability of the AI 1-system vassals will happily sit around for a 100 years tanking their own economy and not even expanding to available, neighboring systems. Which I suppose explains why they only have 3 corvettes...

Vassals, protectorates, and the unique names Awakened Empires use (but pointedly not tributaries) are actually mechanically incapable of spreading to new systems without their overlord having the Feudal Society civic.

Oh right, this was with the Feudal civic as I've tried multiple times to see if it's actually any good. It's really not

If there's a system you think would be really good on your vassal, you could take it yourself and gift it.
Which is unfortunately pretty much the only way to get vassals to do any sort of expanding, and even then they have a tendency so suck so hard at building up their economy that even if you gift them thousands of minerals and energy they won't even manage to develop the potential stations in their territory.
« Last Edit: November 20, 2019, 12:32:27 pm by Sartain »
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Sentient Bowtie

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8289 on: November 20, 2019, 01:49:39 pm »

In that case, vassals also have the irritating issue of not being able to expand if they are vassalized before constructing a shipyard, according to the wiki.
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IronyOwl

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8290 on: November 20, 2019, 03:52:06 pm »

Sigh. Every time I get back into this game the same stupid crap makes me want to uninstall it. I see migration is still horrifically stupidly broken.

Made a migration treaty with another empire solely so I could use their pops to populate my dry worlds since they're desert. What I didn't realize is they happen to have pops of a different species which are adaptable. Cue my ENTIRE EMPIRE growing nothing but that species, even on worlds where my species is 80 hab and they are 30. I didn't notice this until my economy was tanking due to all the 30 hab pops on my main worlds. Literally every single world is growing nothing but them and they are already over 1/3 of my empire after a few short years. Moved them all to worlds they actually have good habitability on and turned migration controls on. Still my entire empire insists on growing them. Had to cancel the migration treaty with my neighbor to stop them.

The entire time, not a single pop of their main species migrated over. So I still don't have desert pops. Sadly I didn't wait to colonize the world's so I can't do it that way. So now I have one world with 80 pops and the rest of my empire has stagnated, and I didn't even get the desert loving pops that I wanted.

In short, migration treaty results in my entire species becoming sterile and being replaced by useless adaptable species that I only have one world they can even live on at high habitability.
Unfortunately, Stellaris has never really known what it's doing with pops or how they're distinct from your other infrastructure. Part of the problem is waffling in this weird middle ground between controlled and autonomous, where you can't just click buttons to tell them what to do but they're also not smart enough to be effective- or more importantly, interesting- on their own. I think that's largely symptomatic of not being willing to take either extreme, though: They absolutely want pops to Exist and Do Stuff, but they're not willing to take the plunge and model birth rates or employment decisions, so... even out the population over time and call it a day, I guess.
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Sartain

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8291 on: November 20, 2019, 04:33:57 pm »

Sigh. Every time I get back into this game the same stupid crap makes me want to uninstall it. I see migration is still horrifically stupidly broken.

Made a migration treaty with another empire solely so I could use their pops to populate my dry worlds since they're desert. What I didn't realize is they happen to have pops of a different species which are adaptable. Cue my ENTIRE EMPIRE growing nothing but that species, even on worlds where my species is 80 hab and they are 30. I didn't notice this until my economy was tanking due to all the 30 hab pops on my main worlds. Literally every single world is growing nothing but them and they are already over 1/3 of my empire after a few short years. Moved them all to worlds they actually have good habitability on and turned migration controls on. Still my entire empire insists on growing them. Had to cancel the migration treaty with my neighbor to stop them.

The entire time, not a single pop of their main species migrated over. So I still don't have desert pops. Sadly I didn't wait to colonize the world's so I can't do it that way. So now I have one world with 80 pops and the rest of my empire has stagnated, and I didn't even get the desert loving pops that I wanted.

In short, migration treaty results in my entire species becoming sterile and being replaced by useless adaptable species that I only have one world they can even live on at high habitability.
Unfortunately, Stellaris has never really known what it's doing with pops or how they're distinct from your other infrastructure. Part of the problem is waffling in this weird middle ground between controlled and autonomous, where you can't just click buttons to tell them what to do but they're also not smart enough to be effective- or more importantly, interesting- on their own. I think that's largely symptomatic of not being willing to take either extreme, though: They absolutely want pops to Exist and Do Stuff, but they're not willing to take the plunge and model birth rates or employment decisions, so... even out the population over time and call it a day, I guess.

I feel like this is symptomatic for a lot of the design choices made with Stellaris. It started out somewhat daring and has become more and more waffling, boring-compromise design as the DLC/update cycles have been going on. It's a damn shame too because there's a lot of things that could be very, very awesome in the game but instead just end up as mildly interesting but bland instead. Maybe the next DLC/update will make it better but I'm not getting my hopes up, I think I'll just have to settle for Stellaris never becoming as bold as I hoped it would
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E. Albright

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8292 on: November 20, 2019, 05:23:53 pm »

Early on, Stellaris felt an awful lot like what MOO3 aspired to be, but progressive updates have sanded the aspirational edge off more and more. I still play it, but the whole "ever increasing breadth" DLC model is a bit depressing, especially since there have indeed been a few core rule revisions that made it shallower, albeit not a ton.
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Teneb

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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8293 on: November 20, 2019, 05:33:28 pm »

I think it's also a result of the game being on its third director now.
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Re: Stellaris: Paradox Interactive IN SPACE
« Reply #8294 on: November 21, 2019, 12:03:52 pm »

And yet I still keep coming back to playing it lol. It's one of those games that catches my attention despite its terrible flaws. At least most of the issues can be worked around.
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