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Author Topic: Let us create restraints 1 z-level above the ground, so i can assign goblins.  (Read 5412 times)

Urist Tilaturist

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People should only fight over these issues if they are sacred (killing animals sacred to a civilisation in one of their temples, for example). Fighting over not exiling traitors is too stupid even for DF, and should change to wars fought for more pragmatic reasons (conquest, enforcing vassalage, or taking slaves and tribute).

Remember that most wars in history were fought between fairly similar groups of people. Catholics and Protestants fought for centuries, but both were Christian and both were fond of killing.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2015, 07:37:34 am by Urist Tilaturist »
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Shazbot

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I doubt they were any more fond of killing than any other generation of man. I do agree that a war with another country over its internal 'human rights' is odd for the time period specifically because what does a dwarf care how a goblin king mutilates a goblin bread-thief. Now as civilizations begin deviating from their starting ethics, as I gather these philosophical schools cause to happen, we might see conservative dwarves at war with liberal dwarves of another kingdom.

I have attempted, with retracted bridges, to suspend chained goblins from my ramparts. Sadly restraints only work on their own Z-level and said goblins fell into the lava moat.

Ah well.
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GoblinCookie

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I doubt they were any more fond of killing than any other generation of man. I do agree that a war with another country over its internal 'human rights' is odd for the time period specifically because what does a dwarf care how a goblin king mutilates a goblin bread-thief. Now as civilizations begin deviating from their starting ethics, as I gather these philosophical schools cause to happen, we might see conservative dwarves at war with liberal dwarves of another kingdom.

I have attempted, with retracted bridges, to suspend chained goblins from my ramparts. Sadly restraints only work on their own Z-level and said goblins fell into the lava moat.

Ah well.

Going to war directly is odd, however it does harm relations and causes the civilizations to interpret one another's actions in a more negative light. 

It would not be the fact that they torture people that causes me to go to war.  The fact that they torture people makes me see them as bad people which in turn helps prevent a peaceful resolution of a more mundane dispute over something since I believe that the other party has the worst intentions since I see them as evil.
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Camulus

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Ethics-wise, if it's acceptable for one dwarf to hammer another into a bloody pulp, I don't see how hanging invaders is that much of a conundrum.

The ethics of sapient torture is a separate issue for the sphere of diplomacy.
I do think the execution of invading forces is a worthy mechanic to be added in-game.
They did come to yer home to slaughter yer kin, after all.

(Camulus's ulterior motive is the creation of the first ever dwarven guillotine, imagining rows upon rows of them awaiting the unworthy necks of greenskins and tree-fondlers alike)



« Last Edit: October 07, 2015, 05:46:36 am by Camulus »
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cochramd

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I don't know how dwarfs not controlled by the player deal with captured enemies, but let's be honest with ourselves here: player-controlled dwarfs have no qualms in committing POW-related war crimes. They are more than happy to throw captured goblins into a pit from which they will never emerge alive, and feel the same way about stripping them of their arms and slaughtering them as part of military training. In fact, they will even throw the goblins into a pit where they are constantly struck by harmless wooden training weapons to improve their skills so that put up a better fight and thus provide better training when slaughtered by the military. I myself plan to throw my captured enemies 120 or so z-layers down onto masterwork menacing steel spikes surrounded by magma (so I don't have to clean up their remains)....10 spikes per tile is deadlier than 1 spike, right? 1 spike might be easier to dodge, but 10 spikes has the whole bed of nails thing working against it.
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GoblinCookie

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I don't know how dwarfs not controlled by the player deal with captured enemies, but let's be honest with ourselves here: player-controlled dwarfs have no qualms in committing POW-related war crimes. They are more than happy to throw captured goblins into a pit from which they will never emerge alive, and feel the same way about stripping them of their arms and slaughtering them as part of military training. In fact, they will even throw the goblins into a pit where they are constantly struck by harmless wooden training weapons to improve their skills so that put up a better fight and thus provide better training when slaughtered by the military. I myself plan to throw my captured enemies 120 or so z-layers down onto masterwork menacing steel spikes surrounded by magma (so I don't have to clean up their remains)....10 spikes per tile is deadlier than 1 spike, right? 1 spike might be easier to dodge, but 10 spikes has the whole bed of nails thing working against it.

Well the players managed to be cruel enough at is, so it is therefore a great idea to add in more mechanics existing solely to facilitate the cruelty of the players. ::) ::)
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cochramd

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Well the players managed to be cruel enough at is, so it is therefore a great idea to add in more mechanics existing solely to facilitate the cruelty of the players. ::) ::)
Precisely.
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Bumber

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Well the players managed to be cruel enough at is, so it is therefore a great idea to add in more mechanics existing solely to facilitate the cruelty of the players. ::) ::)
Isn't it better to add seemingly harmless mechanics for the players to pervert unto their own ends? (Minecart baby separators, anyone?)
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cochramd

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Isn't it better to add seemingly harmless mechanics for the players to pervert unto their own ends? (Minecart baby separators, anyone?)
You need a mix of both, really.
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GoblinCookie

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Well the players managed to be cruel enough at is, so it is therefore a great idea to add in more mechanics existing solely to facilitate the cruelty of the players. ::) ::)
Isn't it better to add seemingly harmless mechanics for the players to pervert unto their own ends? (Minecart baby separators, anyone?)

Well that way you absolve any ethical responsibility for the cruelty of your players.....
« Last Edit: October 09, 2015, 06:31:52 am by GoblinCookie »
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Bumber

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Well the players managed to be cruel enough at is, so it is therefore a great idea to add in more mechanics existing solely to facilitate the cruelty of the players. ::) ::)
Isn't it better to add seemingly harmless mechanics for the players to pervert unto their own ends? (Minecart baby separators, anyone?)

Well that way you involve any ethical responsibility for the cruelty of your players.....
Plausible deniability. 8)
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THE xTROLL FUR SOCKx RUSE WAS A........... DISTACTION        the carp HAVE the wagon

A wizard has turned you into a wagon. This was inevitable (Y/y)?

Icefire2314

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Eh... It's probably against dwarven ethics, since that's either a form of torture and/or a form of making trophies from sapients. The goblins or even humans would probably do that stuff, but even if the ability were added to the game, you'd never see it around dwarven forts because they're just too dogmatically "lawful-good".

Death by hanging can end two ways. Strangulation, which yes, could be considered torture, or instant death by broken neck, which is honestly merciful because it is quick and painless. It depends on how it is implemented but it is not always unethical.
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