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Author Topic: Trespassers of the Multiverse: Gaiden [OOC] Compleation is a drop away...  (Read 884077 times)

kj1225

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Re: Trespassers of the Multiverse: Gaiden [OOC] Compleation is a drop away...
« Reply #13680 on: March 29, 2016, 12:08:55 am »

Now then, back to lurking and contemplating how to stat up armies since it seems I running a plot for one again.
What kind of army are we talking about? Just a bunch of sentient meatsacks? Or something else like a hivemind entity or mindless automatons? Are logistics a factor at all? How much will terrain and formation play a part in their use?
Well, to put it as I pitched to Sanure, it's like total war meets Hyrule Warriors. So in order...
One easily numbering in the thousands with players ordering about smaller groups and simultaneously killing off hordes of mooks themselves.
What they are depends on the faction, but technically their winning is positive over all because people won't be dying by the hundreds
Logistics are a thing they can worry about which will help their faction but isn't needed.
Terrain and formation may come into play, but probably more in a 'gives bonuses' kind of way than a 'can absolutely murder you' kind of way. Not that it can't be the latter though.
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Powder Miner

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Re: Trespassers of the Multiverse: Gaiden [OOC] Compleation is a drop away...
« Reply #13681 on: March 29, 2016, 12:11:10 am »

I don't much like the idea of having my characters order around armies for two reasons: A. it sort of diminishes some of the personal aspects of the RP and B. Chartre is NOT suited for leadership

of course, this all just means I don't have to join the plot :V V:
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TheBiggerFish

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Re: Trespassers of the Multiverse: Gaiden [OOC] Compleation is a drop away...
« Reply #13682 on: March 29, 2016, 12:18:03 am »

@Somebody who suggested amnesia:Flat-out no.  I am not giving her amnesia.  Just no.  No.  And NO.

@Emp:But it wasn't ANYTHING CLOSE TO META-RELATED.  Alanis having a stupid idea/plan does not an argument about meta stuff make.

@Powder Miner:Again, I am trying to tone it down.  I tend to think of Alanis as a truthseeker type.  Trying to figure out what the heck is actually going on, why it's happening, whether they can do it, etc.  It happens that they have some evidence that there's fiction happening.  They're trying to get to the bottom of that.  If there was ever a plot in which we didn't get handed all the information...But there's just nothing else for her to DO.

@kj:I don't know about these characters in charge of armies...
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kj1225

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Re: Trespassers of the Multiverse: Gaiden [OOC] Compleation is a drop away...
« Reply #13683 on: March 29, 2016, 12:20:37 am »

@Somebody who suggested amnesia:Flat-out no.  I am not giving her amnesia.  Just no.  No.  And NO.

@Emp:But it wasn't ANYTHING CLOSE TO META-RELATED.  Alanis having a stupid idea/plan does not an argument about meta stuff make.

@Powder Miner:Again, I am trying to tone it down.  I tend to think of Alanis as a truthseeker type.  Trying to figure out what the heck is actually going on, why it's happening, whether they can do it, etc.  It happens that they have some evidence that there's fiction happening.  They're trying to get to the bottom of that.  If there was ever a plot in which we didn't get handed all the information...

@kj:I don't know about these characters in charge of armies...
Why not amnesia? Worst case she's more pleasant. Best case, we can make an interesting plot.

As for leading armies, I'm sure they'll be fine at it!
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TheBiggerFish

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Re: Trespassers of the Multiverse: Gaiden [OOC] Compleation is a drop away...
« Reply #13684 on: March 29, 2016, 12:22:41 am »

I have strong personal objections to completely wiping a character because they developed 'wrong'.  It's effectively murder.
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Re: Trespassers of the Multiverse: Gaiden [OOC] Compleation is a drop away
« Reply #13685 on: March 29, 2016, 12:22:51 am »

That's the exact problem, TBF. There's nothing else for her to do because Alanis is COMPLETELY defined around the meta stuff. If she had some other personality elements or motivations to act on or pursue, there wouldn't be nothing for her to do (after all, the other characters do manage to find other conversation topics), but as the meta girl gimmick makes up the entire core of Alanis' character, there are no other avenues to pursue because there sinply isn't anything else about her.

And this means the same old repetitive arguments happen time and time again. Alanis really needs some other motivations or core personality aspects. She doesn't need amnesia (it's an extreme suggestion but not murder as Alanis is not real) but she does need to be developed outside of the whole meta thing.
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TheBiggerFish

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Re: Trespassers of the Multiverse: Gaiden [OOC] Compleation is a drop away...
« Reply #13686 on: March 29, 2016, 12:25:17 am »

No, there are no other avenues to pursue because there are literally no other avenues to pursue.

There's NOTHING HAPPENING RIGHT NOW.

And the plot of "why us" was already blasted.

And that leaves far too much time for those sorts of thoughts to rattle around and cause problems.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2016, 12:31:23 am by TheBiggerFish »
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Re: Trespassers of the Multiverse: Gaiden [OOC] Compleation is a drop away...
« Reply #13687 on: March 29, 2016, 12:27:52 am »

Every other character has managed to find a topic of conversation to pursue that didn't involve the meta thing -- my previous statement still applies. If the only thing Alanis can come up with on her own is the meta thing (and this is over the course of the whole RP), it is because she lacks definition outside of it.

Also pls don't edit after I have responded because I'm not going to edit in responses to each of your edits.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2016, 12:29:31 am by Powder Miner »
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TheBiggerFish

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Re: Trespassers of the Multiverse: Gaiden [OOC] Compleation is a drop away...
« Reply #13688 on: March 29, 2016, 12:30:45 am »

They have variously:
) Gotten drunk
) Done introductions and backstories.
) Talked about A SHARED UNIVERSE which Alanis lacks with anyone. (This, the HERO characters.)
) Leadership talkings, which Alanis wasn't invited to.
) Dackly did that thing with Nyx.
) Shipping.

Yeah, there are so many topics of conversation.

(I missed your post because it doesn't alert for edits.)
« Last Edit: March 29, 2016, 12:32:23 am by TheBiggerFish »
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Re: Trespassers of the Multiverse: Gaiden [OOC] Compleation is a drop away...
« Reply #13689 on: March 29, 2016, 12:31:55 am »

Yes, these are in fact all viable topics of conversation. Also, I do not believe anyone has a shared universe.

And this holds up even though you are not even counting several other topics of conversation -- you are cherrypicking.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2016, 12:33:28 am by Powder Miner »
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TheBiggerFish

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Re: Trespassers of the Multiverse: Gaiden [OOC] Compleation is a drop away...
« Reply #13690 on: March 29, 2016, 12:33:40 am »

Let's see:
) Alanis is not going to get drunk unless under extreme pressure.
) OH HEY SHE'S DOING THAT.
) No shared universe with anyone here (again, this is the HERO characters)
) Not invited.
) Not Nyx worshipper.
) Already shipped.

If I'm missing something, you tell me, because I obviously haven't seen it.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2016, 12:35:14 am by TheBiggerFish »
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Empiricist

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Re: Trespassers of the Multiverse: Gaiden [OOC] Compleation is a drop away...
« Reply #13691 on: March 29, 2016, 12:38:09 am »

Okay, here's what I'm thinking: Soldiers are ordered into Groups. Each group has one HP value per unit Type within it, which is the sum of the Max HP of that Type multiplied by the number of Soldiers of that Type. When taking damage, damage is split between each Soldier Type HP pool in the ratio of their current quantities. Groups have no max HP but don't truly heal either, instead healing applied to a Group is capped to the amount of damage they took the previous turn to represent non-dead casualties getting stitched up, while preventing people from making soldiers pop out of thin air via heals. Healing can be targeted at a specific Soldier Type within the target group however. Each Soldier Type grants one Action, and with the roll format of ndx, where n is (Current HP of the Relevant Soldier Type / The Max HP of that Type). So you can roll higher if you have more Soldiers.

However, each area not only has percentage-based bonuses or penalties, they also may have a maximum offensive pool. The total sum of all offensive dice rolled by all allied Groups in that area cannot exceed it. This represents the terrain restricting utilization of manpower and whatnot. For example, a group of riflemen in a narrow pass can only fire so many rounds without hitting their comrades in front of them, at a certain point having more numbers won't boost their offensive power. This, and the fact that artillery (as in actual artillery that fires upwards and whatnot) will not be restricted by it at all, and the fact that artillery will hit deal extra damage proportional to the HP of a group (going to get more kills if there are more people in the area) will serve to discourage people from just piling all their groups together for massive stats.

Morale and whatnot may be handled with bonuses and penalties, and logistics by having pools for each resource which are steadily drained if separated from supply lines. Resource cap per group is based on the number of units (current HP), but groups can move faster the less they carry. Plus if their enemies use compatible resources they can just scavenge from them, allowing for rapid-assault groups that scavenge resources from fallen foes.

But really, the characters you want would be just the ones with AoE. I mean sure, Mio can completely obliterate just about any enemy soldier one at a time while tanking their hits, but Contagion can just poison and burn entire groups in a single turn. Artillery and artillery-analogues are incredibly effective in conventional warfare after all, unless you've got something disrupting their usage.

Oh, and Fog of War is important. So figure out whether out whether Elf will be bringing Decima in, along with the limits to their capabilities. Because if they're as effective as I think they are, you'd probably want to giving the enemy force overwhelming numbers to compensate for the fact that they have Fog of War, but the Party's allies would be able to see every move they make via that Persona's abilities.

Also PC AoEs will likely wreck everything in their effective area.

@Emp:But it wasn't ANYTHING CLOSE TO META-RELATED.  Alanis having a stupid idea/plan does not an argument about meta stuff make.
Yes, but BOXWOOD didn't ask her to stop talking about the meta-stuff, rather to just stop causing conflict in general by pressing for something literally everyone else disagrees with.

Look here's the point: you are not going to have much luck persuading anyone who dislikes Alanis that they are an acceptable, let alone good character. Which is a massive issue seeing as that it's quite a good chunk of the playerbase. Also, you still need to nerf and simplify all her formulas.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2016, 01:06:11 am by Empiricist »
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Re: Trespassers of the Multiverse: Gaiden [OOC] Compleation is a drop away...
« Reply #13692 on: March 29, 2016, 12:39:54 am »

Alanis has never done actual introductions and backstories, just said her name and gone meta. Is this all her introductions and backstory should consist of? This is what I mean by Alanis being devoid of definition.

As for the others, you should note that the specific definitions you have listed for why Alanis has not participated in or started her own conversation on a topic have not stopped other characters from joining in in their own ways, like Victoria (or Ashley? or Alice??? Not sure which) talking about the HERO stuff without being from HERO. And on the shipping angle, just because Alanis has been shipped does NOT mean all of the romantic RP angle has been axed! She's in a relationship, this should be developed and fleshed out,mI have had some fantastic RP doing that with my characters!

Even leaving out creating a topic of conversation, there are SO many non-meta angles you could be participating in and other characters HAVE been participating in, but you just haven't taken Alanis as a character beyond the meta stuff. And if there isn't a topic for you, make one! That's what I did with Evridiki's current conversation, playing on her paranoia to have her ask Sachi and Victoria about the threats of their worlds. Give Alanis more of a personality to play off of so you can create content.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2016, 12:43:18 am by Powder Miner »
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TheBiggerFish

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Re: Trespassers of the Multiverse: Gaiden [OOC] Compleation is a drop away...
« Reply #13693 on: March 29, 2016, 12:45:19 am »

If you'll notice, she's talking to Alice about herself without really mentioning metaness in doing so.

Disregarding Wilson.

And honestly, she has not necessarily VOLUNTEERED information, but good grief, just because she's not spewing it out to all and sundry doesn't mean that she has none whatsoever!

I would develop that, but with ItE almost never around, and nobody bringing it up, Alanis has no impetus to talk about her personal life!
« Last Edit: March 29, 2016, 12:47:06 am by TheBiggerFish »
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Re: Trespassers of the Multiverse: Gaiden [OOC] Compleation is a drop away...
« Reply #13694 on: March 29, 2016, 12:46:51 am »

For starters you could have her go talk to other people and ask for help whenever her Crafting inevitably fails, rather than just repeatedly retrying and asking the GMs with no IC input at all. I mean, she went to buy crafting materials to help her, but it literally consisted of an action with no RP at all. She's never asked for help, even from the other magical or crafting characters as far as I know.

And honestly, she has not necessarily VOLUNTEERED information, but good grief, just because she's not spewing it out to all and sundry doesn't mean that she has none whatsoever!
It's because no-one has an IC reason to care. Her attitude has basically just driven them off, and your insistence on having her emphasize all that meta-stuff makes some people reluctant to even have their characters talk to her. It's a feedback loop.
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