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[smjjames]

Seriously you're like a walking example of Poe's law. Next you'll be telling us Hitler was all well and good because he put paid to the German Communist Party.

Who? Sergarr or Maduro? Would be good to have an accurate translated transcript of what Maduro said plus context on both sides.

[Reelya]

Sergarr's position is that basically being on the right-wing no matter how extreme is perfectly fine as long as the other guy is associated with the left, which is either completely sarcastic or he has a screw loose.

The Venezeulan opposition are on about the level of Pinochet in Chile by a rough estimation. They have armed thugs who go around burning down public infrastructure if it's associated with the left.

I'm just wondering how far that goes with Sergarr? Is a NAZI-like regime which has gas chambers for union members perfectly cool, if you just happen to be overthrowing a government which promotes free health clinics and public education?

[smjjames]

That's not what he said in his post. He was just pointing out whatever strange thing Maduro was doing there.

[Sergarr]

Seriously you're like a walking example of Poe's law. Next you'll be telling us Hitler was all well and good because he put paid to the German Communist Party.

Maduro is an uneducated bus driver who only got to power by being a personal driver for Chavez. He doesn't know how to rule the country, and as a result he ruined Venezuela, turned it into a complete mess by indiscriminate nationalization and heavy-handed governmental interventions. Don't try to shift the blame here - it's Maduro's fault that his country is now starting to rebel against his tyrannical rule. Hopefully he will be deposed swiftly and without too many casualties.

[Helgoland]

Quick question: Why do you capitalize 'Nazi' like that? It's not like it's an acronym. Hell, it's not even a proper shortening - that would've been 'Naso'. Since that doesn't sound cool, but rather like a nose-themed superhero, they just took the first syllables and spelled them wrong.

[smjjames]

Seriously you're like a walking example of Poe's law. Next you'll be telling us Hitler was all well and good because he put paid to the German Communist Party.

Maduro is an uneducated bus driver who only got to power by being a personal driver for Chavez. He doesn't know how to rule the country, and as a result he ruined Venezuela, turned it into a complete mess by indiscriminate nationalization and heavy-handed governmental interventions. Don't try to shift the blame here - it's Maduro's fault that his country is now starting to rebel against his tyrannical rule. Hopefully he will be deposed swiftly and without too many casualties.

The way it's going already, it's going to be bloody.

[Akura]

Quick question: Why do you capitalize 'Nazi' like that? It's not like it's an acronym. Hell, it's not even a proper shortening - that would've been 'Naso'. Since that doesn't sound cool, but rather like a nose-themed superhero, they just took the first syllables and spelled them wrong.

A quick lookup suggests that "Nazi" is shortened from the German name of the National Socialist German Workers' party, "Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei". Not quite sure why the shortened it like that, though.

[Teneb]

Seriously you're like a walking example of Poe's law. Next you'll be telling us Hitler was all well and good because he put paid to the German Communist Party.

Maduro is an uneducated bus driver who only got to power by being a personal driver for Chavez. He doesn't know how to rule the country, and as a result he ruined Venezuela, turned it into a complete mess by indiscriminate nationalization and heavy-handed governmental interventions. Don't try to shift the blame here - it's Maduro's fault that his country is now starting to rebel against his tyrannical rule. Hopefully he will be deposed swiftly and without too many casualties.

Maduro is a huge power-hungry moron. But here's the problem: the people opposing him are also power-hungry, and while not morons they don't give a shit about anyone other than themselves (not that Maduro does either).

I know you are firmly in the camp of neo-liberal capitalism and don't really mind that, but this is not a conflict between capitalism and communism. This is a conflict between a sycophant-turned-leader and oligarchs.

External intervention is also not going to work either. If the US intervenes, everyone in the continent will, with reason, be extremely pissed off. Last time the US decided to mess around in South America... well, just do some research on Plan Condor. Fortunately, Trump leans towards isolationism. If anyone else in SA intervenes, they'll either prop up one side as their puppet, try to put in a third puppet of their own, or maybe even an insane attempt at outright conquest/submission if it is Colombia.

[WealthyRadish]

Quick question: Why do you capitalize 'Nazi' like that? It's not like it's an acronym. Hell, it's not even a proper shortening - that would've been 'Naso'. Since that doesn't sound cool, but rather like a nose-themed superhero, they just took the first syllables and spelled them wrong.

A quick lookup suggests that "Nazi" is shortened from the German name of the National Socialist German Workers' party, "Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei". Not quite sure why the shortened it like that, though.

My guess would be that the term started exclusively as spoken slang, with the eventual written spelling imitating the slang phonetically rather than using the spelling of the original phrase.

[Teneb]

Quick question: Why do you capitalize 'Nazi' like that? It's not like it's an acronym. Hell, it's not even a proper shortening - that would've been 'Naso'. Since that doesn't sound cool, but rather like a nose-themed superhero, they just took the first syllables and spelled them wrong.

A quick lookup suggests that "Nazi" is shortened from the German name of the National Socialist German Workers' party, "Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei". Not quite sure why the shortened it like that, though.

My guess would be that the term started exclusively as spoken slang, with the eventual written spelling imitating the slang phonetically rather than using the spelling of the original phrase.

Nazi sounds better and catchier than NDA. Memes aren't just fun and games.

[smjjames]

Seriously you're like a walking example of Poe's law. Next you'll be telling us Hitler was all well and good because he put paid to the German Communist Party.

Maduro is an uneducated bus driver who only got to power by being a personal driver for Chavez. He doesn't know how to rule the country, and as a result he ruined Venezuela, turned it into a complete mess by indiscriminate nationalization and heavy-handed governmental interventions. Don't try to shift the blame here - it's Maduro's fault that his country is now starting to rebel against his tyrannical rule. Hopefully he will be deposed swiftly and without too many casualties.

Maduro is a huge power-hungry moron. But here's the problem: the people opposing him are also power-hungry, and while not morons they don't give a shit about anyone other than themselves (not that Maduro does either).

I know you are firmly in the camp of neo-liberal capitalism and don't really mind that, but this is not a conflict between capitalism and communism. This is a conflict between a sycophant-turned-leader and oligarchs.

External intervention is also not going to work either. If the US intervenes, everyone in the continent will, with reason, be extremely pissed off. Last time the US decided to mess around in South America... well, just do some research on Plan Condor. Fortunately, Trump leans towards isolationism. If anyone else in SA intervenes, they'll either prop up one side as their puppet, try to put in a third puppet of their own, or maybe even an insane attempt at outright conquest/submission if it is Colombia.

It'd be hard to predict what exactly Trump would do since he seems to do things on a whim and it's still early in his admin. The only Latin American policy that I know of is just the wall and stuff with Mexico.

However, the current Homeland Security secretary used to be the commander of the US Southern Command, which covers the Carribean, Central America, and South America. So, what's going on in Venezuela could become a topic of interest for him, and via him, Trump.

The US is definetly keeping an eye on what's going on though.

[Reelya]

Maduro is a huge power-hungry moron. But here's the problem: the people opposing him are also power-hungry, and while not morons they don't give a shit about anyone other than themselves (not that Maduro does either).

I know you are firmly in the camp of neo-liberal capitalism and don't really mind that, but this is not a conflict between capitalism and communism. This is a conflict between a sycophant-turned-leader and oligarchs.

External intervention is also not going to work either. If the US intervenes, everyone in the continent will, with reason, be extremely pissed off. Last time the US decided to mess around in South America... well, just do some research on Plan Condor. Fortunately, Trump leans towards isolationism. If anyone else in SA intervenes, they'll either prop up one side as their puppet, try to put in a third puppet of their own, or maybe even an insane attempt at outright conquest/submission if it is Colombia.

Yeah, though remember Maduro isn't just one dude, the PSUV party's membership is around 7.5 million people  (now over 8 million according to a 2016 FOX news article), or about a third of the entire population of Venezuela are voting members of Maduro's party. The scale of these organizations is sort of lost in the personality politics as portrayed in the media.

Completely squashing that would in fact be a civil war, and I think it's likely that a new government will attempt to completely crush the PSUV and everything connected to them. Which since they are 1/3rd of the entire population, is a lot of things.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Socialist_Party_of_Venezuela

[Sergarr]

Maduro is a huge power-hungry moron. But here's the problem: the people opposing him are also power-hungry, and while not morons they don't give a shit about anyone other than themselves (not that Maduro does either).

I know you are firmly in the camp of neo-liberal capitalism and don't really mind that, but this is not a conflict between capitalism and communism. This is a conflict between a sycophant-turned-leader and oligarchs.

External intervention is also not going to work either. If the US intervenes, everyone in the continent will, with reason, be extremely pissed off. Last time the US decided to mess around in South America... well, just do some research on Plan Condor. Fortunately, Trump leans towards isolationism. If anyone else in SA intervenes, they'll either prop up one side as their puppet, try to put in a third puppet of their own, or maybe even an insane attempt at outright conquest/submission if it is Colombia.

Yeah, though remember Maduro isn't just one dude, the PSUV party's membership is around 7.5 million people  (now over 8 million according to a 2016 FOX news article), or about a third of the entire population of Venezuela are voting members of Maduro's party. The scale of these organizations is sort of lost in the personality politics as portrayed in the media.

Completely squashing that would in fact be a civil war, and I think it's likely that a new government will attempt to completely crush the PSUV and everything connected to them. Which since they are 1/3rd of the entire population, is a lot of things.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Socialist_Party_of_Venezuela

Late response, but if the situation is the same as in USSR, the overwhelming majority of these so-called "party members" are in there only for the money and power, and will scurry out the moment it stops providing them with so. There was no civil war during the USSR/Warsaw pack breakup, because the communists' vaunted numbers are full of shit and there actually aren't very many people who would support them, they're just experts at maintaining an illusion of that.

Also, hearing rumors that the only people who will be allowed to vote for the Constituent Assembly are either the ones with Social Security (which apparently means the retired people), or military. So, I guess that's an explanation for how Maduro wants to achieve a perfectly loyal parliament in order to continue being in power.

[martinuzz]

Meanwhile in Brasil, the president set his army loose on the civilian population. The Brasilian capital Brasilia has been conquered by government forces.
For hours, the nation's capital was covered in thick black smoke. Protestors had set fire to the ministry of Agriculture, and damaged at least seven other ministries.
Military police countered it violently, causing mass panic by charging the protestors on horseback, and firing at protestors who were sitting on the ground with their hands in the air with live ammunition.

By now, 1500 military troops have arrived to restore order, and for now they are to stay until the end of the month.
Temer's militarization of the capital meets with fierce opposition. Some opposition leaders are going to the high court to try and forbid the martial law. Congress session ended in a mass fistfight.
Calls for empeachment of Temer are becoming more widespread

http://www.volkskrant.nl/buitenland/hoofdstad-brazilie-in-handen-van-leger-na-zeer-gewelddadige-confrontaties-met-demonstranten~a4496951/

inb4 Brasil devolves into fullscale civil war

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/24/world/americas/brazil-michel-temer-brasilia-protests.html

[smjjames]

Brazillll. Wtf.........

Bad South American antics makes your North American cousins (including the US) sad....