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Author Topic: Bloodyhells - Succession: Battlefailed #5 (42.06)  (Read 132719 times)

DoritioMaster

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Re: Bloodyhells - Succession: Battlefailed #5 (42.06)
« Reply #345 on: June 25, 2016, 02:52:51 pm »

So I just finished HorrorFailed today, and I was surprised to find this ongoing!
Thus, I must request a dwarf and a turn.
Dwarf - Dorito, any profession, "Fail Priest"

Now to catch up on 23 pages...
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Taupe

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Re: Bloodyhells - Succession: Battlefailed #5 (42.06)
« Reply #346 on: June 25, 2016, 03:52:25 pm »

So I just finished HorrorFailed today, and I was surprised to find this ongoing!
Thus, I must request a dwarf and a turn.
Dwarf - Dorito, any profession, "Fail Priest"

Now to catch up on 23 pages...
TLDR: Shit is going down, nobody is sure what's going on exactly. Evil evil EVIL!

Senshuken

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Re: Bloodyhells - Succession: Battlefailed #5 (42.06)
« Reply #347 on: June 26, 2016, 10:54:36 am »

Since the fortress now has a large Necromancer population, does that mean that other Necromancer settlements are friendly with us now or are they going to fight us over the corpses that are piling up on our doorstep?
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NCommander

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Re: Bloodyhells - Succession: Battlefailed #5 (42.06)
« Reply #348 on: June 27, 2016, 04:43:46 am »

Since the fortress now has a large Necromancer population, does that mean that other Necromancer settlements are friendly with us now or are they going to fight us over the corpses that are piling up on our doorstep?

Necromaners still have to eat/drink. I've also seen guest goblins drink I believe, though I don't tend to watch them closely. Now we just need a vampire so we can have vampire necromancers. Or a relatively safe werebeast transformation.
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Spish

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Re: Bloodyhells - Succession: Battlefailed #5 (42.06)
« Reply #349 on: June 27, 2016, 04:47:21 pm »

You're pushin' your luck Archie. Though it does give Eric more time to get caught up...
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Archereon

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Re: Bloodyhells - Succession: Battlefailed #5 (42.06)
« Reply #350 on: June 27, 2016, 11:36:13 pm »

You're pushin' your luck Archie. Though it does give Eric more time to get caught up...


Uh yeah, if it comes down to it, I'll upload the save and write the full update later. For posterity, the tl;dr of what happened in winter was as follows: We war trained the cave dragon, had the militia train for a while while everyone else worked on harvesting adamantine, made some addy swords and silver maces and whatnot, lured some of the husks into cage traps, then sent in the militia to mop up the upper fortress. We lost one of the dwarves, Lebo, who bled out while being moved to the hospital. The war dragon is pretty tough, but I'd strongly advise against using it in outright combat if you can avoid it. The cave dragon is assigned to Spish by the way, and while there were militia necromancers, there didn't seem to be any loyalty issues; they attacked their own undead as soon as they turned on their living allies.


My successor should probably do the following:

- Set up enough taverns to keep the necrodwarves drinking and brew some alcohol. Quick tip: since necromancers neither sleep nor eat, you can just burrow them in the general area of their work place plus relevant stockpiles and they'll work pretty much continuously; the lack of downtime meant I was extremely productive near the end of the year, though dwarves are starting to slow down from alcohol withdrawal, so we might want to let up on that.


- Keep non-necromancer immortals (ie Archereon, SpeciesUnkn0wn, and the random poets who showed up) burrowed in the lower fortress unless you manage to get a vampire. (note that if you don't want vampires draining children, you'll need to use clever burrow management.


- Note that, aside from the professional milititary (who should probably be 100% necromancer/vampire), I've put every member of the fortress who is not in a uniformed profession (ie not miners or woodcutters) into "citizen's militia" squads, so that everyone is at least carrying a weapon and, if possible, some armor/a shield.


- Come up for a plan for what to do when someone inevitably digs to deep and wakes up the circus. IIRC the top tlayer of adamantine veins are always safe to mine, but we should probably not go deeper than that except in places where its safe to dig due to there being no space for the hollow segment.


- There's a forgotten beast in the caverns; doesn't seem particularly dangerous, but I was preoccupied.


- Make sure all the entrances are properly accounted for.


- Devise a means for migrants and traders to safely enter the fortress; we have 19 citizens plus like 8 visitors or something thanks to a giant poetry troupe showing up alongside the Fall migrant wave.


- In the spirit of fortresses of yore, when it becomes feasible to embark on a megaproject, we should build a magma cannon that floods the surface (and probably also the caverns for good measure), because we arguably have more need of such a device right now than the original boatmurdered ever did.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2016, 11:49:55 pm by Archereon »
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I want to tell you they were bad men, cephalo.  I want to tell you that with a better overseer the Fortress never would've gotten so bad someone would get offed in a pointless fisticuffs.
But the sad truth charlie?
It was inevitable.

Fleeting Frames

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Re: Bloodyhells - Succession: Battlefailed #5 (42.06)
« Reply #351 on: June 28, 2016, 01:54:41 am »

War training someone you're not sure you can keep trained....What happens if it goes wild?
Well, can't be worse than pitting necromantic half of citizens against non-necromantic half, can it? n.n°

Ah, DF ‼science‼ projects....

Iirc swords are general-purpose weapons with 2 slash and 2 blunt attacks, but I see occasionally people building squads of them with specific squads present. Is it because of thematics, previous skill in the weapon or something I'm missing here?

Necromancer military acts a bit differently, hm. Not much need to worry about getting tired *gestures*, so optimizing them for initial/single target takedown seems like an untested idea.

As for taverns, I guess the main tricky thing would be to ensure that some are not overfilled while others go dry; perhaps using two-necro burrows/overlapping taverns to cater to each other - could also encourage marriages :)

Micromanagement heavy to set up, however.

As for the top layer of adamantine veins, I've certainly seen ones that are just 1 thick - so digging first up/down stair would release the hounds of hell. "Protecting" against mishaps is pretty trivial though with necromancers not needing to eat or drink to live, if one thinks Battlefailed could possibly die to some clowns.

Safe ways to enter the fortress....You mean, besides the airlock design sanctume set up?

Could also put a minecart to jump through a wall or fortification on the surface if they are unmanned, though a kea would probably steal it. Alternatively, two pressure plates followed by drophole of retracting bridge/hatch combo, second plate set to trigger on citizens, with meeting zone on second bridge. If quick-response trapavoid trap is desired, putting a nested bouncing minecart into only way in could work (dwarves get bonus to dodging carts, so they'll probably survive or explode).

Can't comment on FTW; have not tried it myself beyond accidental punctures for cavern flooding. Surface trenches to dodge into might work at smaller FPS cost, but it might be tricky to dig them without seeing the undead on surface....hold on, aren't we a submerged necromancer tower? I'm not sure flooding the world is really necessary for casualty-free ridding of undead.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2016, 01:59:29 am by Fleeting Frames »
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Spriggans

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Re: Bloodyhells - Succession: Battlefailed #5 (42.06)
« Reply #352 on: June 28, 2016, 01:55:10 am »

I haven't had time to read all the crazyness that happened in this fort.

I probably should do so, because I've read pretty words like necromancers, immortal beings, cave dragons and Death.
If I get it, there are two forts in one ?

Could someone make a tl;dr of the current fort ? :P

Looking forward for my turn. If you guys don't flood fuck the world before.
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Archereon

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Re: Bloodyhells - Succession: Battlefailed #5 (42.06)
« Reply #353 on: June 28, 2016, 12:13:37 pm »

War training someone you're not sure you can keep trained....What happens if it goes wild?
Well, can't be worse than pitting necromantic half of citizens against non-necromantic half, can it? n.n°

Ah, DF ‼science‼ projects....

Iirc swords are general-purpose weapons with 2 slash and 2 blunt attacks, but I see occasionally people building squads of them with specific squads present. Is it because of thematics, previous skill in the weapon or something I'm missing here?

Necromancer military acts a bit differently, hm. Not much need to worry about getting tired *gestures*, so optimizing them for initial/single target takedown seems like an untested idea.

As for taverns, I guess the main tricky thing would be to ensure that some are not overfilled while others go dry; perhaps using two-necro burrows/overlapping taverns to cater to each other - could also encourage marriages :)

Micromanagement heavy to set up, however.

As for the top layer of adamantine veins, I've certainly seen ones that are just 1 thick - so digging first up/down stair would release the hounds of hell. "Protecting" against mishaps is pretty trivial though with necromancers not needing to eat or drink to live, if one thinks Battlefailed could possibly die to some clowns.

Safe ways to enter the fortress....You mean, besides the airlock design sanctume set up?

Could also put a minecart to jump through a wall or fortification on the surface if they are unmanned, though a kea would probably steal it. Alternatively, two pressure plates followed by drophole of retracting bridge/hatch combo, second plate set to trigger on citizens, with meeting zone on second bridge. If quick-response trapavoid trap is desired, putting a nested bouncing minecart into only way in could work (dwarves get bonus to dodging carts, so they'll probably survive or explode).

Can't comment on FTW; have not tried it myself beyond accidental punctures for cavern flooding. Surface trenches to dodge into might work at smaller FPS cost, but it might be tricky to dig them without seeing the undead on surface....hold on, aren't we a submerged necromancer tower? I'm not sure flooding the world is really necessary for casualty-free ridding of undead.

Necromancers do get tired though; they don't need to sleep, but they do need to breathe, and will run out of breath. As far as the dragon goes, I think it should be fine; one of the migrants (the Crazy Old man of all people IIRC) was a high level animal trainer.


As for the swords, well firstly, I like swords, and secondly, I went with a mix of swords and maces. The reason for swords was because, if a macedwarf gets knocked out, there's still at least a chance a swordsdwarf will pulp the unread who can't be killed otherwise with a blunt attack. Note that, given the population of the fortress is currently quite small, we only have 5 full time militia dwarves. The citizen's militia has no standing orders for training and whatnot, it's mainly just to get everyone to carry weapons, and I'd strongly advise against trying to use them for anything beyond a last ditch defensive effort.


In my own limited time playing, there really wasn't much of a problem mixing necromancer citizens and non-necromancer citizens. Unlike invading necromancers, necro-citizens won't raise corpses unless they're being attacked, which means they can co-mingle with non-necromancers in safe areas of the fortress without any issues. Non-necromancers should, of course, not be allowed to leave safe areas.
\


I haven't had time to read all the crazyness that happened in this fort.

I probably should do so, because I've read pretty words like necromancers, immortal beings, cave dragons and Death.
If I get it, there are two forts in one ?

Could someone make a tl;dr of the current fort ? :P

Looking forward for my turn. If you guys don't flood fuck the world before.

We have 19 living citizens, and some long term visitors in the fortress. We got a book of life and death which lets us make citizens into necromancers, and the immortal beings I'm talking about are elves and goblins, neither of whom have a maxage, meaning they can't become necromancers. There isn't two fortresses in one, but non-necromancers are supposed to remain in the secure area of the fortress, which now comprises the entire interior area.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2016, 12:15:31 pm by Archereon »
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I want to tell you they were bad men, cephalo.  I want to tell you that with a better overseer the Fortress never would've gotten so bad someone would get offed in a pointless fisticuffs.
But the sad truth charlie?
It was inevitable.

TheFlame52

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Re: Bloodyhells - Succession: Battlefailed #5 (42.06)
« Reply #354 on: June 28, 2016, 02:19:33 pm »

I say axes instead of swords. I like swords, mind you, but stabbing doesn't do shit against undead and axes are better at hacking/slashing than swords.

Fleeting Frames

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Re: Bloodyhells - Succession: Battlefailed #5 (42.06)
« Reply #355 on: June 28, 2016, 02:55:07 pm »

I'd personally like picks for squishy killing, myself, but my turn is a while away and Archereon does have valid points in how he finds swords cool :p (reason enough for current overseer, for change - see next overseer(there is always change))

I meant more that before a necromancer gets tired he has his new minions take over the fighting, so no fear of overexertion.

Does the fortress have any morningstars for macedwarves?

As for the citizens' milita, I take it you outfitted them with maces, given the map?

Eric Blank

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Re: Bloodyhells - Succession: Battlefailed #5 (42.06)
« Reply #356 on: June 29, 2016, 03:00:49 am »

I'm not clear on if the raws have been modded with custom necromancers, but in vanilla necromancers appear to have the NOEXERT tag, which would mean any concerns over them needing a breather are moot.

Still havent had time to actually read any of this except this last page, but that just means more fun.
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Spriggans

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Re: Bloodyhells - Succession: Battlefailed #5 (42.06)
« Reply #357 on: June 29, 2016, 03:44:40 am »

Last time I tried playing a necromancer in fort mode, there was a bug that made undeads attack the necro who raised them...

Is it still in ? Have you succesfully raised deads in this fort yet ?
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Archereon

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Re: Bloodyhells - Succession: Battlefailed #5 (42.06)
« Reply #358 on: June 29, 2016, 05:29:49 am »

I'm not clear on if the raws have been modded with custom necromancers, but in vanilla necromancers appear to have the NOEXERT tag, which would mean any concerns over them needing a breather are moot.

Still havent had time to actually read any of this except this last page, but that just means more fun.

The wiki says necromancers need to breathe, and several tags are broken in the current update; i.e. they actually do gain attributes and skills currently despite necromancy bring meant to remove those tags.


Now that your here, I'll upload the save.
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I want to tell you they were bad men, cephalo.  I want to tell you that with a better overseer the Fortress never would've gotten so bad someone would get offed in a pointless fisticuffs.
But the sad truth charlie?
It was inevitable.

Fleeting Frames

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Re: Bloodyhells - Succession: Battlefailed #5 (42.06)
« Reply #359 on: June 29, 2016, 06:22:11 am »

....You could have PMed him, you know :p
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