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Author Topic: The Law - the ultimate suggestion  (Read 7611 times)

Ekaton

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The Law - the ultimate suggestion
« on: June 26, 2016, 08:50:38 pm »

The Law

Note that this is not final. I will update this suggestion if I have something new in mind.

I'll divide it into four categories for civs that understand more advanced concepts of the law - humans, dwarves, and perhaps elves, and three categories for tribal civs - goblins, kobolds and others.

General rules
Each of the Bold paragraphs is a law. Each of the laws can have one of the mentioned forms unless stated otherwise.


Advanced
The Constitutional Law - setting main principles, dividing power etc.
The Civil Law - dealing with property, inheritance, and also including contract law
The Criminal Law - dealing with crime & punishment
The Tax Law - taxes and its collection


Tribal
Tribal laws are really customs of the land. Those are mostly oral, known by the shamans or clanspeakers.

Constitutional Customs
Civil Customs
Criminal Customs


Advanced civs

Constitutional Law

These take the form of a written constitution. It is the easiest form for the game to keep them all in one place.
Free Cities can have their own constitutions which set the constitutional law within their boundaries, but will also acknowledgesthat the monarch is its protector and stipulates that a special tax is to be paid to him.


Bill of Rights - based on civ's values/ethics
Basically includes the rights which the civ accepts. If a certain right is not in the constitution, it is not guaranteed, so the other extreme is simply the law not covering that matter - not guaranteeing a certain right.

The right to worship freely.
The right to worship non-violent religions.

The right to free speech.
The right to not be imprisoned unless sentenced or during the prosecution.
The right to own property.
The right to be free from conscription
The right to possess arms

Rights of women - based on civ's values/ethics
They are superior to men
Equal
They can be nobles but cannot perform certain tasks, they can own property only as widows.
They can be nobles but cannot perform certain tasks and they can't own property.
They can own property, but cannot be nobles or perform certain tasks
They have no rights, and cannot be nobles and/or perform certain tasks

Rights of men - if women are superior, then one of these is chosen
They can be nobles but cannot perform certain tasks, they can own property only as widows.
They can be nobles but cannot perform certain tasks and they can't own property.
They can own property, but cannot be nobles and/or perform certain tasks
They have no rights, and cannot be nobles and/or perform certain tasks

Slavery - based on civ's values/ethics
Illegal
Legal as indentured servants for a period of up to a year/2 years/5 years/10 years/25 years
Legal, but cannot be killed
Legal, can be killed with a good reason
Legal, can be killed without a reason

Nobility
Basically - are there nobles in the civ.

Title revocation
In monarchies, can the ruler revoke titles of his nobles.

Always
If they are traitors
Never

Appointment of nobles
They are appointed by the ruler.
They are appointed by the ruler after obtaining consent of the Legislative Body.
They are appointed by the Legislative Body
They are elected by the local nobles - those who will be his direct vassals

Executive Power Holder
Who holds the Executive power:
Monarch
Guildmaster
Church leader
Elected representative
Collective body

The Executive Power holder's nomination
Primogeniture - the oldest son/daughter inherits.
Ultimogeniture - the youngest son/daughter inherits.
Seniority - the oldest man/woman in the dynasty inherits.
Chosen by gods through a ritual.
Elected by citizens
Elected by electors - if so, also how electors are chosen, or who they are if named specifically

The Executive Power holder's term
For life
Fixed period of time
Until he is defeated in combat
Until a certain event

Legislative Power Holder
Who holds the legislative power:
The Executive Power Holder
A parliament
A council of priests
A council of warriors

Legislative Power Holder's nomination
Post is inherited in a bloodline (this could be used for example to create a body of descendants of a group of warriors forming the initial council)
Members are chosen by electors - if so, also how the electors are chosen or who they are if named specifically
Members are chosen by the people
Member are chosen by the Executive Power Holder
It consists of nobles of certain ranks

The rules of passing the bills
The majority required if applicable
Is there a veto and who has the right to it. Can those be overridden? How?
Is there vacatio legis and how long is it

Commanding the military - includes deciding the course of action, appointing generals, ordering troops to be trained etc.
Executive Power Holder commands the military
Legislative Power Holder commands the military
A person chosen either by Executive Power Holder or Legislative Power Holder commands the military, for life, for a fixed period of time, or until being replaced

Power to declare war and sign peace treaty
Can belong to either power holder

Power to impose new taxes
Can belong to either power holder while another can have veto.

Local taxes
Can towns/fortresses impose local taxes?
Free cities can always impose their own taxes.

Right to mint coin
Only belong to either power holder.
Belongs to either of the power holders and fortresses/cities.
Belongs to either of the power holders and free cities.
Belongs to both of the power holders and free cities.
Belongs to both of the power holders and fortressess/cities.
No restrictions, everyone has a right to mint coin.

Judicial System - Civil Law

Only king is allowed to settle matters, but others can do so in his name if authorized by him.
Only king and nobles are allowed to settle matters, but can authorize others to do so in their name.
Only king and judges chosen by the people are allowed to settle matters.
Only judges chosen by the people are allowed to settle matters.

Judicial System - Criminal Law
There is the rule of the law, only the king is allowed to deliver justice, but others can do so in his name if authorized by him
There is the rule of the law, the king and nobles are allowed to deliver justice, but can authorize others to do so in their name.
There is the rule of the law, the king and judges chosen by the people are allowed to deliver justice. Judges reside in towns or travel through the lands.
There is the rule of the law. Only the judges chosen by the people are allowed to deliver justice.
Criminal law is arbitrary (the punishment is left to the judge entirely, with no legal boundaries). Only king is allowed to deliver justice.
Criminal law is arbitrary, the king and nobles are allowed to deliver justice, but can authorize others to do so in their name.
Criminal law is arbitrary, the king and judges chosen by the people are allowed to deliver justice.
Criminal law is arbitrary. Only the judges chosen by the people are allowed to deliver justice.

How to become a citizen
Ius soli
Ius sanguinus

Is there a petition to live somewhere or not. Perhaps you can always settle there if you want and become citizen by buying land in the town or renting a room?
Perhaps you will only be assimilated after a fixed period of time and granted rights and duties of a citizen.
Perhaps the town is so elitist that you can never become its citizen.

Perhaps only members of certain races can become citizens

Civil Law

The contract law
1. For simplicity - it is always the same.
2. A contract is always binding if signed by two parties.
3. Contracts are formed through an offer and its acceptance. No fancy stuff, terms can be negotiated.
4. Contract is void in case of misrepresentation, fraud or duress.
5. Contracts that would make sense in the game are: contract of sale, contract of lease, contract of commission (to craft something specific, like an iron sword encrusted with diamonds, the result is what's important, without craft delivered, the breaching party has to pay damages), contract of mandate (to do something specific, such as to represent someone in court, result does not matter - the party who does something must be loyal and diligent) contract of loan and contract of deposit (like in a bank if those are to be introduced).
6. To prove that there was an agreement, you need an actual piece paper on which it was written. Oral agreements can be valid if there are witnesses, but those possess less "evidence power" than a written contract.
7. Payment can take form of money or other items.
8. It must be stipulated for how long the sides have to do something or not to do something.
9. Compensatory damages are allowed.
10. Sides can stipulate that contract is only valid if something happens - such as "X will pay Y if Y marries".

Contracts would allow players to do many things. For example:
- To rent a place to live and to open their shop in.
- To order a blacksmith or a tailor to create a certain item for them.
- For someone to do something for them and do so again and again, over time.
- To agree to pay a merchant if he will travel and buy certain goods for him - the merchant does not have to be afraid that he will make a loss, the contract is protecting him. Without the contract, the ordering merchant can always refuse to pay for them.

The property law
1. Again - it is always the same, unless civ doesn't accept private ownership.
2. Basically each property has its owner or tenant. Lands without owners can be claimed freely.
3. Ownership is absolute.
4. Every property can be leased or sold, but doing so requires a contract.
5. If someone possesses property illegally, the rightful owner can initiate an action for infringement of possession and damages and an eviction can happen against a defaulting tenant or trespasser. In case of movable property the court can order for it to be handed over to the rightful owner, or order damages instead of handing over in case of the item being destroyed or lost. There is also possibility for punitive damages to be paid by the unlawful possessor to the rightful owner up to 10 times the value of the property, to discourage others from doing the same.
6. There is also action against disturbed possessions - judge can order the disturbance of possession to end - as when your neighbor floods your land with magma and court orders him to clean it.
7. Claim of ownership - judge can issue a document stating that a certain dwarf is indeed the owner of a certain land, for the purpose of it being a proof in another court.

Different actions
1. Those are always possible if the character is entitled to them and has a valid reason.
2. Action for compensation - in case of a breach of a valid contract or tort.
3. Action for rescission of contract - to unmake the contract in case of misrepresentation, fraud or duress.
4. Action for restitution
5. Petition for a divorce
6.Action for unlawful profits - in case of unlawful profits, as if when an item was stolen and used to make money.
7. Action for performance of a contract - if a contract is breached, the guilty party can be ordered by the court to finish his part of the contract or pay high punitive damages.

Civil procedure
1. To greatly simplify things - in each case the judge can either accept claim and rule that a specific action has to be done - such as paying money to someone, doing something, cease something etc. or to dismiss a claim.
2. The case is presented by the petinioner who must bring the defender himself and state what he demands. If he cannot bring the defendant due to no fault of his own, the judge can either order defendant to be brought to court or hear the case without him.
3. Either side can be represented in court by a lawyer. Afterwards the petioner has to prove his claims - as that the contract exists by showing the contract. Defendant can reject those claims and present his own evidence. Witnesses can be interrogated and different evidence can be examined.
4. Judge can order a break if it will take time to present evidence or for witnesses to arrive. Breaks can last for hours as well as for days.
5. Afterwards the judge communicates the sentence, and the sentence is written and copied by the court scribe,
6. For each claim some money must be paid to the court by the petitioner. Afterwards, the judge can order the party against it he has ruled to reimburse the petitioner.
7. Court always orders from when the sentence can be enforced by court officials instead of fulfilled voluntarily.
8. To simplify things, sentences are instantly valid.
9. Court officials are responsible for enforcing the sentences - if the court orders a breaching party to pay damages they will force the breaching party to give it to them, by force if necessary, and give it to The person to which they were awarded.
10. You have to enter your claim in a right court - in case of action against a person - it is the court where he or she lives, in case of a real estate - the nearest court from where it is. If you present the case in a wrong court, it is dismissed, but not ultimately - you are advised which court is right and the case is sent there to simplofy things.
11. After a sentence it is impossible to enter another claim against the same person for the same thing.
12. If several characters are claiming the same thing or different things connected, the sentence can for example rule for the property to be divided among those of them who have the right to it, or for an item to be sold and the money divided if several persons have the right to it. Also, if two persons breached a contract, they can both be ordered to be paid damages for one or more persons of the other party.

Manumission
In a civ that has slavery, manumissio is the way to free the slave.
It can have many different forms and civ can accept any or all of them.
Before a judge - owner has to declare the slave a free man.
Owner has to eat together with his slave and call him a free man.
Owner has to give a piece of clothing to his slave and call him a free man.
Owner has to call his slave "a friend" or "an equal".
It also might not be possible to free slaves at all or require an official permission of the ruler.

Inheritance law
1. Last will and testament might depend on character's values.
2. If he or she values family - property can be divided.
3. If he or she values strong rule - property can be inherited only by the oldest child.
4. For simplicity, if it is needed to make the game run smoothly, a rule can be set that properties are always inherited by certain persons in the civ (such as oldest sons) or with a fixed percentage (80% chance for them to be inherited by the oldest child and 20% chance to be divided among children).
5. If there are no heirs, it is sold on a public auction or taken by the ruler.

Criminal Law

Crimes
Basically what is considered to be a crime and what is not.

Rule of the law
Punishment must fit the crime and available punishment are stipulated for each crime.

Arbitrary law
If the law is arbitrary, there are no expected punishments for each crime. The judge will always choose the punishment according to his or her values.

Punishments
Public humiliation
Lashes
Fine
Imprisonment for a fixed period of time or for life
Beating
Hard labor for a fixed period of time or for life
Death penalty

Criminal procedure - non-inquisitorial
First, the criminal is brought to the court by local police force, along with all the evidence to be deposited in the courthouse.
Similarly to the civil procedure, the prosecutor presents the case before the judge, and through various evidence and his witnesses proves that the accused is guilty. Accused is presumed not guilty until he is condemned.
The accused can present his own evidence and call his own witnesses.
Afterwards the judge presents his sentence in a speech, which is later written down on an official form by the scribe.
Sentences are immediately valid, unless civ allows an appeal - to a ruler, legislative body, or to another court.
If there is an appeal, the court of appeals can uphold the sentence or change it. It does so after hearing the arguments against original sentence. New evidence is valid only if it couldn't have been produced before appeal.

Criminal procedure - inquisitorial
Judge is the prosecutor, defendant has to prove his innocence. Accused is presumed guilty until the judge acquits him. If not, he orders the punishment to be carried out.

Torture
Is confession made after being tortured legal?

Yes
Only if supplied by evidence
Never
It is a crime and the criminal has to be acquited and released


Tax Law

Basically different taxes in a certain civ or a fortress/city if they have the right to have their own taxes.

Property tax
Paid annually as a percentage of real estate's value.

Toll
Paid as a percentage of transported goods' value.
Can be paid for travelling by a certain road, crossing a bridge, or upon entering a city.

Leg tax
Tex paid per leg of each passing creature.
Can be paid for travelling by a certain road, crossing a bridge, or upon entering a city.

Poll tax
Paid as a flat amout by everyone who lives in a certain place.

Fortification tax
Paid by citizens of a fortress/city by those who are protected by its walls, fortifications etc.
« Last Edit: July 02, 2016, 04:27:42 am by Ekaton »
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Ekaton

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Re: The Law - the ultimate suggestion
« Reply #1 on: June 26, 2016, 08:52:38 pm »

Tribals


Coming soon
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Ekaton

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Re: The Law - the ultimate suggestion
« Reply #2 on: June 27, 2016, 03:36:54 am »

Fortress mode

Expedition leader

1. Has the authority to punish his dwarves according to the law, after a mini-trial if the ruler has the power to do so. If not, he can send for a wandering lawman.
2. Has the authority to settle civil cases.

Judge
1. When the site has a mayor, it has to appoint a judge and at least one court official.
2. Judge requires office and a courtroom with thrones for the judge, prosecutor/petitioner and defendant.
3. The "justice" window could contain the cases as it does now, along with witnesses and evidence box. Player should be able to pass sentence not in a dialog like in adv mode, but by choosing what kind of a sentence this is, and what to order.
4. If the civ's law stipulates that rulers are to be the judges, he arrives as the ruler's appointee.

Baron, Count, Duke, King
1. If the site has a noble, and civs laws stipulate that he is to preside over the cases, he replaces the judge.
2. Cases are heard in his throne room.

Automation
1. If the player doesn't want to be the judge in his fortress, justice is automated and judge passes sentences to the best of his abilities - his skills like judge of intent, intimidator (to make the criminal confess), logician (to find mistakes), and others. So the judge can be succesful if he has either of the abilities, although it will be best to have a combination of them - if he has a logician skill he can find mistakes, but at the same time would have been able to find that a person is lying if he's a good judge of intent and then confront him being a good intimidator, and forcing a confession.
2. With the logic it can be a test of judge's logic vs accused/defendant's logic.
3. The same method can be used if the judge is an NPC.

Justice
1. Dwarves should have a positive or negative thought when something is just or unjust, according to their ethics and values.
2. If they value justice, passing an overly harsh or a too lenient sentence will result in a negative thought, the larger the difference between what was ordered by the judge and what should be ordered, the more negative the thought - so if you order a dwarf to be hanged for stealing a piece of bread, thought will be very negative, just as if you'll set him free after murdering another dwarf. If you would order a public mockery after a theft, it would be too lenient, but not that bad, so the thought is less negative.
3. Dwarves that don't value justice should have no thought at all, unless they hate authority or value injustice - then they should always have negative thought, the more negative the harsher the punishment was.

Civil cases
1. Dwarves can sign contracts with each other and occasionally breach them.
2. Those should most usually take a form of rent, loan or contract of commission - as when they want a sword to be made for them.
3. Contracts can be signed by visitors too - for example when you have a great craftsman, a visitor could order 25 goblets made of marble of masterwork quality and pay for them 50 gold coins, 25 upfront and 25 upon delivery. Or to pay with 3 gold rings of masterwork quality,
4. Visitors will also rent rooms in your fortress and will be responsible for any damage with their money. They could even be locked until they'll pay or be forced to work for the tavern owner for free if they don't have any money,
« Last Edit: June 27, 2016, 04:18:58 am by Ekaton »
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LMeire

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Re: The Law - the ultimate suggestion
« Reply #3 on: June 27, 2016, 05:58:40 am »

Minor nitpick, your bill of rights is assuming that every civilization is either patriarchal or egalitarian. I'd think that if one extreme in civil rights could exist in a procedural generation, the other could too.
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Ekaton

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Re: The Law - the ultimate suggestion
« Reply #4 on: June 27, 2016, 06:03:23 am »

Minor nitpick, your bill of rights is assuming that every civilization is either patriarchal or egalitarian. I'd think that if one extreme in civil rights could exist in a procedural generation, the other could too.

If there is no right for individual, there is no law for it. The other extreme is the lack of any legal guarantee.
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WakeMeUp

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Re: The Law - the ultimate suggestion
« Reply #5 on: June 27, 2016, 11:45:07 am »

Epic suggestion. You the man, seriously. If it is like that in the game, I'll be in heaven.
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LMeire

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Re: The Law - the ultimate suggestion
« Reply #6 on: June 27, 2016, 10:38:38 pm »

Minor nitpick, your bill of rights is assuming that every civilization is either patriarchal or egalitarian. I'd think that if one extreme in civil rights could exist in a procedural generation, the other could too.

If there is no right for individual, there is no law for it. The other extreme is the lack of any legal guarantee.

No, I meant the extreme of women having more rights in a given society than men do. Matriarchy as opposed to patriarchy with egalitarianism/despotism in the middle. It didn't happen very often in real history, but that doesn't mean it couldn't- especially not if the species involved had inhuman biology making "might makes right" decisions have different outcomes. Spiders, for instance, the female is usually much larger than the male so a spider-person society would likely afford more rights to the female.
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Ekaton

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Re: The Law - the ultimate suggestion
« Reply #7 on: June 28, 2016, 08:12:05 am »

Minor nitpick, your bill of rights is assuming that every civilization is either patriarchal or egalitarian. I'd think that if one extreme in civil rights could exist in a procedural generation, the other could too.

If there is no right for individual, there is no law for it. The other extreme is the lack of any legal guarantee.

No, I meant the extreme of women having more rights in a given society than men do. Matriarchy as opposed to patriarchy with egalitarianism/despotism in the middle. It didn't happen very often in real history, but that doesn't mean it couldn't- especially not if the species involved had inhuman biology making "might makes right" decisions have different outcomes. Spiders, for instance, the female is usually much larger than the male so a spider-person society would likely afford more rights to the female.

Seems I've forgotten about it, wanted to do two different laws initially - onother one being the rights of men, covering the other extreme, but I've apparently forgotten about it. I'll add it to the list.

Thanks for reminding me!
« Last Edit: June 28, 2016, 08:13:54 am by Ekaton »
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Myth

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Re: The Law - the ultimate suggestion
« Reply #8 on: June 29, 2016, 01:20:01 pm »

Nothing to say. A really good suggestion send by a really imaginative user.
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Cormack

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Re: The Law - the ultimate suggestion
« Reply #9 on: June 29, 2016, 07:50:28 pm »

This is amazing! I've always wanted to be the judge in DF.
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TheDorf

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Re: The Law - the ultimate suggestion
« Reply #10 on: June 30, 2016, 10:17:38 pm »

Very well written. It also seems rather well thought out, and in a kind of raw-file-like format. I'd love to eventually see something like this in-game. Sadly, some parts seem to kind of rely on the economy being reimplemented, but others seem like they'd make sense to add along with the thief role.
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crazyabe

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Re: The Law - the ultimate suggestion
« Reply #11 on: June 30, 2016, 10:48:17 pm »

PTW
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Ekaton

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Re: The Law - the ultimate suggestion
« Reply #12 on: July 01, 2016, 05:45:40 am »

Very well written. It also seems rather well thought out, and in a kind of raw-file-like format. I'd love to eventually see something like this in-game. Sadly, some parts seem to kind of rely on the economy being reimplemented, but others seem like they'd make sense to add along with the thief role.

Thanks, I wanted to simplify things without sacrificing too much immersion that legal system can provide. I agree that civil law miht make more sense once the economy is implemented, but with contracts you don't really need money - you can pay with items of similar value, like when you are bartering with merchants in fortress mode. Even a contract to commission a certain item makes sense even without proper economy - you can for example order sets of steel armour for your party, and pay with something of value, looted on your previous adventure.

For courts, perhaps there could be criminal cases and the criminal procedure first - those will be important in the thief arc, and basically every instance of player committing a crime, although I really hope that we will get to be on the other side - to be the judge.
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Rubik

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Re: The Law - the ultimate suggestion
« Reply #13 on: July 01, 2016, 08:42:21 am »

Wow.This has been one of the best post I have read in a long time. It´s very clear and exhaustive, and will (probably) solve a lot of problems in the future, good job man
But I have 2 questions:
Most of those laws require the implementation of the economy to work, such as taxes or production contracts, as well as the moving caravan arc, so, until that is putted into the game, how will civil contracts work at all?
-If I read correctly, each contract and judge session will need a scribe to ´´make it oficial´´, and make those legal papers be archived. Could you expand a little on that part?
Could those copies be looked at after a trial to, for example, obtain information about an enemy´s penalty or anything else?
Should those copies be stored somehow to prevent thiefs, as the disappearance of a contract would render it useless?
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BorkBorkGoesTheCode

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Re: The Law - the ultimate suggestion
« Reply #14 on: July 01, 2016, 08:59:16 am »

What about right of secession?
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