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Author Topic: Future of the Fortress  (Read 717927 times)

Thebestidentity

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #480 on: August 22, 2016, 10:32:22 pm »

What are the exact benefits of being focused? What sort of penalties does the game inflict on dwarves and adventurers that are unfocused? (besides from the negative thought)
Using dfhack with a superskilled adventurer being Focused! raised my base accuracy with the same attack on the same target at the same difficult/square target from 13k > 23k, being Distracted dropped me to 9k. There is some amount of skill roll success rate but I couldn't track down where to quantify it exactly, but it feels like it is a similar size effect, call it -25% to +75%?
Toady has actually stated in a past devlog that there is a multiplier of all skills that goes from 50% to 150% based on how many needs that have been fulfilled, though usually being more moderate in effect.
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Random_Dragon

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #481 on: August 22, 2016, 11:31:38 pm »

Toady has actually stated in a past devlog that there is a multiplier of all skills that goes from 50% to 150% based on how many needs that have been fulfilled, though usually being more moderate in effect.

Can this be found? Would be nice to have the question pre-answered, after all. o3p

Max™

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #482 on: August 22, 2016, 11:58:27 pm »

Quote from: Toady One@04/12/2015
On the other side, a dwarf that has the balance of their needs satisfied will perform tasks more successfully (in addition to the positive emotions and stress reduction they get the moment a need is satisfied). Theoretically, the dwarf can go up to 150% and down as low as 50% in their effective skills, but in reality it'll be a much smaller effect either way -- it is difficult to fully satisfy every need at once (or impossible, if there are enough needs), and at the same time, needs don't become unsatisfied quickly and some are easily met.
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Random_Dragon

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #483 on: August 23, 2016, 12:18:43 am »

Ah, excellent. Now I wish I knew whether the "exp gain" idea got into people's heads. I keep citing CDDA, so it's likely I wasn't the only one and somebody guessed that it did the same thing. :V

peasant cretin

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #484 on: August 23, 2016, 06:39:59 am »

So it seems the low maintenance route is the least of all headaches regarding Adv Mode needs, as the higher end is too much need management. The benefits afforded by the high end bonus are just more easily managed by having higher skill stats (offensive/defensive) versus your opponent.

Rockphed

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #485 on: August 23, 2016, 10:04:18 am »

True. It would be better to ask what Toady's next plans are regarding the impending features that would support those ideas, and make the suggestion proper in the suggestions section.
Occasionally a Suggestion thread gets to the point where a FOTF question is appropriate.  "We have a lively thread going in the Suggestion forum about restocking aquatic creatures in the caverns, but it has polarized into a debate over whether a tree that falls in a forest with no one around to hear it makes a sound or not..."

My understanding is that Toady reads (or tries to read) every suggestion thread and takes notes.  He skims this thread and looks for green questions. Unless your suggestion thread is about something he is possibly currently working on, if it gets into an argument about minutia your best bet is to walk away and let it cool down for a while.

What temple architecture changes are on the menu for this release?  I realize that lots of things that temples probably need before a complete architecture rewrite are still not in, like having oracles and altars.
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Only vaguely. Made of the same substance and put to the same use, but a bit like comparing a castle and a doublewide trailer.

Shonai_Dweller

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #486 on: August 23, 2016, 10:09:26 pm »

Can you talk a little about point four under background changes (balance desire to display with guards/traps/etc.)? Are you going to overhaul traps at all, or will it just be cage/rock/mummy surprise for now? And guards, how will they work? Will they be expanded to guard other stuff (shops, etc) and will they be a feature in fortress mode too? Helpful to keep away the kobolds, I guess.

Also, talking of thieves, will artifact hunting adventurers be announced like kobold thieves, or will they operate more subtly, turning up like regular visitors, mercenaries/monster hunters or something?
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darklord92

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #487 on: August 24, 2016, 11:59:10 am »

Will museum zones/rooms be considered locations, and attract visitors?

Something like a museum fortress dedicated to collecting and protecting artifacts might lead to quite a bit of FUN when fortress value starts going through the roof. Having visitors to ogle them just seems like an upside to something silly like that.
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Rockphed

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #488 on: August 25, 2016, 12:42:06 am »

And guards, how will they work? Will they be expanded to guard other stuff (shops, etc) and will they be a feature in fortress mode too? Helpful to keep away the kobolds, I guess.

It has been a while since I used it, but I think military squads can be given time-dependent "stand here" or "do that patrol route" orders.  It might be nice to have locations (which should include the ruling throne room, whenever that gets added to player fortresses) have a guard number to which we can assign militia or fortress guards.  The guards would then try to be inside the location during their assigned guard duty.

Somebody should take that over to the suggestion forum and flesh it out nicely.  I just don't have the energy to find all the things that it needs to connect to.
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Only vaguely. Made of the same substance and put to the same use, but a bit like comparing a castle and a doublewide trailer.

PatrikLundell

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #489 on: August 25, 2016, 01:42:00 am »

And guards, how will they work? Will they be expanded to guard other stuff (shops, etc) and will they be a feature in fortress mode too? Helpful to keep away the kobolds, I guess.

It has been a while since I used it, but I think military squads can be given time-dependent "stand here" or "do that patrol route" orders.  It might be nice to have locations (which should include the ruling throne room, whenever that gets added to player fortresses) have a guard number to which we can assign militia or fortress guards.  The guards would then try to be inside the location during their assigned guard duty.

Somebody should take that over to the suggestion forum and flesh it out nicely.  I just don't have the energy to find all the things that it needs to connect to.
You can set up guard schedules to defend a burrow, so role playing that in a fortress can be done. However, there are no means to make areas off limits to either visitors or citizens (well, you can sort of do the latter with careful pain in the ass burrow juggling), so the guards would just stand around there watching the thieves make off with the valuables with current mechanics unchanged.
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Shonai_Dweller

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #490 on: August 25, 2016, 04:10:36 am »

And guards, how will they work? Will they be expanded to guard other stuff (shops, etc) and will they be a feature in fortress mode too? Helpful to keep away the kobolds, I guess.

It has been a while since I used it, but I think military squads can be given time-dependent "stand here" or "do that patrol route" orders.  It might be nice to have locations (which should include the ruling throne room, whenever that gets added to player fortresses) have a guard number to which we can assign militia or fortress guards.  The guards would then try to be inside the location during their assigned guard duty.

Somebody should take that over to the suggestion forum and flesh it out nicely.  I just don't have the energy to find all the things that it needs to connect to.
You can set up guard schedules to defend a burrow, so role playing that in a fortress can be done. However, there are no means to make areas off limits to either visitors or citizens (well, you can sort of do the latter with careful pain in the ass burrow juggling), so the guards would just stand around there watching the thieves make off with the valuables with current mechanics unchanged.
Yes, I think everyone's aware of what can be done already. Hence the lime green question and quote of the development notes section on 'guards and traps' for this artifact release...
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PatrikLundell

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #491 on: August 25, 2016, 07:37:21 am »

@Shonai_Dweller: It did seem Rockphed was hazy on the current mechanic, so it wasn't actually a comment on your post, which I find to be a relevant question.
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Shonai_Dweller

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #492 on: August 25, 2016, 08:29:02 am »

@Shonai_Dweller: It did seem Rockphed was hazy on the current mechanic, so it wasn't actually a comment on your post, which I find to be a relevant question.
Ah, yeah. Forgive my grouchiness. Put it down to 'heat-addlement'.
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vjmdhzgr

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #493 on: August 25, 2016, 12:55:49 pm »

Ah, excellent. Now I wish I knew whether the "exp gain" idea got into people's heads. I keep citing CDDA, so it's likely I wasn't the only one and somebody guessed that it did the same thing. :V
There was an attempt a few months ago to get a dwarf legendary in every single skill. Not just the fortress ones, as that was already done a while ago, but also the adventurer ones. They started as an adventurer, and they said that they were only able to gain skill while focused. I asked if that was really what they meant and if they were sure because I was extremely sure it wasn't necessary to be focused to gain experience, but they said that was indeed what they meant and that they had farmed some skills while not focused for a while and didn't gain any. I guess this is actually worth asking Toady about, because I've never heard any other mention of this or experienced it myself.

Is there any kind of situation that can cause an adventurer to only be able to gain skill while focused? Because supposedly it's happened to someone, but I've never seen it myself.
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FantasticDorf

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #494 on: August 25, 2016, 02:39:56 pm »

So, while everyone is getting understandably excited about displaying the corpses of their victims, Dwarven ethics (make_trophy_sapient) won't actually let this happen without modding, right?

According to the wiki, it's [ABUSE_BODIES] that controls whether or not a civ will do this. Dwarves lack this tag so they don't engage in this sort of behavior. The [MAKE_TROPHY_SAPIENT] ethic looks like it controls things like bone jewelry.

Drawing from that

> If the above quotation is true, aren't head spikes/nooses/horrible chopped up body displays basically goblin derived museum spaces meant to inflict negative thoughts deliberately upon people who witness them, but satiate goblins? How might other races prefer to display/(or not) their prized/valuable goods and decorations as culturally appropriate?


I have a few other questions in the pipeline but ill wait to space my posts out and read what i've missed given i've been absent for a little while.

Additionally somewhat relevant is this earlier question

with display cases and pedestals, will intelligent creatures react to displays of body parts with emotions?[/color] display the heads of previous sieges sort of thing. something along the lines of displaying human A's head, and human A's relative breaking into tears and getting emotional mid siege
« Last Edit: August 25, 2016, 02:51:02 pm by FantasticDorf »
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