Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[umiman]

I want to play as Red Dragon but from what I can gather they're not very good. Does someone have some suggestions for deck building as Red Dragon?

Well, Red Dragons have some pretty strong infantry options.

They've got FAGOT ATGMs, IGLA AAs, napalm rocket launchers, competent infantry carriers, etc. The infantry are all also fairly cheap and cost effective. One particularly noteworthy infantry they have is the Tanke Shashou (basically translates to Tank Killers). At a glance they may look pretty stupid with their low damage HEAT rockets but I've never been disappointed by their performance in the field. For some reason they're really, really effective.

-----

For tanks, you've got two options.

You can either go North Korean with the tried and true T-72s or the T-90 ultra tank (I don't think even the Soviets get this). Or you can go for the Chinese tanks which are all fairly fragile but super accurate. I'm more of a fan of the Chinese ones myself. I really like the ZTZ IIs and the ZTZ IIIs. There was once I singlehandedly won an entire 10v10 match with a handful of ZTZ IIIs obliterating the enemy's rear. I think they killed things so fast most people didn't realize what was going on. I really like tanks that don't miss but you can go with what works for you.

I don't recommend bringing the really garbage stuff. On paper it sounds fun to spam a hundred shitty tanks at the enemy, but I've never seen it work. A single Leopard 2 can kill dozens of Ch'onma-Hos. You'd just be donating points to them.

-----

For recon it's pretty standard stuff.

I mean, other than the women sniper team for the North Koreans. Oh, and they have a recon truck with a grenade launcher if you find that you really want to snipe infantry or something. There's no high tech stuff like the Longbow or the Akula here.

Though the Chinese do field what I like to refer to as a sniper tank. The ZTQ-62G is actually really useful in sniping high value targets like enemy recon. It's basically a ZTZ-II with better optics and less armour.

-----

Vehicles are also fairly standard stuff.

Again the Chinese do bring their pretty good tank-hunters in the PTZ line. They're alright. More of the usual Chinese philosophy of super accurate but fragile.

They also have the WZ-550. It's umm... a Longbow helicopter on wheels.

-----

Helicopters are again more standard stuff. Nothing amazing here.

North Koreans get older variants of the Soviet arsenal. Good workhorses these. Also a grenade launcher helicopter, which is always useful for clearing out infantry.

Chinese get specialized helicopters. So dedicated anti-air or anti-tank helos. They don't have any gunships other than the terribad Z-5A, so you'll have to rely on the North Koreans for that.

-----

Planes are all kinda... meh. They're cheap though, mostly.

Just bring what you'll think you'll need but don't go in expecting to win the air game with this. The MIG-29 is a fantastic and affordable workhorse though, so maybe get that at least. The J-7 line is also cheap and fast for bombers.

A lot of their planes have fairly meh accuracy though, so keep that in mind (read: get them as veterans).

-----

In conclusion, if you're getting this, you'll be focusing on spamming tanks and infantry as that's your strengths. They field cheap and affordable units so just pump them out. They do have a handful of really potent expensive stuff but really it's going to be the cheap stuff that's your core.

[Burnt Pies]

the T-90 is a T-72BU with no Svir missile. Absolutely a top tier tank, it's a really nice brawling machine. Try not to accept long range engagements vs Blufor top tiers, as their accuracy will usually carry the fight.

I'm unsure on the NK T-72. When the game was new, it was one of the best tanks of its' price point, and people clamoured for all the other tanks of that price to be made better. The opposite happened, and it languished in uselessness for a while. I think I recall it getting buffed, but I've honestly not checked it in a while. Compare it to other T-72s to see if it's actually worth it right now.

The top Chon'ma is really powerful, but very slow firing. It's... worth considering? Maybe as extra punch in a group of other tanks?

Infantry will be your bread and butter. If you don't think the map will favour infantry, it's probably best not to take the Dragons. Indications that a map favours infantry are large towns or forests stretching across the middle. Li Jian 90 are one of the finest infantry killers in the game, NK's militia squad is possibly the only one in the game to remain as a 15-man unit (and is thus a good meatshield), the chinese QW-2 is a slightly better Igla for bullying helicopters, you've got 2 sets of Marines (15 man shock trained infantry) as decent units with a short range anti-vehicle capability, the Tanke Shashou are fun and bring along a HE shell for stopping cheeky infantry pushes, the BAN TANK FAGOT remains the best named unit in the game and NK's own spec ops are no slouches, bringing along the shoulder launched AT that China's Li Jian eschew for their napalm launcher.

The WZ-550 in the vehicle tab is notable as being china's answer to things like the M1A2 or Leopard 2A5. Exceedingly long ranged and very punchy.

The chinese have one of the best anti-helicopter helis in the game. It's long ranged, accurate, powerful and fast. Made them very popular early on when the helidrop meta was king. The HOT carriers can be worthwhile if your opponent pushes tanks without AA support.

The main notable in the plane tab is that big twin engined thing with the 3000kg bomb. It'll nuke infantry and light vehicles off the map, while severely damaging and panicking any tank that survives the blast. Great fun, but it's got absolutely no ECM and will die to 2-3 missile hits. SEAD before use.

[umiman]

Man, I just love the Chinese so much.

Their units are exactly my playstyle and what I want in my units.

Affordable and reliable.

Every time I bring them out I'm never disappointed by shit like missed ATGMs or tank shots or infantry not doing what they were supposed to be doing.

I highly recommend you guys try out the Chinese if you haven't. They're basically like playing the USSR except cheaper and more fragile. And your units are basically all snipers. I actually have a Chinese infantry deck, a Chinese armoured deck, and a Chinese all purpose deck. That's how much I like them.

Strengths:
1. Cheap
2. High accuracy with good damage
3. Very versatile
4. Good tanks and infantry

Weaknesses:
1. AA game sucks, very little options and no radar missile AA.
2. Planes and helos are kinda derpy.
3. Only one supertank in the ZTZ-85-III.
4. Everything has a small gas tank.
5. No ATGM infantry.

-------

Isreal has a really scary recon unit called the Bedouin. It's basically a 10-man recon team with a super accurate, long range ATGM. It's scary as all hell.

[umiman]

Doublepost:

I just had an incredible and well deserved victory against Anvil. It was so intense and hardcore you guys wouldn't even be able to understand it. I won with LITERALLY double his points in victory score.

[Anvilfolk]

 

[Burnt Pies]

only double? Slacker!

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[Anvilfolk]

I don't have an infantry only deck 

[Burnt Pies]

Neither do I. That was just my normal E-Bloc all-rounder deck

[Anvilfolk]

So I've noticed a pattern. I tend to put all my troops in a single clump, get overwhelmed with how to get them to move/fight effectively... then the enemy notices the concentration and then I get buratino'd.

I need to start spreading my troops out more and also consider bringing big area of effect weapons, especially in maps with narrow corridors.

I tend to max out my inf slots but rarely use them all, and I seem to always bring a fob, so this might be a good change to my decks. If not buratinos, then perhaps regular ol' arty.

Though I might have to leave out some AA. Decisions decisions.

[Urist McScoopbeard]

FOBs are really only for support decks. To keep a lot of artillery supplied, etc.

[umiman]

FOBs are really only for support decks. To keep a lot of artillery supplied, etc.

Going into a 2v2, 3v3 or anything along those lines without an FOB is... a bit of a faff.

Are you going to call in supply trucks every single time you use your ATGM helicopters? Not to mention I'd rather not buy that 70 pts supply chopper multiple times.

But yeah, if there's already multiple FOBs on the field, I definitely wouldn't be bringing one.

--------

Anvil:

There's a reason why I put the Buratino on the first page of this thread. Also it used to be waaaaaaaaaaaaaay scarier. They nerfed it so hard and even after all the hits with the nerf bat it's still the best thing for getting rid of enemies in entrenched positions.

If you want to learn how to micro, I highly recommend the tactical games. When you can only use like 4 units, you will learn how to best use them.

[Anvilfolk]

Yeah, for real :/

I'm reworking my chinese deck, and am currently looking at airplanes. Need some help understanding the stats.

In particular, looking at the J-7C and J-7H. One has 2x500lb @15 HE, the other has 1x1000lb @ 20 HE. Does that mean the 2x500 does 15x2=30 damage? Seems silly, since it costs 10 less (the other change is the 1x1000lb has better AA capabilities).

Also, any intuition for exactly what "25%" accuracy means in this case would be nice. As would the fact that SAHL missiles have 0 dispersion, and yet manage to miss.

[umiman]

It's pretty simple.

If you look closely at what bombers do when they bomb, they have different payloads.

In this case, one drops two smaller bombs while another drops one big bomb (very big). If you're curious, that 1000lb bomb was the thing I dropped on you repeatedly when I beat you by DOUBLE YOUR VICTORY SCORE by hiding in a crater.

So it's not as simple as which does more damage overall. Having two bombs makes it less likely to miss and they affect a wider area. However the 1000lb bomb basically annihilates anything it touches except heavily armoured tanks.

If you take them into a skirmish game and just fiddle with them, you'll understand soon enough. You'll also see what the 25% accuracy means.

[Anvilfolk]

Yo, imma let you finish, but we both know who won that game. Punk-ass crater critter.

That was my guess. I'll test it out in skirmish. But I guess the 2x500 does more damage if both bombs actually hit the target Strange though, 'cause 20 HE isn't that much more than 15 HE. Maybe the AoE is bigger too.

[Burnt Pies]

oh, much bigger. easily twice the size.