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Poll

What religion do you follow?

Judaism
- 0 (0%)
Christianity
- 17 (23.3%)
Islam
- 1 (1.4%)
Hinduism
- 0 (0%)
Taoism
- 0 (0%)
Buddhism
- 0 (0%)
Scientology
- 2 (2.7%)
Other (please tell)
- 7 (9.6%)
Athiest
- 35 (47.9%)
Undecided
- 1 (1.4%)
Agnostic
- 10 (13.7%)

Total Members Voted: 70


Pages: 1 ... 23 24 [25] 26 27 ... 44

Author Topic: Religion discussion.  (Read 67031 times)

Grim Portent

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Re: Religion discussion.
« Reply #360 on: June 27, 2017, 02:11:54 pm »

Legal ramifications shouldn't be too hard so long as you issue a birth certificate to each new copy. If you're married, the first version of you stays married and the second does not. If you don't like that, maybe you should have thought about it before creating another human being who is you.

Assuming polyamory is legal in the relevant jurisdiction the new copy could just be added to the marriage.
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Egan_BW

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Re: Religion discussion.
« Reply #361 on: June 27, 2017, 02:13:43 pm »

Yeah, but I'd make that a separate process because we can't assume that the spouse wants to be married to two or more identical people.
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Frumple

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Re: Religion discussion.
« Reply #362 on: June 27, 2017, 06:36:39 pm »

Legal ramifications shouldn't be too hard so long as you issue a birth certificate to each new copy. If you're married, the first version of you stays married and the second does not. If you don't like that, maybe you should have thought about it before creating another human being who is you.
Maybe, but then you hit the census problem. Great heaps of civil administration would become an antediluvian bureaucratic nightmare of the sort that makes lifelong civil servants curl up in a corner and cry blood in the face of a thousand pages of the exact same name, all differentiated basically by a birthday (or, in some cases, maybe even a birth time, when several show up on the same day) and nothing else. Your greatest obstacle when it comes to implementing the methods that creates the copies would be the engineers and scientists that made it possible getting murdered by the local notary public. Even the less involved of such folks would be after blood and viscera.

... and I'm not entirely sure how much I'm joking. Because seriously, you'd need something in place to deal with that just like you would the legal issues if -- never mind the ethical or metaphysical or similar such thing aspect -- the logistics side of things wasn't going to become an example of existential sisyphean horror for anyone having to deal with it.
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TD1

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Re: Religion discussion.
« Reply #363 on: June 27, 2017, 06:47:06 pm »

It would simply be regulated in a way so as to conform to paperwork.

You can only create a copy once a year, type thing. The name for each subsequent copy must possess a different name from the "original."

Bureaucrats are better at making reality fit the paperwork than making the paperwork fit reality.
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Descan

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Re: Religion discussion.
« Reply #364 on: June 27, 2017, 09:19:43 pm »

That and tattoos/implants. :v
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Grim Portent

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Re: Religion discussion.
« Reply #365 on: June 28, 2017, 10:09:55 am »

I'm not so sure it would be that hard to deal with clone paperwork. Legally registering them as a different person from the original would be a touch tedious for all involved, but needn't be any more awkward than registering (and then dealing with) multiple identical children who are all called Bob. Which is to say it would be annoying as hell, but not legally difficult.

Say John Smith gets cloned/duplicated, you then have John Smith (A) and John Smith (B). You can copy all the relevant records of A to B and thereafter treat B as a separate entity from A, with entitlements to property arranged beforehand by A, and possibly some stuff about the original being liable for the clone's care for a period of time. They basically become twins who happen to have the same name and legal/medical history

Provided you issue B a new NIN/SSN/Whatever your country uses for tax records and paperwork tracking it shouldn't be much harder to tell John A and John B apart than it is to tell apart any other same name people with similar DNA.

The biiiiiiiiiig problem would be the counseling the majority of clones would need to cope with being the copy. Unless you clone a bunch of psychiatrists there would be a waiting list longer than the electoral roll.  :P
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There once was a dwarf in a cave,
who many would consider brave.
With a head like a block
he went out for a sock,
his ass I won't bother to save.

TheDarkStar

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Re: Religion discussion.
« Reply #366 on: June 28, 2017, 10:21:20 am »

What if someone commits a crime and then duplicates themselves?
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Grim Portent

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Re: Religion discussion.
« Reply #367 on: June 28, 2017, 10:38:28 am »

What if someone commits a crime and then duplicates themselves?

Before they've been punished? Both are liable since they should share the same legal history up to the point of cloning.

After they've been punished? Clone can't be punished because it already was essentially.
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There once was a dwarf in a cave,
who many would consider brave.
With a head like a block
he went out for a sock,
his ass I won't bother to save.

wierd

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Re: Religion discussion.
« Reply #368 on: June 28, 2017, 02:34:19 pm »

Bad plan.

See technical exploit: man commits crime norm ally punished by 50yrs prison. Clones self 50 times before sentencing. Each clone does 1 year.

Alternate:
Man still Clones self 50 times. All 51 people now in prison concurrently. Prison system collapses under overcrowding stresses on the system.

Alt 2:

Man does crime and creates clone. Man does time, clone does not.

All are bad outcomes for different reasons.

« Last Edit: June 28, 2017, 02:39:13 pm by wierd »
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MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: Religion discussion.
« Reply #369 on: June 28, 2017, 02:46:26 pm »

You call that an exploit? Oh, no no no.

Clone yourself, decapitate clone, mail clone head to police station, assume new identity and don't go to prison.
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wierd

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Re: Religion discussion.
« Reply #370 on: June 28, 2017, 02:49:43 pm »

No, you get a murder investigation.

For murdering yourself.
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MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: Religion discussion.
« Reply #371 on: June 28, 2017, 02:54:02 pm »

Ah, but they'll never suspect it! Just as it is easier to get away with murdering a random stranger because there is no tangible connection if you aren't caught red-handed, it is easy to get away with murdering yourself because the suspect list obviously does not include you. They'll waste all their time investigating your family, friends, and enemies then either give up or put an innocent person in prison instead of you.
 
Using the investigative system against itself allows one to easily get away with it.
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Quote from: Thomas Paine
To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead, or endeavoring to convert an atheist by scripture.
Quote
No Gods, No Masters.

Grim Portent

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Re: Religion discussion.
« Reply #372 on: June 28, 2017, 03:18:01 pm »

Ah, but they'll never suspect it! Just as it is easier to get away with murdering a random stranger because there is no tangible connection if you aren't caught red-handed, it is easy to get away with murdering yourself because the suspect list obviously does not include you. They'll waste all their time investigating your family, friends, and enemies then either give up or put an innocent person in prison instead of you.
 
Using the investigative system against itself allows one to easily get away with it.

If cloning was a known possibility then it would be one of the first things they'd check for.
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There once was a dwarf in a cave,
who many would consider brave.
With a head like a block
he went out for a sock,
his ass I won't bother to save.

MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: Religion discussion.
« Reply #373 on: June 28, 2017, 03:47:45 pm »

See, you say that but it's far from impossible that someone could do that now, albeit not with a severed adult head.

I wonder how much cloned human flesh you'd have to mail to a police station before they assumed you were dead.
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Quote from: Thomas Paine
To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead, or endeavoring to convert an atheist by scripture.
Quote
No Gods, No Masters.

Grim Portent

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Re: Religion discussion.
« Reply #374 on: June 28, 2017, 04:13:05 pm »

See, you say that but it's far from impossible that someone could do that now, albeit not with a severed adult head.

I wonder how much cloned human flesh you'd have to mail to a police station before they assumed you were dead.

I think it would be cheaper to just flee somewhere with no extradition and buy a good quality of life than it would be to clone enough realistic tissue to fake your own death.

Not to mention the time involved in growing human meat while on the run from the cops, let alone that your assets have probably been frozen.
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There once was a dwarf in a cave,
who many would consider brave.
With a head like a block
he went out for a sock,
his ass I won't bother to save.
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