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Author Topic: Zelda Community Mod (Beta in the Wild?)  (Read 21126 times)

D_E

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Re: Zelda Community Mod (Beta in the Wild?)
« Reply #15 on: March 21, 2017, 06:54:28 pm »
Quote from: pikachu17 on March 21, 2017, 10:10:42 am
Here's a list of every possible problem I found. A few may be intentional, and some may have been fixed since I found them(NOTE:I did this before the update right above. They might have been fixed.)

Thanks for the feedback, bug reports are welcome :)

Quote
  • I saw at least one interaction which had "IT_MANUAL_INPUT:yourself". If it is only to work on the caster, then it should not have a IT_MANUAL_INPUT.
I actually don't think I knew that you could have interactions that just happen to the caster without further input.

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  • Change the ocarina, instruments are not that simple anymore. It may even crash the game. No idea if it would, though.

I think that simple instruments like the ocarina are still acceptable, though they do look kinda funny next to the more complicated ones.  I have seen ocarinas in-game, as well as musical forms that call for them, so they seem to work at least a little.

However, the mod is having mysterious world gen crashes, and the instrument/musical form tokens are prone to causing crashes when used improperly, so I will have to examine this more closely.

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  • when a bar is a product, it should probably have "PRODUCT_DIMENSION:150". I saw this problem at pray_shield.

I'll take a pass through to make sure there are no other occurrences.   Thankfully, pray_shield isn't in use, so that specific instance won't cause gameplay problems.

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  • Instead of a reaction having [NAME:X], [SKILL:X]  and [BUILDING:NONEXISTANT_BUILDING:X], you can just remove these, and it should work. If the reason you are doing that isn't to just get the entity to use something, then tell me the specific circumstances. I'm not entirely certain that NAME doesn't need to be used.

Ah, that's another thing I didn't know, thanks :)

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  • Are you sure the entities that have reactions with adamantium as reagents actually have access to adamantium? They don't seem to have any reactions to get it.

Giving an entity a reaction with adamantium as a reagent would cause them to have access to adamantium, the same as any other reaction involving bars of metal.  However, the [SPECIAL] token on adamantium prevents it from showing up in an entity's repertoire.

I'm not sure which reactions specifically you're referring to; however, entities never get access to (for example) weapons generated only through reactions, so you won't be able to trade for (or face enemies that use) the Master Sword-type weapons, even though several entities have reactions that allow them to produce such weapons.

(Note that ADAMANTIUM was retained as the material ID for Holy Steel [out of paranoia that there would turn out to be something hardcoded that assumed a material with that ID exists], so a player-fort can use these reactions by digging down to the Pillars of the World.  This is intended to be the only way to use reactions involving ADAMANTIUM, in fact.  Most player-forts will first need to trade for digging implements from one of the digging-enabled tribes, which means that it will be at least several years before such a fort can obtain the products of these reactions, which tend to be powerful weapons.  Because the ADAMANTIUM's in-game name is Holy Steel, it is the HOLY_WAFERS reaction which is used to convert holy thread to holy wafers)

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  • Is there a reason the twilight shadowstaff has two of the same attack? After all, multi-attacks can only use one attack per weapon... I also noticed the triblade, quarterstaff, shod quarterstaff, trident, and ninja-to having this problem.

Those are included under the theory that opportunity attacks are checked for on a per-attack-entry basis, such that using a weapon with extra attack entries results in a greater number of opportunity attacks.

I have never bothered to attempt to quantify this and see if it is true, nor have I ever asked other modders if they know if it works like that.  If it's not true, then the duplicate attacks could probably be removed, at least in some cases (for stuff like the trident, were you have 1 strong attack and two weaker ones, it would at least influence how often you get an opportunity attack with the main spear vs the side-prongs).

(shadowstaffs, quarterstaffs, and shodden quarterstaffs have two bash attacks to represent the idea that, from a neutral position, the wielder can attack their opponent with either end of the weapon.  The tridents and triblades have separate attacks for all three prongs (and both edges for the triblades.  I'm not sure why ninja-tos have two stab attacks, possibly to cause the AI to stab more frequently than slashing?  It isn't like the other cases, at least)

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  • I notice that you seemed to put some gaits in c_variation_default, even though you have a c_variation_zelda. Is there a reason the gaits are not in c_variation_zelda instead?(this one isn't really a bug, it's just my inner grammar nazi)

Yeah... I should probably move those.  I think what happened there was that I wanted to keep all the gaits in one place, since when I started messing with them they were these strange new things....

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  • When I was embarking, there were two seeds that didn't seem to have any name. I don't know which two, or whether this is even your fault.

That turned out to be one of the many strange bugs resulting from the duplicate grass entry.  Irritatingly enough, the duplicate grass entry doesn't get noted in the error log if you only load the Arena. You have to load a real world before the game notices it.

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  • Shouldn't the slingshot be a whip, or at least a mace? After all, the sling is a whip... And why is the meteor hammer not a hammer? Also, why is the triblade a spear? Tri'blade' sounds like a sword to me. Of course, this part is almost certaunly my inner grammar nazi talking.

The slingshot is meant to be the 'Y' shaped type of sling, like Link's weapon in OoT (whereas the sling is meant to be the real-world weapon).  I'm not sure WHAT melee skill to use for something like that, none of them really seem to fit.  Hammer got used simply because that's what crossbows use.

A meteor hammer is a real-world martial-arts weapon, despite the name it's a heavy weight on the end of a rope, which got tossed in with the 'lasher'-type weapons 'cause that's... sorta how you use one?  Hookshots also got tossed in with 'lasher', I've been pretty loose with what I've been putting under that skill....

Your inner grammar nazi more-or-less nailed my own inner debate about what skill to class the Triblade under.  It's meant to represent the sharp-edged trident-thing Ganon is sometimes drawn using (see here for an example).  I initially had it as a sword, on the grounds that's how he's shown using it, before switching it to a spear to emphasize the trident aspect (you may notice that it has the attacks of both a trident and a sword).

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  • Could you, in some cases, use a creature_variation to the effect of
    Spoiler (click to show/hide)
    , instead of having it written down for each one?

I could, yeah.  My thinking was two-fold: 1) I needed to go through and assign the castes on a case-by-case basis, since some creatures have weirdly-named-castes, and 2) I might at some point want to tweak the frequencies (and thus the probability of the creature dropping a given item) on a per-creature basis.

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Also, I was wondering if you could have the male gerudo transform into a giant ganon pig?(well, I actually mean; do you want to? I already know it is possible.)

Quote from: Putnam on March 21, 2017, 04:05:03 pm
I don't think all male Gerudo are necessarily Ganondorf, though AFAIK both of the explicitly mentioned cases have, in fact, been Ganondorf (the one in OoT/WW/TP and the one in Four Swords Adventures).

I could do that, yeah.  Seems like it would be fun.  I have indeed been crediting the male gerudo with Ganondorf's powers, despite the fact that I also don't think all male gerudo were intended to have them.

As it stands, the "wander the world as a friendless monster" curse was intended to be the Ganon-effect (the victim of the curse turns into a Dark Beast during the new moon).  Ironically, I have spotted people with that curse hanging out in towns, so I seem to have botched the werewolf-effect somehow.  I can't remember if that bug is fixed or not :-\
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Mods I've done:
Zelda mod-mod, Beta in the Wild DF 47.04
Illithid Empire mod DF 31.25 (update canceled)
Spotter's Guide to Illithids (Genesis mod-mod) genesis 3.19a4 (update canceled)

Knight Otu

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Re: Zelda Community Mod (Beta in the Wild?)
« Reply #16 on: March 22, 2017, 07:47:16 am »
Quote from: Putnam on March 21, 2017, 04:05:03 pm
I don't think all male Gerudo are necessarily Ganondorf, though AFAIK both of the explicitly mentioned cases have, in fact, been Ganondorf (the one in OoT/WW/TP and the one in Four Swords Adventures).
Yeah, because of that, in the final version I had uploaded, I included three (well, two and a half) secrets of dark power for Ganon transformations and the like (Dark Beast (Ganon), Dark Dragon (Onox, I think?), and the incomplete Dark Fey (Veran?)), though I misunderstood the counter I was using for the transformation.
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pikachu17

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Re: Zelda Community Mod (Beta in the Wild?)
« Reply #17 on: March 24, 2017, 02:27:36 pm »
Quote from: D_E on March 21, 2017, 06:54:28 pm
Giving an entity a reaction with adamantium as a reagent would cause them to have access to adamantium, the same as any other reaction involving bars of metal.
You are incorrect. in vanilla, you can sometimes not have any iron, on account of not having iron ore, but you will always access to steel, on account of steel being a product of a reaction. Although, if you meant product, instead of reagent, yes, they would have access. And if you do have a reaction that turns RAW_ADAMANTINE(or whatever it's called) thread into ADAMANTIUM(or whatever it is called) wafers, then yes, player fort mode forts would have access to ADAMANTIUM, although world-gen would not(SPECIAL tag). I had assumed only the vanilla reaction would give adamantium, and I didn't see it in the entites.
« Last Edit: March 25, 2017, 04:58:56 pm by pikachu17 »
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Putnam

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Re: Zelda Community Mod (Beta in the Wild?)
« Reply #18 on: March 25, 2017, 12:25:12 am »
it's ADAMANTINE
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D_E

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Re: Zelda Community Mod (Beta in the Wild?)
« Reply #19 on: March 25, 2017, 11:27:52 am »
Whoops, yup to both.  (It's correctly spelled ADAMANTINE in the raws, so there's still no bug related to the spoiler metal)
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Spotter's Guide to Illithids (Genesis mod-mod) genesis 3.19a4 (update canceled)

MCreeper

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Re: Zelda Community Mod (Beta in the Wild?)
« Reply #20 on: March 28, 2017, 12:24:29 pm »
Quote from: D_E on March 04, 2017, 03:46:31 pm
Hyrulean: This is the tribe I typically play as for fortress mode.
Well, did you tested all others? Embarked as usual zoras, and get:
1.Isn't possible to bring picks on embark.
2.NO WOODWORKING LABORS.
Play as you can.  ;D
So, how to fix this thing?
« Last Edit: March 28, 2017, 12:53:10 pm by MCreeper »
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D_E

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Re: Zelda Community Mod (Beta in the Wild?)
« Reply #21 on: March 28, 2017, 07:08:07 pm »
Quote from: MCreeper on March 28, 2017, 12:24:29 pm
Quote from: D_E on March 04, 2017, 03:46:31 pm
Hyrulean: This is the tribe I typically play as for fortress mode.
Well, did you tested all others? Embarked as usual zoras, and get:
1.Isn't possible to bring picks on embark.
2.NO WOODWORKING LABORS.
Play as you can.  ;D
So, how to fix this thing?

I have played fortresses as all tribes.  Unless I broke something, all of them should be playable, though some of them may be annoying. 

1) No picks is on purpose.  Most civs have to trade for them from one of the handful of digging-enabled tribes, or live entirely on the surface.

2) No woodworking labors is also on purpose.  Zora can do most of what the other tribes can do using wood with the bone, horn, pearl, and shell furniture workshops.

My advice for playing zora:

1) Embark with at least 20-30 pieces of wood.  It's cheap and you'll have to trade for more (no woodcutters), so may as well bring a lot to start.

2) Embark with a large herd of butcher-able animals.  I brought dogs and sheep.  Bring a lot of females (since you'll want lots of babies), and more than one male of each species, so if a random monster eats a male you'll still be ok.

3) Build a butcher's workshop and a bone furniture workshop (because of a copy-paste error, furniture workshops are built by mechanics >_<).

4) Butcher one of your animals, and use the furniture workshop to turn it into bone blocks.  One dog produced over 100, due to me not having revised how the reactions work after the "one stack = one product" DF bug was fixed.

5) You're now started.  I suggest walling off, since your millitary is probably going to suck for a long time (no ability to bring ore, so good armor and weapons until you can get trade up.

If you did a quick-start embark:

1) Deconstruct the wagon

2) Use the three pieces of wood to build a butcher shop and bone furnature shop, as above

3) Butcher one of the starting pack animals

4) Convert it to bone blocks as above.

5) Build a trade depot and a walled area, and try to get trade going.

5b) Farm or fish for food, and use a cook to generate wealth for trading.

I'll have to take a pass through the reactions, so that each bone furniture workshop reaction doesn't use up a whole stack of bone anymore.
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Mods I've done:
Zelda mod-mod, Beta in the Wild DF 47.04
Illithid Empire mod DF 31.25 (update canceled)
Spotter's Guide to Illithids (Genesis mod-mod) genesis 3.19a4 (update canceled)

D_E

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Re: Zelda Community Mod (Beta in the Wild?)
« Reply #22 on: April 08, 2017, 05:27:19 pm »
Put up an update

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Followed the lead of... I think Adventurecraft? ...and added joint bodyparts to all bodies.  I didn't make the neck a joint, though.

Fixed the build tasks of the furniture workshops

Made charcoal furnaces a furnace instead of a workshop

Made -fos animal people have the EVIL tag

Fixed bug where domestic animals had invalid blood and other materials

Fixed bug where stalchildren can see without heads

Added book or scroll making reactions to entities that lacked them.
-Many entities still don't seem to write books in world-gen :(

Revisited Zora civ, fixing their furniture reactions and giving them a charcoal-producing reaction at the charcoal furnace

Revisited Feathered Zora civ.  Enabled wood-working jobs on them.  With their furniture workshops, woodworking, and mining enabled, they are a very well-rounded civ.

Fixed a bug where the Twili civs didn't get twilight staffs.  Gave the twilight civs footwear.

Gave the Dark Tower Twili civ the obsidian producing reaction
-I'm actually not sure if that civ is at all playable.  They may not have the utility nobles.

Fixed bug where Maskmakers couldn't revive 'Sister' gerudo castes as matching undead.

Changed chausses such that they can be made of chain mail.

Allowed maces to be made of stone

Added penetration values to blunt weapons, now that I know those are necessary to cause internal injuries from ribs etc. puncturing organs.

Lowered attack/recovery times for large weapons

Gladius swords shouldn't be able to be made of stone

Move saffron crocus out of the caves

Make amber cap mushroom dye

Made magic mushrooms more frequent

Fix deku tree ammo bug, add deku flower growths, and increase frequency

Add thread and paper to Twilight Temple resource generation

Fix entity resource-granting reactions


Note: I tested removing Ocarinas it didn't fix the crash bug :(
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Mods I've done:
Zelda mod-mod, Beta in the Wild DF 47.04
Illithid Empire mod DF 31.25 (update canceled)
Spotter's Guide to Illithids (Genesis mod-mod) genesis 3.19a4 (update canceled)

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Re: Zelda Community Mod (Beta in the Wild?)
« Reply #23 on: May 10, 2017, 08:16:19 pm »
I seem to have located the cause of the crash bug.  I have world gens that run now for as long as I let them without crashing.

The cause was.... all of the wild animals.

Wut ???

Not the megabeasts or the night creatures or the civilized races, mind.  The wild animals.

Are castes/itemcorpses KNOWN to cause world gen crashes when used on wild animals?  It seems to be linked to the system I used to make creatures randomly drop items when they die.
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Mods I've done:
Zelda mod-mod, Beta in the Wild DF 47.04
Illithid Empire mod DF 31.25 (update canceled)
Spotter's Guide to Illithids (Genesis mod-mod) genesis 3.19a4 (update canceled)

pikachu17

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Re: Zelda Community Mod (Beta in the Wild?)
« Reply #24 on: May 16, 2017, 10:14:29 am »
I have no idea why the wild animals cause crashes. Would you like the raws for a working wallmaster? I could also make like-likes, if you like(hah, pun).
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Re: Zelda Community Mod (Beta in the Wild?)
« Reply #25 on: May 27, 2017, 03:09:12 pm »
I've posted a new version.  World gen is now fixed.

Quote from: pikachu17 on May 16, 2017, 10:14:29 am
I have no idea why the wild animals cause crashes. Would you like the raws for a working wallmaster? I could also make like-likes, if you like(hah, pun).

Didn't see this until now.  If you post it, I'll probably incorporate it.  This is, after all, the community Zelda mod :)
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Mods I've done:
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Spotter's Guide to Illithids (Genesis mod-mod) genesis 3.19a4 (update canceled)

pikachu17

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Re: Zelda Community Mod (Beta in the Wild?)
« Reply #26 on: May 31, 2017, 09:13:57 am »
Yeah, I'll give you the wallmaster raws soon. I haven't yet made like-likes, so I'll have to do that. Would you like my raws for bellum?
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pikachu17

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Re: Zelda Community Mod (Beta in the Wild?)
« Reply #27 on: June 06, 2017, 10:46:53 am »
I have a question. Are you going to include versions of creatures, who are radically different in one game from the norm? Like, for instance, the reaper wizzrobe from Phantom Hourglass, and the icey fire gleeok also in PH?

here are the raws I promised. You may want to tweak some of it. For instance, you may want to make bellum nearly invulnerable to non-phanton steel weapons.
put this in a b_detail_plan file
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
put this in a body file
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
put this in a creature file
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

put this in an interaction file
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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Re: Zelda Community Mod (Beta in the Wild?)
« Reply #28 on: June 08, 2017, 11:54:29 am »
Re different versions of creatures: Currently I have included "Great Sea" Iron Knuckles as a different creature than regular Iron Knuckles (also, River Zora monsters + Zora civ).

Re Bellum + phantom steel weapons: Probably I'll make him more resistant to non-holy weapons, but not totally invulnerable.  I'd also make him vulnerable to all the holy weapon types (ie, master swords, holy (adamantium) swords, etc.) since not all civs have access to phantom steel.

I've also only ever played the console Zelda games, actually, which means I don't know a lot about PH enemies.

Didn't Bellum also have some sort of phantom knuckle creation ability?
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Mods I've done:
Zelda mod-mod, Beta in the Wild DF 47.04
Illithid Empire mod DF 31.25 (update canceled)
Spotter's Guide to Illithids (Genesis mod-mod) genesis 3.19a4 (update canceled)

pikachu17

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Re: Zelda Community Mod (Beta in the Wild?)
« Reply #29 on: June 08, 2017, 04:10:45 pm »
Bellum takes Linebeck(who is a NPC), and possesses him, and that somehow turns hims into an awesome phantom. I decided not to try to mod this in, as turning two creatures into one would actually involve destroying one, and I decided not to do that, as he already gets to petrify people.
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A warforged bard named Gender appears and says"Hello. I am a social construct."
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