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Author Topic: No-armor tactics  (Read 3013 times)

Jenz

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No-armor tactics
« on: June 08, 2017, 02:31:58 pm »

Im quite new to adventure mode, but i suddenly got super-exited for rougelikes (like seriously bad).

And i wonder about something, you see that i find armor kinda boring.

- Firstly i wonder, are there any downsides to wearing armor (weight or so)?
  Considering this is dwarffortress I guess so but, i dunno...

- Secondly i wonder is there any specific tactics that let you
  get the most out of the upsides?
(if there are any)

And that was all really, I think, almost.
« Last Edit: August 07, 2017, 04:01:31 pm by Jenz »
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Ziusudra

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Re: No-armor tactics
« Reply #1 on: June 08, 2017, 03:55:52 pm »

Yes, the weight will slow you down. But, the Armor User skill will offset that.

To get the most out of armor you need full coverage and as many layers as possible.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2017, 04:01:11 pm by Ziusudra »
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Jenz

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Re: No-armor tactics
« Reply #2 on: June 09, 2017, 05:47:41 am »

Thank you, but the other thing i wanted to know is: are there any good tactic that requires or is better with light or no armor?
Or i could just put it like this: How do i get the most out of no armor?
Glad to see this awesome game has an active community.
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Arthropleura

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Re: No-armor tactics
« Reply #3 on: June 09, 2017, 07:21:26 am »

Thank you, but the other thing i wanted to know is: are there any good tactic that requires or is better with light or no armor?
Or i could just put it like this: How do i get the most out of no armor?
Glad to see this awesome game has an active community.

In my experience, there really isn't any advantage to not wearing as much armour as wont slow you down.
Simply spending some time leveling armour skill lets you wear some pretty extensive armour without any real negatives.

The only positive I can think of to not wearing it, is increased carry weight, maybe. As you would no longer be carrying that weight.
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mikekchar

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Re: No-armor tactics
« Reply #4 on: June 09, 2017, 08:48:17 am »

There are strategies to compensate for not having armour, but sooner or later someone is going to get a lucky shot in.  The way DF works is that as soon as you get a fairly major injury, your fighting is highly impaired.  That one lucky shot leads to more openings and slowly your opponent whittles you down.  At the same time, when you are impaired, you ability to hit back is compromised.  It can all snowball pretty fast.  So as Arthropleura said, enough armour so that it doesn't slow you down is always recommended.

Layering is very useful too.  Leather will cushion blunt impacts, chain will stop piercing attacks and plate will stop slashing attacks.  Ideally you will have full coverage (see the armour section of the wiki for an explanation) with leather underneath, then chain and then plate.  My normal strategy is to get the best leather I can find.  Then the next priority is high boots, guantlets and helmet with the best metal I can find.  Then chain mail and finally plate with the best metal I can find.

Read the Kisat Dur thread for strategies on combat.  Things like observation skill is very nice for avoiding getting hit and works will with wrestling because you can intercept attacks.  Having a shield helps immensely before you are skilled enough to parry with your weapon.  Dodging skill is also very important.  A very important thing to understand is that you can't dodge if you are wrestling (or being wrestled), so if you have no armour and no shield, you need to minimise the amount of time you are being wrestled.

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VislarRn

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Re: No-armor tactics
« Reply #5 on: June 09, 2017, 12:38:28 pm »

Thank you, but the other thing i wanted to know is: are there any good tactic that requires or is better with light or no armor?
Right-now the basic justification for no armor is just being a bad-ass.
Because amount of armor is inversely proportional to levels of badassery.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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Jenz

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Re: No-armor tactics
« Reply #6 on: June 09, 2017, 01:01:28 pm »

Thank you all for the answers! Ill make the most out of them. ^^
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gnome

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Re: No-armor tactics
« Reply #7 on: June 11, 2017, 02:04:40 pm »

My tactic is to play as a Rhinoman, because then arrows bruise me and bounce off my hide instead of cripple me every time. Other than that though I'd say just play defensively, always be on the lookout for the option to dodge, block, or parry when an enemy is indicated as preparing to attack you. I've survived some pretty grizzly situations with much more powerful entities than I just because I rolled away at exactly the right time - invest a lot into dodge skill, and also I think your kinesthetic sense and your agility play into that as well.
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Jenz

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Re: No-armor tactics
« Reply #8 on: June 11, 2017, 04:45:17 pm »

Now, this was interesting! Thanks!
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Nep Nep

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Re: No-armor tactics
« Reply #9 on: June 11, 2017, 05:29:57 pm »

for the four "main" races (human, dwarf, elf, and goblin), a good tactic would be to become a vampire (as they become much tougher and can be as simple as toppling a statue), and or be stealthy and take out things without them noticing you.
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Jenz

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Re: No-armor tactics
« Reply #10 on: June 12, 2017, 01:05:02 am »

What are the fastest way to kill someone?
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FakerFangirl

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Re: No-armor tactics
« Reply #11 on: June 12, 2017, 01:17:32 am »

The best reason to not have armor is being an elf with no good equips. You get a crappy weapon too ;)

Fastest way to kill someone is ambushing them from behind with a divine battle axe. Though you usually can't get divine materials without hacks and I don't think a divine battle axe would spawn anyway.

Soooooooo I'd just equip a silver battle axe and dodge-spam plus use the ',' key to notice incoming attacks at the earliest possible moment so that you can keep kiting a large group of enemies.

If they notice you, lop-off a foot and go for the neck with a hack or a slash. If they're armoured... Lop off the other foot and they will bleed-out. You gotta completely dismember each foot with bogeys or they won't bleed. Also you can toggle charge attacks against small enemies (bogeys). The battle axe is my favourite weapon because it lets me chop trees.

Also try wrestling weak forest creatures to train your dodge, shield, and attributes before recruiting companions.

Careful though. It will raise their stats as much as it raises yours, so you can get grimelings going on killing sprees.

Throwing rocks at the ground is also good for attributes. Actually apparently legendary throwers can throw coins for extremely high damage. But it obviously weaker at melee range since you can't dodge or shield at the same time, and you can't target a specific body part.

tl;dr - good no armor tactics include raising shield and dodge to legendary before recruiting companions, and raising throwing to legendary.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Also, cloaks. Lots and lots and lots of cloaks. And hoods!
« Last Edit: June 12, 2017, 01:19:14 am by FakerFangirl »
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Jenz

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Re: No-armor tactics
« Reply #12 on: June 12, 2017, 01:58:55 am »

OK, sounds good :D, cloaks are cool
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peasant cretin

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Re: No-armor tactics
« Reply #13 on: June 12, 2017, 07:55:03 pm »

Besides stat comparison (your dodger skill/shield user skill versus opponent attack skill), position or facing is one of the main factors in whether you get hit or not.

For example, if you have ambush mode on (shift + s), you can see the direction of your opponent's facing or vision arc. When you're in the red zone, your opponent is squared up and facing you. To get attacks from the side you need to be in the yellow. Outside of the arc, you'd get attacks from behind. Attacks from the side and behind receive some nice bonuses to hit.

So reverse that perspective in terms of your own defense. While you can't see your own vision arc, your facing is determined by your last action and is most easily controllable if you have your auto-dodge preference set to stand ground. Stand ground means you choose to remain in the same tile in response to the enemy attack and usually you'll favor blocking with shield.

Auto-dodge preference set to move around will cause your character to leave the tile they're currently occupying. That's more trouble to manage, since that requires menu checking and being more aware of your environment, as not all dodge directions will be available and not all will be safe.

By keeping your opponent(s) in front of you, you up your chances of not being hit. There are a couple of other factors, but aside from stats, positionóboth yours and theirsóis something you can control.

Killgoth

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Re: No-armor tactics
« Reply #14 on: June 12, 2017, 09:16:22 pm »

I like playing as a werecreature who only wears helmets and leather armor. That way you can heal up once a month from anything that didn't kill you.
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