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Author Topic: Hive Race: The Hive  (Read 37613 times)

10ebbor10

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Re: Hive Race: The Hive
« Reply #405 on: August 20, 2017, 01:04:50 pm »

There are smarter steps.

The Vespa is like inventing the sword by stabbing a metal spike through your foot.

As a combat design, the Vespa will be entirely useless, and almost certainly counterproductive. If you want flight, just vote for a develop wings idea. Don't waste our design action on a unit that we'll never deploy.
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Strongpoint

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Re: Hive Race: The Hive
« Reply #406 on: August 20, 2017, 01:07:22 pm »

10ebbor10 At this point I am ready to vote for anything that is not a new drone and can win because new drone is awful for the current situation. Sadly, I doubt that your tactics proposal will get enough votes because it is not fancy enough.
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10ebbor10

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Re: Hive Race: The Hive
« Reply #407 on: August 20, 2017, 01:10:29 pm »

On a side note, the GM has said that the forest Queen would literally produce 45 workers.

So the forest princess idea is a no-go.
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10ebbor10

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Re: Hive Race: The Hive
« Reply #408 on: August 20, 2017, 01:15:38 pm »

Quote
Queen Design:
"Anatress": (1) Shadowclaw
"Novico": (2) Flazeo25, Crazyabe
"Forest Princess" N.S.C.: (3) RAM, Wolfchild, Puppyguard
"Silvia": (0)
"Lamana": (1) strongpoint

Designs:
Bombardier: (1) Shadowclaw
Revencher: (2) Flazeo25, Crazyabe
Vespa: (3) RAM, Wolfchild, Puppyguard
No Design : (1) NUKE9.13
Mace tail
Advanced digging
Farming
Darter Caste: (1) Blood_Librarian
Bows (1) Strongpoint
Tactics : Penetration of the center (1) 10ebbor10

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Strongpoint

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Re: Hive Race: The Hive
« Reply #409 on: August 20, 2017, 01:18:00 pm »

On a side note, the GM has said that the forest Queen would literally produce 45 workers.

So the forest princess idea is a no-go.
In fact we can make her use 100% of timber as a free action so make it 90 + add 6% from larvae mitosis. Still useless.

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10ebbor10

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Re: Hive Race: The Hive
« Reply #410 on: August 20, 2017, 01:25:12 pm »

On a side note, news from the GM.

The queen is the size of a 2 story house. That makes all our proposals hilariously undersized.

Quote
Queen Design:
"Anatress": (1) Shadowclaw
"Novico": (2) Flazeo25, Crazyabe
"Forest Princess" N.S.C.: (3) RAM, Wolfchild, Puppyguard
"Silvia": (0)
"Lamana": (1) strongpoint

Designs:
Bombardier: (1) Shadowclaw
Revencher: (3) Flazeo25, Crazyabe , 10ebbor10
Vespa: (3) RAM, Wolfchild, Puppyguard
No Design : (1) NUKE9.13
Mace tail
Advanced digging
Farming
Darter Caste: (1) Blood_Librarian
Bows (1) Strongpoint
Tactics : Penetration of the center (1) 10ebbor10
« Last Edit: August 20, 2017, 02:09:36 pm by 10ebbor10 »
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NUKE9.13

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Re: Hive Race: The Hive
« Reply #411 on: August 20, 2017, 02:08:14 pm »

Quote
Queen Design:
"Anatress": (1) Shadowclaw
"Novico": (2) Flazeo25, Crazyabe
"Forest Princess" N.S.C.: (3) RAM, Wolfchild, Puppyguard
"Silvia": (0)
"Lamana": (1) strongpoint

Designs:
Bombardier: (1) Shadowclaw
Revencher: (3) Flazeo25, Crazyabe, 10ebbor10
Vespa: (3) RAM, Wolfchild, Puppyguard
No Design
Mace tail
Advanced digging
Farming
Darter Caste: (1) Blood_Librarian
Bows (1) Strongpoint
Tactics : Penetration of the center (2) 10ebbor10, NUKE9.13
Better tactics sound good. Still can't decide on a Queen design to support, though.
EDIT: But it definitely won't be the Forest Princess design. Come on, people. An added 90 manpower* is not worth a die. We aren't doing a forest queen.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2017, 02:21:26 pm by NUKE9.13 »
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Strongpoint

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Re: Hive Race: The Hive
« Reply #412 on: August 20, 2017, 02:20:18 pm »

Quote
Queen Design:
"Anatress": (1) Shadowclaw
"Novico": (2) Flazeo25, Crazyabe
"Forest Princess" N.S.C.: (3) RAM, Wolfchild, Puppyguard
"Silvia": (0)
"Lamana": (1) strongpoint

Designs:
Bombardier: (1) Shadowclaw
Revencher: (4) Flazeo25, Crazyabe, 10ebbor10, strongpoint
Vespa: (3) RAM, Wolfchild, Puppyguard
No Design
Mace tail
Advanced digging
Farming
Darter Caste: (1) Blood_Librarian
Bows ()
Tactics : Penetration of the center (2) 10ebbor10, NUKE9.13
Still don't want a new drone but this is a lesser evil kind of vote.
Will change my vote if I see any build on ANY hive-vide design. If there are ones who want to vote this way you better do it now.
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flazeo25

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Re: Hive Race: The Hive
« Reply #413 on: August 20, 2017, 02:21:59 pm »

Thoughts on edited queen design?
Novico (v2):
Gross Physical Anatomy: About same height as our current queen with body similar to that of the soldier drones, she has her two thin and long serrated club like forelimbs higher up on the body with a short spinal tail to provide balance. Her body consists of few layers of mixed carapace to provide protection. When immobile her abdomen swells up produce a long egg sac for laying eggs from her rear. As for her head she has thickened ridges on top of her head with pairs of multi-faceted eyes along with dark IR spots surrounding each eye.

Nutrition: She has obligate carnivorous digestive system like the previous queen but through the use of managing the different strains of bacteria to reduce metabolically waste of food and egg laying.

Environmental Tolerance: While mobile she has same tolerance of that of average drone, but requires a stable temperature when she is in process of egg laying to maintain good egg quality and laying rate.

Defenses: She relies on few but highly trained honour guard of Soldiers and few spitters which both have IR than non honour guard brethren to provide her back up against intrusions.

Personality: She is warm towards her children and those of her kind, but is a cunning and outright cruel in dealing with outsiders she also possess a sort of free spirited thought process and has strong distaste for humanity.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2017, 02:40:17 pm by flazeo25 »
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NUKE9.13

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Re: Hive Race: The Hive
« Reply #414 on: August 20, 2017, 02:38:49 pm »

Quote
Queen Design:
"Anatress": (1) Shadowclaw
"Novico": (3) Flazeo25, Crazyabe, Novico
"Forest Princess" N.S.C.: (3) RAM, Wolfchild, Puppyguard
"Silvia": (0)
"Lamana": (1) strongpoint

Designs:
Bombardier: (1) Shadowclaw
Revencher: (4) Flazeo25, Crazyabe, 10ebbor10, strongpoint
Vespa: (3) RAM, Wolfchild, Puppyguard
No Design
Mace tail
Advanced digging
Farming
Darter Caste: (1) Blood_Librarian
Bows ()
Tactics : Penetration of the center (2) 10ebbor10, NUKE9.13
I'm still not in love with Novico, but it is at least not egregiously bad.

Seriously, why is anyone still voting for the Forest Princess? We are not going to waste a die on a forest queen, so all her foresty adaptations are useless.
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RAM

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Re: Hive Race: The Hive
« Reply #415 on: August 20, 2017, 03:10:35 pm »

Well I think that it is inefficient. It has large weapons and intensive eyes that are only good for combat. If a queen is in combat then things have gone wrong. The omnivorous thing is good for overall effectiveness, but the queen is a "bottle neck" that needs, and can be provided with, intensive nutrition. We can use feeder drones and such and rely upon them for-
- I wonder if using the plant-eating is actually a technical requirement of a forest queen, can we have clarification on that?
The environmental tolerance is nice, but could be expensive. Her guards are expensive, and I.R. is probably less of a factor in an underground lair, where she will likely be stationed.
She is explicitly cruel to outsiders, with no mention of whether this includes children of other queens... She is heavily specist, which, well, year, humans are terrible and need to be broken, but complete extinction seems wasteful. They are clearly well-suited to slavery and we could probably keep some as pets in some sort of nature preserve. Who knows what sort of exciting new biologies we could develop by studying how they work! Complete destruction of everything non-hive, while fun, is just inevitable stagnation and boredom. I am not above going a little overboard in the spirit of revenge, but we really should leave ourselves the capacity for preservation of diversity.

So, It really doesn't suit my tastes, that said, there is a popular move towards "forest queens be useless", and that is pushing for technology more than good queening, so I can see that it would be useful in that regard. I prefer to make a queen a good queen, capable of defending a forest without being too energy-hungry or having anything short of our fastest-generating digestive process. but it does have value if one is looking for something else.

I think that Darters and Bows are comparatively weak while we have terrible eyesight. We have splash damage that works, and a massed-fire tactic of all of our workers firing would be effective, but it would introduce inefficiency, we would have fewer workers in total, likely for only a single ranged attack. It certainly could be worth it, but considering that our workers actually work, making them too impressive is sort of awkward. We will keep having to designate worker workers and combat workers. Really, given the poor eyesight, I feel that Darters would be more of a "charge" than "ranged" by inflicting a sudden attack immediately prior to engaging. I do not really want to just get long-range eyes. We could likely get some sort of hivemind-mapping that could be used to transmit target data at a distance... I guess we will probably need eyes at some point but they just feel ickily archaean...

I think that wasting a die on a forest queen would be good, assuming that we will be putting more effort into refining our wood digestion. It should only take a couple of revisions to get X.E.D.S. working and maybe another to get some sort of honey production? We can research ways to improve our forestry. We HAVE researched ways to improve our forestry, like, two full designs, it is pretty much our "thing" at this point. Also, terain advantages, a queen designed to support forest combat should act as a defensive bonus. We are severely understaffing that front and in no mood to reallocate resources so a fortification over there would be advantageous. If their fort holds then we will stagnate and eventually lose ground. Novico, while good for learning more about biology, is pretty much egregiously bad as a food queen, with a lot of energy expended on making it combat viable when a queen, especially a food queen, should never be in the presence of the enemy.
Also someone called themselves "Novico", which might confuse folk down the line somewhere.
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Strongpoint

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Re: Hive Race: The Hive
« Reply #416 on: August 20, 2017, 03:12:12 pm »

RAM, we don't need a forest queen, especially queen to support forest combat.
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Puppyguard

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Re: Hive Race: The Hive
« Reply #417 on: August 20, 2017, 03:15:27 pm »

Quote
Queen Design:
"Anatress": (1) Shadowclaw
"Novico": (4) Flazeo25, Crazyabe, Novico, Puppyguard
"Forest Princess" N.S.C.: (2) RAM, Wolfchild
"Silvia": (0)
"Lamana": (1) strongpoint

Designs:
Bombardier: (1) Shadowclaw
Revencher: (4) Flazeo25, Crazyabe, 10ebbor10, strongpoint
Vespa: (3) RAM, Wolfchild, Puppyguard
No Design
Mace tail
Advanced digging
Farming
Darter Caste: (1) Blood_Librarian
Bows ()
Tactics : Penetration of the center (2) 10ebbor10, NUKE9.13
Swapped from forest princess due to small size.
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NUKE9.13

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Re: Hive Race: The Hive
« Reply #418 on: August 20, 2017, 03:20:24 pm »

RAM, forest queens are not worth it. A maximum of 90 manpower is not worth it.
Could we increase that number? Yes, but those dice could be better spent elsewhere.
Does that mean we've wasted our ruminant digestive design? No, that also (in fact, primarily) increased our regular food production. 
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Strongpoint

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Re: Hive Race: The Hive
« Reply #419 on: August 20, 2017, 03:32:05 pm »

Quote
Queen Design:
"Anatress": (1) Shadowclaw
"Novico": (4) Flazeo25, Crazyabe, Novico, Puppyguard, strongpoint
"Forest Princess" N.S.C.: (2) RAM, Wolfchild
"Silvia": (0)
"Lamana": (0)

Designs:
Bombardier: (1) Shadowclaw
Revencher: (4) Flazeo25, Crazyabe, 10ebbor10, strongpoint
Vespa: (3) RAM, Wolfchild, Puppyguard
No Design
Mace tail
Advanced digging
Farming
Darter Caste: (1) Blood_Librarian
Bows ()
Tactics : Penetration of the center (3) 10ebbor10, NUKE9.13,

Voting for a queen. Edit: changed my mind again
« Last Edit: August 20, 2017, 03:48:14 pm by Strongpoint »
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They ought to be pitied! They are already on a course for self-destruction! They do not need help from us. We need to redress our wounds, help our people, rebuild our cities!
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