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[Hugo_The_Dwarf]

That's pretty interesting. I think I'll just have one version of elves for now. But maybe split the goblins similar to your elves (mountain goblins, forest goblins, desert goblins) I know I may do the same for humans (ocean, desert, tundra, plains/forest) things like nords, Asians, African, European. Only gripe is they wouldn't interbreed. But may see diversity via immigration. Just no interracial relationships  


I like your suggestions.

Pretty sure they’d still interbreed as long as you keep them as one species, only changing around the entity parametres. It’d be relatively rare though as they only change civs when conquered (I believe).

Yeah I can caste it out, but then if I had future plans I won't be able to custom sprite them. So it's more of a do I keep them as one creature and as castes so I can keep the breeding between them (as humans it's obvious that's possible)  but this issue already strikes vanilla mules, since you can't breed a horse with a donkey and get a mule, mules just magically exist (limitation).

I think I will split them as separate creatures, and hope in future updates there will be a "Can also mate with creature, and produce creature:caste:chance" as that will open up even more modding options, but that's a hope

[TomiTapio]

That's pretty interesting. I think I'll just have one version of elves for now. But maybe split the goblins similar to your elves (mountain goblins, forest goblins, desert goblins) I know I
I like your suggestions.

Yeah, Deon did well with the
forest elf / swamp elf / desert elf / nord humans / knight historykeeper humans / orc samurais
beastmen / mind flayers / serpentfolk / centaurs / scavengers(like kobolds) / kobolds / goblins (now three subspecies).
I just do the fine-tuning and additions to OldGenesis.

[Hugo_The_Dwarf]

Updated OP with progress.

I added some attacks, would there be any other attacks that could be added? right now fights read like it's some action movie wild brawl. With some more rare power attacks (headbutt and thrust kicks are powerful, grasp attack (blunt grapple) is strong due to the "shakes around by")

Quick list of attacks:
Punch
Backhand
Grasp
Elbow
Kick (Front Kick/Standard Schoolyard Kick)
Thrust Kick (Big boot)
Knee
Headbutt
Bite
Scratch

[TomiTapio]

Hmm how quick would these be... here's my estimates:

2:2 JabPunch
3:2 Backhand
1:2 Grasp
-- 3:5 Grasp and shake
3:2 Elbow
4:3 Kick (Front Kick/Standard Schoolyard Kick)
4:4 Thrust Kick (Big boot)
3:3 Knee
3:3 Headbutt
2:4 Bite
1:2 Scratch

5:4 buttslam / sit on
3:2 uppercut punch
4:4 wild swing pummel fist

[Hugo_The_Dwarf]

So far I have them as:

Attack	Prepare	Recover	Velocity Multi (1000 = x1.0)
Punch	2	2	x1.25
Back Hand	2	2	x1.0
Grasp	2	3	x0.1
Strike (Elbow)	3	3	x1.5
Kick	3	4	x1.75
Thrust Kick	5	5	x2.5
Strike (Knee)	4	5	x2.0
Headbutt	3	5	x2.0

Since I basically added boosts to most attacks and made some standard attacks "better" since normal punches are 3:3 making these punches and backhands 2:2 leaving Eblow strike a stronger variant of vanilla punches. Normal kick got a prepare buff but is still 4 recovery (was 4:4)

Since players have the option in Adv. Mode to "alter" attacks by making them quick, precise, heavy I didn't want to make things too quick or too slow. Or give too high of a boost. Which funny enough I've seen some units use a thrust kick on downed/knocked out foes basically stomping on their head for a x5 vel boost.

Not sure if I want to add a buttslam/sit attack to default humanoids, but maybe ogres or other not very civilized creatures.

Uppercutting someone's toe is quite the image, but I could maybe put in wild swing attacks for races/creatures that the player can't control to make the AI appear to being doing insane shit.

[peasant cretin]

Since blunt grapple might be targeted anywhere using (guessing) BODY_UPPER, the simulation/shorthand of it all is based on what's targeted, making it anything from a bum rush tackle (target upper/lower body), some sort of double/single (target legs/foot), or if arm/hand targeted (like a Russian Tie/arm drag), I'd suggest 3:3 as that prepare recover encompasses the various target possibilities.

NPC AI does "alter" attacks as well which Adv/Arena Mode characters do see (observer skill dep), but wouldn't be seen in Fort.

[Hugo_The_Dwarf]

Hmm good to know that the AI makes use of the various options (just not visible in fort mode you say?) I upped the Grasp attack to be 3:3 and it uses the hands as usual (think of it as an aggressive grab, since a normal "grab" lets you do various wrestling moves (lock, pinch, etc) CAN_LATCH attacks gives you the "shakes around by" attack)

If we had targeted attacks (or preferred targets) for attacks (as in defining them) I'd make shoulder tackles, and probably a few others but none are coming to mind at this time.

[Hugo_The_Dwarf]

Starting on weapon attacks for weapons that would make sense. Mostly it is just velocity and prepare and recover values since really you just bash with maces and hammers. But spears will get a slash attack and anything else that would make sense like striking with the shaft or prodding with the butt for any long handled weapon. I might add slight fluff attacks as long as I can legitimise the stats like axes all you really do is hack at things which covers basically any swing style possible. I can maybe add in "takes hold with both hands and hacks" but what if the user has one arm. Awkward

[TomiTapio]

If you want to balance bleed/pain amounts, have plenty hunter dwarves, see if any "bolt hit eagle's toe! the pain made eagle faint!" mismatches.

[Hugo_The_Dwarf]

Some Battle Axe attack logs so far:

<attacker> hacks <target> in the right hand with his iron battle axe, tearing apart the fat!
<attacker> aggressively hacks <target> in the right upper arm with his iron battle axe, tearing apart the fat!
<attacker> strikes <target> in the left eye with the pommel of his iron battle axe, bruising the left eyelid's skin!

You aggressively hack <target> in the left lower arm from behind with your iron battle axe, fracturing the bone!

I might try to keep base prep time for attacks at a 3 (baring things like shortsword, daggers, and other lightweight weapons, they can start at 2 (prep speed of a punch))

Recover speed can be a min of 2 (unless it's something that would be specialized like a dagger, currently have it as recover 1 which is think beats natural attacks so far as the lowest natural recover is 2)



As for Bleed and Pain, not sure if I want to dig into balancing that. I think bleeding is ok so far. I might make it so organs bleed way more and hurt more. I could make fat and bone have less pain (fat giving no pain) wow, SKIN pain 5, Fat pain 5(wut?), Muscle pain 5 (I can see that) Bone 50. and isn't the too much pain pass out something at 150? so breaking 3 fingers would be enough to make someone passout.

So I think probably making fat bleed less and not hurt, and mucking with pain values all around would make some sort of balance in that regard.


But so far just playing with adding more attacks  and making it so dwarves can use Halberds, Great Axes, Mauls (since a warhammer is so small, for that armor breaking goodness) so I want mauls to be that heavy slugger. Also like I mentioned adding more attacks to weapons and adding clarity. Such as a pick you now "strike the goblin in the arm with the head of your iron pick" and also a pommel cause why not.

Weapons that seem like it will work will get an "aggressively" attack with has more velocity but takes a bit more time to prep and recover, and if it's something that can use two hands (or if proper handling and leverage with one hand) and overhead attack, which technically can be everything but I'm slowly sifting through the weapons and altering and adding attacks as I go. Tweaking numbers.

Will also have to figure out what to do with "redundant" weapons since there is "whip" and "scourge" will need to figure out (why pick one over the other, and why) mainly the fact of this group:
War Hammer
Mace
Flail
Morning Star


as I'll need to balance and configure them to have meaning, regarding fails do I make each attack have long prep (has to get it spinning/flailing) or short prep (assuming the user is already doing that) and make the recovery times longer. Would this weapon be in the like of a 4:4 or a 3:4 or a 3:5 or a 4:5? Also since it's already got some momentum it would hit harder out of all one handed blunt weapons.

as far as War Hammer, Mace, and Morning Star it's just that in order of smallest to largest it'd probably be just ease of use, do you want a fast blunt weapon, avg, or slow heavy hitter (excluding Flail as it's some whip/mace hybrid)

Maul I'm already decking out with very hard hitting and slow attacks, probably making a very skilled and strong hammerdwarf a force to be reckoned with even if it makes him prep and recover poorly, sometimes one good hit is all you need.

Swords are another thing, Short, Long, Scim, 2H. The problem is Scim is a direct copy of Short Sword. So I may have to make the Scim more slashy and values between short and long sword, and good prep/recov for slashes, and no stab. That or it's just a cultural fluff sword.

[peasant cretin]

I based polearms changes for my mod on a conversation between Grimlocke and Cryoshakespeare as well as MyArmoury.com.

[Hugo_The_Dwarf]

Depending on the weapon type even if long handled if it's something that may take wind up like a Maul, or Great Axe the prepare and recovery will be longer than normal, Something like a pike, halberd, glaive(I know it's a broad term, sword on stick version) will have better prep time, and slightly longer recov compared to shorter handled weapons that look and are functionally used the same.

I'm just also adding a series of other attack types that are more or less if they broke from the standard attack style for a more powerful hit.

Also most of my changes are more of X weapon will be better in this situation vs realism. I feel there are enough mods that are bringing things to a more realistic level, so I'm hoping to go for a more immersive yet gameplay/balance direction. but I also want to avoid things like "I made a Katana but it's really a long sword(copy paste, rename), but more eastren" I do plan on adding cultural races (human variants) among others. But all these I'm hoping that it'd still have to feel of Vanilla, but with more (I know there are also a bunch of mods that do this)

[Hugo_The_Dwarf]

Still plugging away at the elf rework I might remove the power attacks for weapons for now until I can figure how they should be balanced. Since some weapons appear to glance off for blunt attacks

[Hugo_The_Dwarf]

Finished up with Elf stuff (for now without any testing) so I added a new evil creature, the Ghoul. Much like the slimes. however the slimes appear to be much stronger than I thought they'd be at least vs the Ghoul.

Weapons tweaks are done for now

Mucked with some numbers which are mostly untested for Tissues organs cause more pain/bleed a bit more, fat bleeds less and causes no pain, pain for other things lowered as a lung, heart or what have you getting bruised will do the trick now, or several fingers being broken.

made the brain a two part, but bleeds a lot and if you don't get knocked out, you will give into pain instantly which just opens up for more head bashing action.

EDIT:
I'm also trying to keep the OP roadmap/changelog up to date on what's being done

[Hugo_The_Dwarf]

Updated the OP again with what's going on. I'm done with the elves, and most of the Misc changes for Phase 1 I'd say are done so I can focus on Goblins now.

EDIT:
I'm also working on a massive conversion project for humans vs evil (vampires and demons)