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Author Topic: Quillus Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)  (Read 5087 times)

NAV

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Re: Quillus Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #270 on: December 06, 2017, 12:40:22 pm »

+1 vote for Hestr please.
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Strongpoint

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Re: Quillus Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #271 on: December 06, 2017, 02:51:15 pm »

Quote
QS-UV-02 "Hestr" (2) strongpoint, Nav
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NAV

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Re: Quillus Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #272 on: December 06, 2017, 03:04:23 pm »

I am also skeptical about how effective that tank will be against infantry since it lacks any auxiliary rapid fire weapons as far as I can tell. Either it shoots them with the main cannon, runs them over, or the crew shoots out the hatch with shitty plastic pistols.
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Strongpoint

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Re: Quillus Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #273 on: December 06, 2017, 03:56:16 pm »

I am also skeptical about how effective that tank will be against infantry since it lacks any auxiliary rapid fire weapons as far as I can tell. Either it shoots them with the main cannon, runs them over, or the crew shoots out the hatch with shitty plastic pistols.
Modern tanks are dead against infantry unsupported. WW2 tanks were dead against infantry unsupported. This tank have additional problems of not having a dedicated anti-infantry weapon and having every enemy damned infantrymen armed with a weapon that can damage its armor.

I really prefer this tank on A, were it won't be swarmed by enemy infantry so much.
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Madman198237

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Re: Quillus Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #274 on: December 06, 2017, 04:05:32 pm »

Yeah, but a true MG, according to NUKE, would have stepped up the difficulty.

Also, I did forget to even specify the inclusion of a Hayk, sorry. Regardless, the tank does fire 50mm high-explosives, and a railgun hit will demolish emplacements. The biggest thing, however, is that it gets our forces closer to the enemy. It can kill them at long range, they can't kill it.

OK, so, tanks vulnerable to infantrymen: No, no, no not really. In modern times the average infantry needs something like a Javelin or stationary ATGM-launcher to have serious effect against modern tanks, and even then the most advanced Western designs (i.e. the British Challenger or the most modern versions of the American Abrams) are generally not going to get outright destroyed no matter what you do to it (Especially the Challenger, those things are absolute beasts when it comes to soaking damage). They'll lose tracks and machinegun mounts and it might tank months to pound the dents out of the things, but you aren't actually going to kill the crew, and there are cases where the crew is still capable of fighting (From inside the vehicle) under ridiculous fire until the ammo runs out and the fuel tank runs dry.

In WWII, things were a bit different (Medium tanks weren't actually meant to bear the brunt of enemy fire, and HEAT rounds hurt non-composite armor schemes), but an infantryman with a Bazooka or, heaven forbid, the ridiculous British PIAT (Spring-powered antitank launcher), against a Tiger? Unpleasant, to say the least. Until we design a true APC we won't be the most mobile army, but if you've got armor (Which can also serve in the direct-fire artillery role) you can cover up a lot of problems.

QS-IU-02 'Stalker'
The Stalker Infantry Uniform combines a nearly form-fitting pressure suit/spacesuit with very light ceramic armor plates on the front of the torso. The plates can be almost-instantly dropped by yanking a release cord, which means the heat from a laser hit probably won't have time to bleed through. The helmet is built to be small and lightweight for comfort and ease of use, and is, regrettably, unarmored. It comes in many camouflage colors, but is primarily meant to increase the speed and combat capability of our infantry in the field.

This allows us to load up 3TC of tank into an ITC for use on D, and some new somewhat-armored uniforms (Will stop a center-of-mass laser hit, probably) to everyone.

Or we can do something more...interesting, like:
QS-GL-02 'Fog Machine'
A cut-down 30mm Hayk system, intended to reach Medium range at most, serving as an infantry grenade launcher, this system is used to deploy smokescreens (Or chaff-screens) using the same laser-dispersing smoke or chaff canisters (In a Hayk-rocket format) on the Hrungnir MBT. Can also fire high explosives like standard Hayk explosive rounds, but bigger.

EDIT: What's a person without conviction of their beliefs, anyway? Voted for the option with 100% more explosions.

Quote
QS-UV-02 "Hestr" (2) strongpoint, Nav
QS-GL-02 'Fog Machine': (1) Madman
« Last Edit: December 06, 2017, 04:12:52 pm by Madman198237 »
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Jilladilla

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Re: Quillus Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #275 on: December 06, 2017, 04:26:28 pm »

I'll be honest, I don't like the Hestr, I don't really see what exactly it brings to the table other than a lightly armored car, and then you say that they'll chew through our tank.. If it was dedicated to scouting, then I'd consider it more, but it's not, it's a civilian car with some ceramics and smoke launchers and a Hayk strapped on.
Anyway, infantry armor is probably best served with a design, although maybe not; either way, the 'Fog Machine' provides protection for our infantry with greater utility as well.

I will admit that I did strongly consider the Skathi though.
Quote from: Votebox
QS-UV-02 "Hestr" (2) strongpoint, Nav
QS-GL-02 'Fog Machine': (2) Madman, Jilladilla
« Last Edit: December 06, 2017, 04:38:16 pm by Jilladilla »
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Maximum Spin

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Re: Quillus Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #276 on: December 06, 2017, 04:48:40 pm »

Quote from: Votebox
QS-UV-02 "Hestr" (2) strongpoint, Nav
QS-GL-02 'Frog Machine': (3) Madman, Jilladilla, Maximum Spin
I agree with Lorf Jilladilla on most counts.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2017, 10:15:31 am by Maximum Spin »
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Madman198237

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Re: Quillus Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #277 on: December 06, 2017, 04:53:32 pm »

The only issue with the Skathi is that a coilgun and a rocket launcher (The two firing options on a Hrungnir) are not really suited to long-range fire, the coilgun's trajectory is too flat (And it's just generally too powerful) and the gun can't elevate far enough regardless, I suspect. It wasn't specified in the design.
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evilcherry

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Re: Quillus Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #278 on: December 06, 2017, 11:35:51 pm »


Quote from: Votebox
QS-UV-02 "Hestr" (2) strongpoint, Nav
QS-GL-02 'Fog Machine': (4) Madman, Jilladilla, Maximum Spin, evilcherry

Strongpoint

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Re: Quillus Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #279 on: December 06, 2017, 11:57:41 pm »

Quote
I'll be honest, I don't like the Hestr, I don't really see what exactly it brings to the table other than a lightly armored car, and then you say that they'll chew through our tank.. If it was dedicated to scouting, then I'd consider it more, but it's not, it's a civilian car with some ceramics and smoke launchers and a Hayk strapped on.
It is an utility vehicle, aka boring but practical thing. Logistics, scouting, keeping infantry not too far behind tanks. Also, it is a revision to get a better fuel for internal combustion engines and future designs. I try to have some new useful tech in every revision

I don't care that their lasers can make a short work with Hestr it because it is made mostly for out of combat duties first, minor battlefield support second

I am sad, that we are going to not use GPP and transport capacity of one of ICTs...


Quote
Yeah, but a true MG, according to NUKE, would have stepped up the difficulty.
Yeah, that is why we should have waited few turns till we have more technologies and more experience in doing military vehicles.

Quote
OK, so, tanks vulnerable to infantrymen: No, no, no not really. In modern times the average infantry needs something like a Javelin or stationary ATGM-launcher to have serious effect against modern tanks, and even then the most advanced Western designs (i.e. the British Challenger or the most modern versions of the American Abrams) are generally not going to get outright destroyed no matter what you do to it (Especially the Challenger, those things are absolute beasts when it comes to soaking damage). They'll lose tracks and machinegun mounts and it might tank months to pound the dents out of the things, but you aren't actually going to kill the crew, and there are cases where the crew is still capable of fighting (From inside the vehicle) under ridiculous fire until the ammo runs out and the fuel tank runs dry.
Tell that to Iraqi army. Also, we haven't seen combat of American level tanks vs American level infantry for quite a while.

Also, imagine that every AK-47 would be able to damage armor and slowly chip it away. It is our situation here.
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SamSpeeds

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Re: Quillus Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #280 on: December 07, 2017, 10:05:20 am »

Quote
QS-UV-02 "Hestr" (2) strongpoint, Nav
QS-GL-02 'Fog Machine': (5) Madman, Jilladilla, Maximum Spin, evilcherry, SamSpeeds
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NUKE9.13

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Re: Quillus Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #281 on: December 07, 2017, 11:38:05 am »

QS-GL-02 'Fog Machine'
A cut-down 30mm Hayk system, intended to reach Medium range at most, serving as an infantry grenade launcher, this system is used to deploy smokescreens (Or chaff-screens) using the same laser-dispersing smoke or chaff canisters (In a Hayk-rocket format) on the Hrungnir MBT. Can also fire high explosives like standard Hayk explosive rounds, but bigger.
QS-GL-02 'Fog Machine' (Easy): (2+1)+1=4: Below Average
Could be worse. The Fog Machine is basically just an upsized Hayk with the barrel shortened. It gets slightly more interesting when it comes to ammunition; smoke/chaff, or explosives. It's just... we shortened the rockets as well as the barrel, which in hindsight might not have been the best idea. So its range is a bit disappointing. Forget about long range entirely- the rockets just don't have the necessary momentum. Even at medium range, accuracy suffers. And it's not exactly the weapon you want at short range.
Still, it works, and it gives our infantry a way to deliver a bigger punch when needed- provided they don't mind needing to take a few shots.
The Fog Machine is Cheap, and does not require any TC.



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Battle for Aljadid, a sci-fi Arms Race. Always looking for more engineers!

Strongpoint

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Re: Quillus Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #282 on: December 07, 2017, 11:43:16 am »

NUKE9.13
We can disband ships over Quillus, right?
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NUKE9.13

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Re: Quillus Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #283 on: December 07, 2017, 11:54:58 am »

NUKE9.13
We can disband ships over Quillus, right?
Yes, ships that are at Quillus may be decommissioned free gratis, and you may use the freed up SPP that same turn.
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Strongpoint

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Re: Quillus Design Bureau - Battle for Aljadid (An Arms Race Game)
« Reply #284 on: December 07, 2017, 12:19:45 pm »

I consider this turn to be very meh both short term (no real game changing designs) and long term (marginal useful experience for future designs. I can't think of any next turn design\revision that benefits from gained experience). We can't allow ourself to tie our resources to already lost battle on D. What we need to do > Compensate lose of D, by going for two planets: A and B and start playing long game from behind.

On other hand it may be worthwhile to delay the action on D, just to win few turns before they can capture the whole planet and, maybe, come with something useful.

Plan decisive battle over D
1) Disband 1 ITC and 2 Lokis (+3 SSP)
2) Upgrade remaining ITC with Dove (-1SSP)
3) Build 4th Odin (-3SSP)
4) Build Hrungni (-4GPP)
5) Load ITC with Hrungni (-3TC) and 2 Loki (1TC)
6) Send everything from Quillus to D
7) Recall transport from B to Quillus

Plan go for two planets
1) Disband 2 Lokis (+1 SSP)
2) Upgrade both remaining ITC with Doves (-3SSP)
3) Build Hrungni (-8GPP)
4) Load both ITC with Hrungni
6) Send 1 Odins + ICT to B
7) Send 2 Odin + ICT + 2Lokis to A
7) Recall transport from B to Quillus

I prefer the second one because should we lose the very likely space battle over D - we are screwed.  I do expect that our enemy will send everything to D (maybe small detachment(s) to A or B) and we can avoid their attempt to force us into a decisive battle.
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