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Author Topic: Dwarf Therapist v42.1.5 | DF 50.12  (Read 393562 times)

Morning_Oak

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Re: Dwarf Therapist v41.2.5 | DF 0.47.05
« Reply #1185 on: February 10, 2023, 09:53:15 pm »

will you add support for 0.57 anytime soon? Still an essential tool! Thank you so much
Assuming you mean 50.07, there were some layouts merged earlier today: https://github.com/Dwarf-Therapist/Dwarf-Therapist/pull/285
Forgive my ignorance with Github, but how would I go about making these updates?
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lethosor

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Re: Dwarf Therapist v41.2.5 | DF 0.47.05
« Reply #1186 on: February 11, 2023, 01:39:19 am »

From that link -> "Files changed" you can use the "..." menu for each file -> "View file" -> "Raw" to download it, then add it to DT. Or you can get to the file from https://github.com/Dwarf-Therapist/Dwarf-Therapist/tree/master/share/memory_layouts. There may be an automatic way to download/install the files as well. I haven't used DT in a while so I'm afraid I won't be much help with that.
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DFHack - Dwarf Manipulator (Lua) - DF Wiki talk

There was a typo in the siegers' campfire code. When the fires went out, so did the game.

Olek

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Re: Dwarf Therapist v41.2.5 | DF 0.47.05
« Reply #1187 on: February 11, 2023, 10:49:32 am »

From that link -> "Files changed" you can use the "..." menu for each file -> "View file" -> "Raw" to download it, then add it to DT. Or you can get to the file from https://github.com/Dwarf-Therapist/Dwarf-Therapist/tree/master/share/memory_layouts. There may be an automatic way to download/install the files as well. I haven't used DT in a while so I'm afraid I won't be much help with that.

Thanks for that, I got it working.
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Dwarf_Fever

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Re: Dwarf Therapist v41.2.5 | DF 0.47.05
« Reply #1188 on: February 11, 2023, 09:08:59 pm »

Dwarf Therapist was first created for assigning labors. But, in my opinion, this is now obsolete.

Not in my opinion, other than for more casual users. And it's not, per se, due to any shortcoming of the vanilla manager to do its specific task, it's because Therapist lets you cross reference information, apply scripts and use tools like control- and shift-click to select entire groups at once. Here is one example in detail of things I actually do, out of many, that are (as I am finding) painful without Therapist.

Let's say I want to get all dwarves who are badly distracted from not creating something working on glass goods. In a large fort, I may have 60 of them by the time I decide to deal with this again.

So, I go to Therapist's tab for Needs. Here I can sort all the dwarves by their current need to create.
Next, I use shift click to select all dwarves that are in the red.
Now I go back to the labors tab, and click once on glass to turn on glass making for all dwarves who have create need in the red.

This has been about 5 clicks up to this point. Of course, once they make something, they sort back to the bottom of the list on a refresh, and I periodically turn their labor off in shift-click groups so they don't hog the shop. (Simply turning it on for everybody absolutely does not efficiently cycle through those people who aren't getting their crafting in.)

However, in the vanilla game, it would be a massive amount of carpal tunnel and time I would need to burn through trying to do this without Dwarf Therapist's ability to just mass assign labor according to a sort or filter. We are talking 5 clicks in DT compared to dozens or a hundred times going back and forth from Therapist to the Game to individually click these guys on and off, after painstakingly scrolling around each time to find the correct one, because they don't sort according to the things I need.

While I appreciate the excellent work that is going in to the vanilla manager, the idea that it is currently an equivalent to Therapist is not one I can agree with, and not having DT with labor functions is quite frustrating. Many things I regularly do to maintain a fort are more time- and click-intensive in vanilla by an order of magnitude (or more) beyond a handful of dwarves, even if you still use Therapist to find the information.

Other examples along these lines include things like assigning pump labor to my least fit 40 dwarves at once, grouping my dwarves by squad membership to un-assign refuse hauling from the 80 soldiers with valuable steel gear, turning smithing on for all dwarves with a preference for a military grade metal, and so on.

« Last Edit: February 11, 2023, 10:13:45 pm by Dwarf_Fever »
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"Whatever exists, having somehow come into being, is again and again reinterpreted to new ends, taken over, transformed, and redirected by some power superior to it; all events in the organic world are a subduing, a becoming master, and all subduing and becoming master involves a fresh interpretation, an adaptation through which any previous 'meaning' and 'purpose' are necessarily obscured or obliterated."

Clément

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Re: Dwarf Therapist v41.2.5 | DF 0.47.05
« Reply #1189 on: February 12, 2023, 06:31:15 am »

The important word was "first". Dwarf Therapist is no longer this. And the game is moving away from labors. Dwarf Therapist's interaction with the game needs to be changed: it cannot stay just writing labor arrays. It doesn't mean removing it, but rather expanding it. Instead of being labor-centric, DT needs to manage more diverse assignments (work details, occupations, squads, burrows, and maybe noble/administrator positions).

Anyway, thank you for the report. It is always interesting to know how users are using DT.
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Flinx

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Re: Dwarf Therapist v41.2.5 | DF 0.47.05
« Reply #1190 on: February 12, 2023, 07:46:14 pm »

I´ve added share/memory_layouts/windows/v0.50.07-steam_win64.ini to my DwarfTherapist-df0.50-test3-win64, which worked fine with Steam DF 50.05 before.
Using newest DF-Hack dfhack-50.07-alpha1-Windows-64bit, i´ve called my 1.lua (df.global.game.external_flag = 1) from DF-Hack ingame gui/launcher, it said: "Command finished succesfully" as in the versions before. But in the console window it shows up nothing, also i can´t switch labors in DT on or off like in version DF Steam 50.05.

ab9rf apologize for any inconvenience
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=164123.msg8453901#msg8453901
but i´m barely able to copy scripts and files to the right place. Can´t figure out what you pros are talking about there. Does this mean, i should wait for another DF-Hack version and my lua script will work again, or do i have to do other things to get DT to work again? I really can´t think about playing DF without Therapist, thank you for your hard work!

PROBLEM SOLVED! It was in front of the monitor.....
« Last Edit: February 12, 2023, 10:49:12 pm by Flinx »
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Flinx

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Re: Dwarf Therapist v41.2.5 | DF 0.47.05
« Reply #1191 on: February 12, 2023, 07:52:39 pm »

I´ve added share/memory_layouts/windows/v0.50.07-steam_win64.ini to my DwarfTherapist-df0.50-test3-win64, which worked fine with Steam DF 50.05 before.
Using newest DF-Hack dfhack-50.07-alpha1-Windows-64bit, i´ve called my 1.lua (df.global.game.external_flag = 1) from DF-Hack ingame gui/launcher, it said: "Command finished succesfully" as in the versions before. But in the console window it shows up nothing, also i can´t switch labors in DT on or off like in version DF Steam 50.05.

ab9rf apologize for any inconvenience
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=164123.msg8453901#msg8453901
but i´m barely able to copy scripts and files to the right place. Can´t figure out what you pros are talking about there. Does this mean, i should wait for another DF-Hack version and my lua script will work again, or do i have to do other things to get DT to work again? I really can´t think about playing DF without Therapist, thank you for your hard work!

Iám such an idiot! You have put a button on the top "Labor changes". After pressing, all work fine.
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ab9rf

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Re: Dwarf Therapist v41.2.5 | DF 0.47.05
« Reply #1192 on: February 12, 2023, 09:33:28 pm »

Does this mean, i should wait for another DF-Hack version and my lua script will work again, or do i have to do other things to get DT to work again? I really can´t think about playing DF without Therapist, thank you for your hard work!
That script ought to be working on Steam only, but will not work with Classic because I misunderstood what I was seeing when I did the initial analysis of the 50.07-Classic image and incorrectly concluded that Bay12 had implemented Putnam's "padding proposal" when they had in fact not. If it's not working on Steam, then we've made a mistake somewhere in a manner I would not have expected. That command in Classic will corrupt an address further down in memory with unknown impact on the game (it appears to be used, but for what we don't know at this point).

This script will probably have to be amended for the next DFHack prerelease because we're probably going to split game into three pieces. The external flag will be in the third piece, the name for which we have yet to agree on (game2? game_tail? game_extra? :-\ ) but it won't be game, so there will be a (minor) amendment to deal with this.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2023, 09:35:49 pm by ab9rf »
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Flinx

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Re: Dwarf Therapist v41.2.5 | DF 0.47.05
« Reply #1193 on: February 12, 2023, 10:45:53 pm »

Thank you for the fast answer, ab9rf!
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Clément

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Re: Dwarf Therapist v41.2.5 | DF 0.47.05
« Reply #1194 on: February 13, 2023, 07:08:15 am »

I´ve added share/memory_layouts/windows/v0.50.07-steam_win64.ini to my DwarfTherapist-df0.50-test3-win64, which worked fine with Steam DF 50.05 before.
Using newest DF-Hack dfhack-50.07-alpha1-Windows-64bit, i´ve called my 1.lua (df.global.game.external_flag = 1) from DF-Hack ingame gui/launcher, it said: "Command finished succesfully" as in the versions before. But in the console window it shows up nothing, also i can´t switch labors in DT on or off like in version DF Steam 50.05.

ab9rf apologize for any inconvenience
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=164123.msg8453901#msg8453901
but i´m barely able to copy scripts and files to the right place. Can´t figure out what you pros are talking about there. Does this mean, i should wait for another DF-Hack version and my lua script will work again, or do i have to do other things to get DT to work again? I really can´t think about playing DF without Therapist, thank you for your hard work!

PROBLEM SOLVED! It was in front of the monitor.....
It's my fault. This version of DT changes external_flag when it connects to DF. I've dropped that behavior in the last version for only changing when clicking the button so it won't overwrite your DFHack settings.
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Flinx

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Re: Dwarf Therapist v41.2.5 | DF 0.47.05
« Reply #1195 on: February 13, 2023, 10:25:23 am »

You guys are doing a great job, no need to apologize. Game is so much more fun with your work. Thanks also for fixing Steam DF versions so quickly. And as I understand, it's a feature because it won't interfere with DFHack, as long as i am not clicking "Labor Changes", so good for ppl using DT for information without changing labors.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2023, 10:31:02 am by Flinx »
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Clément

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Re: Dwarf Therapist v41.2.5 | DF 0.47.05
« Reply #1196 on: February 13, 2023, 12:02:20 pm »

In the "test3" version you have, DT tries to restore the value of external_flag when it connects to DF. Since you never set it from DT before, it set it to 0. As you noticed this may break DFHack scripts and plugins, so I changed it in the latest version (no build provided, it's this branch). Now, DT will not set external_flag automatically, but the button is still there to reflect its state and allow manual changes. For setting external_flag on startup, I would recommend using a DFHack script (as you have done) although this is currently broken on classic.
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ab9rf

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Re: Dwarf Therapist v41.2.5 | DF 0.47.05
« Reply #1197 on: February 13, 2023, 12:51:06 pm »

In the "test3" version you have, DT tries to restore the value of external_flag when it connects to DF. Since you never set it from DT before, it set it to 0. As you noticed this may break DFHack scripts and plugins, so I changed it in the latest version (no build provided, it's this branch). Now, DT will not set external_flag automatically, but the button is still there to reflect its state and allow manual changes. For setting external_flag on startup, I would recommend using a DFHack script (as you have done) although this is currently broken on classic.
You might be interested in https://github.com/DFHack/dfhack/discussions/2901, since it relates to DFHack/Dwarf Therapist interoperability with respect to labor management. It is, of course, exceedingly possible for Dwarf Therapist to communicate directly with DFHack, via DFHack's RPC mechanism.
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Starver

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Re: Dwarf Therapist v41.2.5 | DF 0.47.05
« Reply #1198 on: February 13, 2023, 05:21:51 pm »

You might be interested in https://github.com/DFHack/dfhack/discussions/2901,
"...the abandoned Dwarf Therapist..."? (In the first, and so far only, reply to the discussion.)

Whatever Clément's thoughts about if/how to procede, that's wrong. Unless it's purely in some DFHack context I don't appreciate.


(Because of various other priorities and competing distractions, I've just not yet jumped on the 50.* DF release, yet. Steam or non-Steam. So I've had nothing more useful to say on this issue. But I am following the progress most avidly, from afar. And trying to work out what my experience would be(/will eventually be) like, purely from reported experiences. All this discussion is very much part of that.)
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feelotraveller

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Re: Dwarf Therapist v41.2.5 | DF 0.47.05
« Reply #1199 on: February 13, 2023, 06:26:19 pm »

That is Clément's reply!

To unravel it for you - not that it is complex - 'the abandoned Dwarf Therapist' refers to the Labor Management DT we now, or in the recent past, all know and love, since it seems that Clément may well take DT in the direction of only using work details.

I happen to think that abandoning labors is a bad decision - I'm one Putnam's stick-in-the-mud players if you will, but I am unable to be more forthright since, as still waiting for a linux DF version (and a linux classic version at that) of the 50's series, I have not used the work details system myself so cannot participate well in this discussion.  While as pointed out above a couple of times it is possible to create a custom work detail for each labour I'm of the opinion that if I have to go that far to play the game the way I want rather than being perhaps railroaded into playing it the way the developers (thinking DF but perhaps this might apply secondarily to DT) want then it is probably not worth my while playing any longer.  But really I need to wait and see once a linux version gets released since perhaps I'm imagining a non-exsistent reality.  Or hope that someone with the skills steps up to the plate to fork off a labour management DT (as suggested), or work on convincing Clément that this is a worthwhile thing to keep in the Therapist version that they continue with.  But for that I need to be in a position to evaluate the "there is nothing labour management can do which work details can't" proposition.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2023, 06:29:01 pm by feelotraveller »
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