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[Chiefwaffles]

I’m wondering we should design a new/upgraded base, and revise a fixed TAV.
I think I mentioned this earlier but the new missiles should be immensely helpful. They’re basically just the TAB in missile form. We essentially just have to slap on a display.

[Madman198237]

I’m wondering we should design a new/upgraded base, and revise a fixed TAV.
I think I mentioned this earlier but the new missiles should be immensely helpful. They’re basically just the TAB in missile form. We essentially just have to slap on a display.

That's my general idea, Chief. TAV *should* require just a revision now.

\We essentially just have to slap on a display.

Thank you for that comment, because I am now imagining soldiers wearing a missile for a backpack, staring over their shoulders at displays on the missiles.

[Chiefwaffles]

Why not just replace our soldiers with the vastly superior rockslide missiles?
Though your post prior to mine doesn't really make it seem you think so. A revision which fixes the TAV while also implementing ceramic armor seems vastly out of scope.


Anyways, I like the idea of a base upgrade but I have some different priorities. I apologize for the similar name to the existing upgrade proposal, but there's only so many ways to call a base upgrade design.
Design: XCOM Base Overhaul
1 Alien Power Core Token
Instead of trying to work out the many logistical capabilities of constructing or organizing an entirely new XCOM outpost in a new part of the world all in complete secrecy, let's upgrade our main base.

The first, main, and most obvious improvement is the new Elerium Generator, based off of the alien UFO power core and our other experience with elerium (e.g. railguns). This generator lies underneath our base, providing more than enough power for whatever we need. We anticipate engineering (and to a lesser extent, general R&D) to be extremely happy that they'll be able to use as many tools and equipment and expansions to their workshops as they want without causing a base-wide brownout again.
We've also equipped engineering with alien alloy components - the same type of thing we did with the XH-2. Alien alloy components in machinery should greatly increase their lifespan, decrease maintenance costs, and even increase operation speeds as machinery can work faster without overheating or malfunctioning.
Production capacity of all kinds should hopefully go way up thanks to these improvements, and the elerium generator should both pave the way for future power generation technology (being able to work on the scale of a base reactor instead of, say, a rifle-sized reactor, really helps R&D) and "future-proof" our base for anything else that requires power.

Base defenses are improved as well. New overcompensating drastically upscaled railguns are put into place in positions that allow them to be raised out of the ground in case of incoming alien forces, with our new power supply being more than able to keep them running constantly.
Rockslide technology is being integrated into our base in two ways, as well.
The first way is clear - improving our G2A missiles to use Rockslide tech and thus increasing accuracy and effectivenesss.
The second thing we're doing with Rockslide is integrating it into our [radar/sensor arrays/whatever it is that we use to detect UFOs] in order to vastly improve UFO detection and recognition capabilities. We hope to be able to see through ECM, get better advanced warning on incoming alien craft, get more detailed readouts on new UFO types, and more. This is done by embedding the Rockslide recognition technology to use the data from our sensors, allowing it to single out UFOs that would normally be dismissed as background radiation and give us better details on existing sensor signatures.

TL;DR: Alien power source to future-proof base for future power needs and to help engineering; use of alien alloy components (exactly like the kind of stuff we did with the XH-2) to improve engineering machinery, defense railguns, and integrating Rockslide into our G2A missiles and radar tech (being able to single out UFOs earlier and give us more details on the things it does detect thanks to enhanced automated recognition that Rockslide provides).

If anyone has good ideas for how to use an alien equipment token in a base upgrade, lemme know.
I don't like "retooling the lab for better analysis and use of alien technology" as a use for it since I fail to see what that'll get us. I fully, 100%, doubt that Ebbor will give us anything silly like decreased difficulty for all reverse engineering or anything widespread benefiting our design & revision actions. That's just far too OP.

XCOM Main Base Upgrade (0):
Alpha X (0):
XCOM Base Overhaul (1): Chiefwaffles

[Madman198237]

XCOM Main Base Upgrade (1): Madman
Alpha X (0):
XCOM Base Overhaul (1): Chiefwaffles

Updated the design to make better use of the newer tokens, and be much less nebulous about what the tokens are all being used for. I think. Maybe. Probably.

[Chiefwaffles]

I really dislike the use of the alien equipment and alloy token in the Main Base Upgrade. Feels like a waste.

We should save the Alien Alloy token for making proper alloy-based armor. That and the thing it and the equipment token are used for is, as I've said, going to be downright useless. Ebbor's not going to let us just get a "+1 to all future actions involving alien tech" or anything of the sort.

[Madman198237]

I really dislike the use of the alien equipment and alloy token in the Main Base Upgrade. Feels like a waste.

We should save the Alien Alloy token for making proper alloy-based armor. That and the thing it and the equipment token are used for is, as I've said, going to be downright useless. Ebbor's not going to let us just get a "+1 to all future actions involving alien tech" or anything of the sort.

Please read again?

It's specifically for *designing and producing* alien tech, as in, "more EP please".

[Chiefwaffles]

Equipment Token and an Alien Alloy token are used in retooling the lab for better analysis and use of alien technology, allowing us to greatly expand our ability to produce and invent alien tech and alien tech-based items.

I fail to see how the bolded parts indicate that. And even the rest seem to have EP/VP as an afterthought that has to be clarified. I don't see how our lab being better at analyzing alien tech or us being more able to invent new stuff has anything to do with the (relative) mass production of expensive items.

Besides, I still really think the alien alloy token needs to be preserved for proper armor.

[Cnidaros]

I feel like I should point out I was correct that the Egypt mission would not be a success. Also, if anything that mission practically screams "the aliens have got psionics now", so we should really get to producing some way to capture them to study psionics.

While I want to do a ground combat design this turn to make up for the TAV, it is absolutely paramount that we improve our base defense now. Between the two base upgrades proposed, I'm more inclined to side with Madman's one which uses more tokens. Once again, a reminder that hoarding tokens doesn't do anything, and the list of <important things I want to design with this token> is likely going to be endless, and secondary to <something we urgently need this coming turn>. I see no reason why we shouldn't use tokens en masse.

That said, I agree with Chiefwaffles that the alien alloy token is not well used. Perhaps write it into making alien alloy protection for our new Elerium Reactor? Also we don't have a Nav Computer Token, it was used for the failed TAV. Right now we have 2 Alien Equipment tokens, 1 Alien Alloy Token, 1 Power Core Token and 1 Unit Experience Token.

[Madman198237]

I changed it again to be a bit clearer. The reason I want to use that alien alloy token is because most things we do are going to use alien alloys, and understanding them enough to mass-produce (Well, sort of) them will be incredibly beneficial for everything we do with them, simply because costing less EP is not only good, but necessary.

[Happerry]

If we want to capture aliens, we should add an alien containment facility to the base upgrade actions so we can actually hold them properly. Also might want to look into Electro-Lasers so we don't have to go into melee to stun enemies sometime soon.

Edit : Also, I really think we need to get another base soon after we fired off our base defenses. We don't want to start an interception phase turn with our base being invaded when we still don't have any back ups....

[Strongpoint]

IMO, You guys shouldn't add zero votes things to the votebox. If I offer some concept it doesn't necessary mean I'll vote for it. I think votebox should be expanded when someone adds a vote.

[Strongpoint]

I think both proposed base upgrades are too broad and feauture overloaded. I believe that our key priority is an ability to field more fighters by either getting more VP or cheaper fighter design

Hephaestus (alien equipment, UFO core, alien alloys)
Hephaestus is a highly automated production facility unlike any other on the Earth. It is powered by UFO core allowing great power output for powering innovative plasma-based furnaces (repurporsed technology found in alien plasma pistols) used to produce various alloys in a more effective and efficient ways than any other Earth-based technology. Set of automated tools made with use of advanced materials allow shaping, cutting, wielding of metal parts allowing rapid production of metal parts needed for aircrafts and infantry equipment



I still think that cheap fighter\drone is what we need to do now. Few more VP are nice but ability to send half of a raven in situations like one during the last turn give us more flexibility while improving overall strength of our airforce.

[Cnidaros]

^while I also want more/better/cheaper fighters to deal with wide-spread situations such as this turn, I believe we urgently need to upgrade our base defense now, since we've sent up a giant fiery sign saying "OUR BASE IS HERE" to the aliens.

XCOM Main Base Upgrade (2): Madman, Cnidaros
Alpha X (0):
XCOM Base Overhaul (1): Chiefwaffles

Madman, could you add an alien containment section to the base upgrade as well? It doesn't have to be fancy, just "a set of cells to hold captured aliens".

[Madman198237]

I mean, I'd think that's not the sort of thing that has to be mentioned, but it's hardly going to add to the difficulty. It just turns it into an even-longer laundry list proposal.

[Chiefwaffles]

I still really dislike the usage of the Alien Alloys token in the base design. I think it's completely irrelevant, and really hurts us in the future.
An Alien Alloys token should definitely be used for actual armor. I really hate the idea of "spending tokens just to spend tokens." We should spend them when they're relevant, help us, and can't be used for something better in the immediate future. The idea to use an Alloys token on the Main Base Upgrade design fails all three of this. It makes no sense - it's just throwing tokens at the design with minimal justification in a vain hope that it'll make the design easier.

Tokens just make relevant things easier. How will "we use an alien alloy token to upgrade R&D and engineering [in some nebulous way]" make this easier? How is it worth more than using it to develop proper armor?