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Author Topic: Vigilo Confido : XCOM Arms Race  (Read 22937 times)

Happerry

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Re: Vigilo Confido : XCOM Arms Race
« Reply #720 on: January 13, 2018, 09:12:43 pm »

This plan works for me, I suppose. I was just thinking yesterday about the possibility of developing a general "pacification" mission type, wherein we send in agents to root out both traitors and generally do hearts-and-minds work. Of course, that does require the Aliens to cooperate quite a bit, or it'd have to be a hanger-on to other mission types ("After the battle, also do this").
Personally, I don't see why, if we make an 'Sweep for Exalt Cells and Other Naughty Spies' Mission type we have to wait for an alien to go someplace before we can use it there. Surely we could just go 'and send a skyranger to canada because we think it has an enemy infestation.'

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Happerry's Interception Plan : (0)
Plan try to cover all of them : (0)
Mass Interception (0):
Operation Glass Pyre (4): Chiefwaffles, Strongpoint, Madman, Happerry
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Madman198237

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Re: Vigilo Confido : XCOM Arms Race
« Reply #721 on: January 13, 2018, 09:22:34 pm »

The thing is, we have to have the manpower and transport capacity to spare, which requires the enemy to be considerate and not run too many missions or use too many good UFOs. Or perhaps we see if we can make it a non-time-dependent mission (i.e., so moving between continents doesn't require a Skyranger) and deploy (Hopefully reliable) specops from other countries (As in, use NA ICTs in SA, EU ICTs in Africa, etc.) to save ourselves the transport costs?
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Happerry

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Re: Vigilo Confido : XCOM Arms Race
« Reply #722 on: January 13, 2018, 09:30:03 pm »

If we write the mission so that it's just detection whenever actual solid opposition arises, I don't see why we can't drop an Agency team on it. If it's just some CEO who got replaced by a Hybrid an Agency team can probably handle it, and if they turn up an alien base or something, it'd be worth dropping some Skyrangers on anyway, right?

I still think we'll need to go ahead and try the base building design action again next design phase to get more points, but now that we have equipment tokens it should probably be rewriten to run off an Elerium Reactor to give us exp in alien power sources or something like that.
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Chiefwaffles

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Re: Vigilo Confido : XCOM Arms Race
« Reply #723 on: January 13, 2018, 09:48:42 pm »

Ooor we could upgrade our main base with alien technology.

We have experience in alien computing, power sources, we have really good missile tracking that could be applied to the base's sensors (allowing for much more versatile UFO trakcing), we have railguns that could be used for base defense cannons, and much more. We can easily reason for a ton of improvements in areas like VP/EP - "the new alien power source is of great use to engineering, and the computing parts allow for computers to aid much more of the engineering process." Things like that. We could use the unit experience token to create better instructors for units, perhaps getting more UP. Lots better defenses, better UFO tracking, etc...

And it'd all be relatively easy. We have experience in nearly all of the stuff and a ton of unused tokens. A ton of widespread bonuses, while avoiding a lot of logistical challenge of entirely new bases.
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Happerry

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Re: Vigilo Confido : XCOM Arms Race
« Reply #724 on: January 13, 2018, 10:40:41 pm »

I''d prefer a second base so that if we roll like crap, our use of base defenses this turn to bring down a UFO doesn't lead to a base assault taking out our only base. But yah, we've got some good upgrade options.
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Madman198237

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Re: Vigilo Confido : XCOM Arms Race
« Reply #725 on: January 13, 2018, 11:03:02 pm »

So, something like this might very well be worthwhile.

XCOM Main Base Upgrade
Having acquired a substantial amount of knowledge concerning alien tech and operation methods, our main base is to be on the receiving end of a massive upgrade program. First of all, the air-to-ground defenses are upgraded to include a mix of upsized railguns, HARMs, and a set of ballistic missile interceptor missiles capable of engaging targets from much longer range, so that hostile forces can be intercepted without revealing the precise location of the base. Our experience with alien computers and Elerium is used to improve the construction facilities for equipment and aircraft. An Alien Equipment Token is used in retooling the lab for better analysis and use of alien technology, while a Unit Experience Token is spent improving the training facilities so that our units are better prepared to fight aliens.

2 1 Alien Equipment Token, 1 Alien Nav Computer token, 1 Unit experience Token
Still leaves 2 tokens, and we could still spend the Nav Comp to further improve the construction facilities.
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Strongpoint

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Re: Vigilo Confido : XCOM Arms Race
« Reply #726 on: January 14, 2018, 08:38:27 am »

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Ooor we could upgrade our main base with alien technology.
Upgrading our main base is something that looks a promising way to dump many tokens. Great idea here.

I am still thinking about new aircraft, preferably cheap. With better missiles we don't have to rush to better fighter but our doctrine would benefit from a ground attack aircraft.

Colibri (2 alien equipment tokens)
Colibri is a light one engine aircraft based on COIN concept.  It is closer to WW2 fighter in its mentality and design philosophy than to modern missile using fighters like Raven. It is small, it is nimble, it combines supersoic capability with very low stall speed. It's main armament is a Phoenix derived railgun going from the tail to the nose. It's secondary armament is two wing mounted 20mm automatic cannons coming with HEAP bullets boosted with small amounts of elerium to make them more explosive (1 alien equipment token). Additionally it can carry two standard missiles (SMART or Rocklslide) on it's wingtips. Colibri is equipped with a complex target recognition system that is derived from lessons learned during TAV project. Front side of the aircraft is reinforced with a new anti-plasma armor (captured alien pistols were used to test effectiveness of armor). Armor should handle known and theorized enemy infantry equipment. While created with ground support in mind, Colibri is a capable dogfigher.

This thing should kill enemy light UFOs one on one. It is great escort for Skyrangers going to landed UFOs. It is an answer for potential further anti-missile designs from enemy (like point defense systems), against bigger\better armored UFOs (railgun with a high punch), against small flying drones (more nimble than Raven in close fight vs those). It is a good target for potential VP token(s), it shouldn't go obsolete when we'll get a replacment for Raven. It works well in pair with Raven (Raven fires missiles, Colibri proceeds with attack in close range)
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Cnidaros

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Re: Vigilo Confido : XCOM Arms Race
« Reply #727 on: January 14, 2018, 09:35:53 am »

Quote
Plan Tilting-At-Windmills
Production/Logistics
2 Ravens (4 VP)
3 Skyrangers w/ Phoenix (2 VP; 1 EP)
3 NOTSOFTER Squads w/ XH-2 Rifles (3 UP; 3 EP)

Interception: Bogey 015 (Mexico, Flying)
1 Raven

Ignore: Bogey 018 (Brazil, Flying)

Interception: Bogey 016 (France, Flying)
1 Raven

Combined Arms: Bogey 017 (Japan, Landed)
1 Skyrangers w/ Phoenix
1 NOTSOFTER w/ XH-2 Rifles

Combined Arms: Bogey 014 (Egypt, Landed)
2 Skyranger w/ Phoenix
2 NOTSOFTER w/ XH-2 Rifles

I know its pointless to vote against the bandwagon when it gets going, but I'm going for this anyway. Changes as such: ignore the Brazil Medium UFO and get that Raven to intercept the France one instead. I'm absolutely against revealing our base at this time, when given our luck we'll probably roll a one on designing defenses for it and we have no backup bases, meaning game over (also they could just keep slamming our base with missions every turn, because why not). I don't understand why you're all so confident one Raven can win against a Medium UFO, when we know the Raven can't beat their upgraded fighter one-to-one. If anything this UFO may be more heavily armed and armoured than a fighter.

The other change is to shift the ground forces to 2 in Egypt and 1 in Japan. I'm betting the Egypt mission is more important to them based on the silver containers. If Japan has decided to tackle the aliens with local forces, let them. They'll only soften up the aliens for our troops to win. Also the Egypt mission has those mimic octopuses, which are going to be just as effective as they were last turn when they ripped through two of our three squads.

The other option which no one seems to have considered yet is that the Japan human groups are part of a third party, who hopes to beat the aliens before us and claim their spoils. In which case I would advise sending all 3 squads there or none, in case it turns into a three-way battle.

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Strongpoint

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Re: Vigilo Confido : XCOM Arms Race
« Reply #728 on: January 14, 2018, 09:53:16 am »

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when given our luck we'll probably roll a one on designing defenses for it and we have no backup bases
Reverse gambler's fallacy at its best

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I don't understand why you're all so confident one Raven can win against a Medium UFO, when we know the Raven can't beat their upgraded fighter one-to-one.
"Can" here is like 30-40% chance to win(by my evaluation).
But we must send a fighter to Brazil for information not to win the fight. We need to know what their medium UFO looks like. Should we ignore it we'll know nothing about it and will be unable to adjust our strategy. Also, Medium UFO can be weaker than the fighter if it is not combat focused.

Also, there are a difference between "Dear Brazilian government,  we did what we could, sadly our heroic pilot failed" and "dear Brazilian government we don't care about you and ignore mission sent to you... for the second time. Japan is a richer country, you know?"

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The other change is to shift the ground forces to 2 in Egypt and 1 in Japan. I'm betting the Egypt mission is more important to them based on the silver containers. If Japan has decided to tackle the aliens with local forces, let them. They'll only soften up the aliens for our troops to win. Also the Egypt mission has those mimic octopuses, which are going to be just as effective as they were last turn when they ripped through two of our three squads.
With this I can agree. Egypt will be hard with only one NOTSOFTER. On other hand, Japan is a very strange situations and I prefer to win in this strange situation.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2018, 09:59:05 am by Strongpoint »
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10ebbor10

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Re: Vigilo Confido : XCOM Arms Race
« Reply #729 on: January 16, 2018, 02:47:07 pm »

Battle Phase

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Interception: Bogey 015 (Mexico, Flying)
1 Raven

The new Rockslide missiles are universally approved of by our pilots, and it's not hard to recognize why. A single volley easily outwits the enemy ECM and a last minute dodging, turning their UFO into falling debris.

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Interception: Bogey 018 (Brazil, Flying)
1 Raven

With some hesitance, a single Raven sets of to fight the enemies newest, most powerful craft. Approaching slowly, the Raven fighter creeps towards it's target, only to find nothing more than a single small UFO, which is downed easily by a volley of Rock slide missiles.

Research and Development has 3 hypothesizes. Either the true ship is invisible, or the enemies ECM deliberately put a powerful signature as a distraction.

Quote
Interception: Bogey 016 (France, Flying)
Base Defenses

The enemy UFO has barely entered the atmosphere, when a flurry of missiles streaks towards it. Not long thereafter, the base defenses record their first kill. Fear exists that it may only be the first of many.

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Combined Arms: Bogey 017 (Japan, Landed)
2 Skyrangers w/ Phoenix
2 NOTSOFTER w/ XH-2 Rifles

Our forces are too late. Not to safe the civilians of course, most of those are fine. No, they're too late to take part in any combat. The UFO is still there, with a gaping gash in it's side. But there's no sign of any aliens, nor, for that matter any of the armed humans you've seen before.

There's blood in the streets, and bullet holes throughout the town. But there's no corpses, no wounded, nothing to identify who this was or why they were here.

Still, it nets you 1 partially intact UFO. The Navigation systems appear to have been torn out, which appears to have caused the engines to overload, but the power core is still there, softly humming away.

Mission succes? : 1 UFO power Core Token, 1 Alien Alloy Token

Quote
Combined Arms: Bogey 014 (Egypt, Landed)
1 Skyranger w/ Phoenix
1 NOTSOFTER w/ XH-2 Rifles

The enemy appears to be finishing things up by the time we arrive on the site. With howling engines our lone Skyranger drops down towards the town. Plasma reaches out to meet it, with a near miss scorching the hull as the pilot makes evasive maneuvers. Forced to back of for the moment, the Skyranger sets down among the dunes on the outskirts of the town.

Taking full advantage our weapon's superior range, our troops send railgun shot after railgun shot through the building. The enemy weapons are relatively short ranged, our forces know that if they can keep distance, we can pick them of one by one. At first, the strategy appears to work fine, our troops picking of sectoid after sectoid. Victory appears within grasp.

And then suddenly, it's over. Two dead bodies turn out not to be quite as dead as expected, the formerly camouflaged aliens suddenly lunging towards our forces. Another drops out of the ceiling, holding plasma pistols in it's tentacles.

It's a perfect ambush, in fact, too perfect. Our tactic department swears that the enemy is somehow "cheating", that they know what our forces are up to.

Mission Failed

Spoiler: Technology (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: PANIC METER (click to show/hide)

Design Phase

Turn 6

AABBCCDD
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SaberToothTiger

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Re: Vigilo Confido : XCOM Arms Race
« Reply #730 on: January 16, 2018, 03:20:54 pm »

It seems they're either using invisible recon (unlikely) or have some sorts of psionics like in new UFO which allow them to see more. And I think the Japan-craft might be a ploy to determine the location of our base.
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Chiefwaffles

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Re: Vigilo Confido : XCOM Arms Race
« Reply #731 on: January 16, 2018, 03:25:36 pm »

Okay.
We found Exalt.

Let’s heavily consider revising a mission type to hunt out their cells. Because if there anything like the game version, they’re going to have some tasty genetics and psionics tech. Both of which would be really nice.


As for other actions, I say fixing the TAV and/or base stuff. Getting better base defenses wouldn’t be the worst idea too.
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You should really look to the wilderness for your stealth ideas, it has been doing it much longer than you have after all. Take squids for example, that ink trick works pretty well, and in water too! So you just sneak into the dam upsteam, dump several megatons of distressed squid into it, then break the dam. Boom, you suddenly have enough water-proof stealth for a whole city!

Strongpoint

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Re: Vigilo Confido : XCOM Arms Race
« Reply #732 on: January 16, 2018, 04:42:37 pm »

It looks like a kinda meh turn. On one hand we prevented most of their missions, on other hand we both had one successful mission to get tokens. It looks like a draw\minor defeat.

With UFO power core and alloys we can go for a quite kick ass fighter. Remaking TAV isn't something I like unless I'll see a way to use few tokens on it.


« Last Edit: January 16, 2018, 05:16:46 pm by Strongpoint »
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Madman198237

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Re: Vigilo Confido : XCOM Arms Race
« Reply #733 on: January 16, 2018, 05:12:57 pm »

I'll write up a new TAV version, which also implements ceramic armor for our soldiers. Even if it's costly EP-wise, we're going to need it. Also, I draw attention to this option to prevent further there's-so-many-we-need-more-points fiascos:

XCOM Main Base Upgrade
Having acquired a substantial amount of knowledge concerning alien tech and operation methods, our main base is to be on the receiving end of a massive upgrade program. First of all, the air-to-ground defenses are upgraded to include a mix of upsized railguns, linked to an elerium power core made using our Power Core Token, HARMs, and a set of ballistic missile interceptor missiles capable of engaging targets from much longer range, so that hostile forces can be intercepted without revealing the precise location of the base. Our experience with alien computers and elerium is used to improve the construction facilities for equipment and aircraft. An Alien Equipment Token and an Alien Alloy token are used in retooling the lab for better analysis and use or reproduction of alien technology, allowing us to greatly expand our ability to produce alien tech and alien tech-based items. A Unit Experience Token is spent improving the training facilities so that our units are better prepared to fight aliens. A set of simple (yet strong) cells are added (if we don't have them already), to hold any captured aliens or humans. The cells are atmospherically sealed and, if anything strange is suspected to be going on, the air can be rapidly pumped out to kill anything inside them.

2 1 Alien Equipment Token, 1 UFO Power Core Token, 1 Alien Alloy Token, 1 Unit experience Token

EDIT: Updated to make use of new tokens and be less nebulous.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2018, 10:09:42 pm by Madman198237 »
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Strongpoint

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Re: Vigilo Confido : XCOM Arms Race
« Reply #734 on: January 16, 2018, 05:17:01 pm »

Alpha X(1 alien equipment token, 1 UFO power core token, 1 alien alloy token, 1 unit experience token
Alpha X is the newest combat vehicle. It is a small tracked drone controlled by the most complex combat AI developed by humanity. Many elements of a failed TAV project are integrated during the development of the tank. It has not only a broad suite of sensors but can give radio, audio and visual signals to inform nearby allies about presence of the enemies. It is powered by a revolutionary electric engine derived from alien concepts (UFO power Core Token) It is armed with phoenix turret that can elevate high enough to target aerial targets, including low flying UFOs. It is armored by anti-plasma alloy developed by testing numerous new materials against captured plasma pistols (1 alien alloy token, 1 unit experience token). Combat AI is developed by the best AI specialists in the world in a close cooperation with NOTSOFTER veterans that shared everything they know about tactics of enemy. (1 unit experience token)

It is armored, it is immune to psionics, it can see hidden units, it has a gun to punch through any armor they may field in nearby future.
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