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Author Topic: Marksdwarves rushing to their death  (Read 10456 times)

Encrtia

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Re: Marksdwarves rushing to their death
« Reply #15 on: January 12, 2018, 08:56:24 am »

Question : if you incorporate an overhang into your fortifications does it prevent the wall-climbers?

Additional question : since they didn't seem to want to climb when you had built fortifications instead of carved, if you (in addition to the carved fortifications) incorporated a built fortification as an overhang on the outsides of your fortification, would that deny access to wall climbers?

How do you overhang your fortifications?
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Kat1e

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Re: Marksdwarves rushing to their death
« Reply #16 on: January 12, 2018, 11:30:37 am »

How do you overhang your fortifications?

Carefully...?

Well, I mean, all you need to do is ensure that each block is connected (I think?) so it doesn't fall, so, build a 1 tile wide floor space over the current wall line, (instead of where the wall would be) then add the overhang block to the end of the floor space, then tile by tile remove the floor space and add the wall back in.

That would work, wouldn't it?

It would mean that ranged fighters wouldn't be able to aim straight down, but they would still be able to fire at the enemy as it's charging toward you, or milling about in the fields outside.

Now what would be really cool is if we could rig something so that the underside of the overhang so that it opens up to drop something on enemies who are currently attacking the base of the wall. Possibly would need to involve the drawbridge mechanic, idk. But that's making my brain work harder than it needs to at this time of night, so ....  :D
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Encrtia

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Re: Marksdwarves rushing to their death
« Reply #17 on: January 12, 2018, 11:36:56 am »

How do you overhang your fortifications?

Carefully...?

Well, I mean, all you need to do is ensure that each block is connected (I think?) so it doesn't fall, so, build a 1 tile wide floor space over the current wall line, (instead of where the wall would be) then add the overhang block to the end of the floor space, then tile by tile remove the floor space and add the wall back in.

That would work, wouldn't it?

It would mean that ranged fighters wouldn't be able to aim straight down, but they would still be able to fire at the enemy as it's charging toward you, or milling about in the fields outside.

Now what would be really cool is if we could rig something so that the underside of the overhang so that it opens up to drop something on enemies who are currently attacking the base of the wall. Possibly would need to involve the drawbridge mechanic, idk. But that's making my brain work harder than it needs to at this time of night, so ....  :D

Oh.. er. I just.. swore that was impossible.. but I just did it. Okay. Learnt something anew, thanks. And I was thinking of drawbridge mechanics before I even finished reading your post hehe
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Kat1e

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Re: Marksdwarves rushing to their death
« Reply #18 on: January 12, 2018, 11:48:04 am »

Great minds  ;)

Something else...

Possibly we could build out the overhang on the corners to build turrets.

Some examples:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turret
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Manilajf8528_29.JPG
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Krakow_Fort31_20070413_1756.jpg

This would enable the ranged fighters to also aim back towards the base of the wall with the overhang...?
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Encrtia

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Re: Marksdwarves rushing to their death
« Reply #19 on: January 12, 2018, 01:06:42 pm »

Great minds  ;)

Something else...

Possibly we could build out the overhang on the corners to build turrets.

Some examples:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turret
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Manilajf8528_29.JPG
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Krakow_Fort31_20070413_1756.jpg

This would enable the ranged fighters to also aim back towards the base of the wall with the overhang...?

Oi OI, Great minds don't just take plans without asking though :o That's exactly what I'm doing right at this very moment!
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Leonidas

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Re: Marksdwarves rushing to their death
« Reply #20 on: February 22, 2018, 02:47:11 am »

First step is those fortifications. Next is micromanagement of doors.
Dwarves that run out of bolts still have a tendency to run into melee when they run out of ammo. So if there is any path available they mess up things. Don't give them any available path.

This.

I've never had a problem with fortifications, probably because I always lock my archers in. My standard archery training setup is to lure a forgotten beast into a big pit (20x20) and seal him in. Then I line up 20 newbie archers behind fortifications one z-level above, with orders to protecting 1x10 burrows that are also ammo stockpiles. Dozens of them reached legendary that way, and none of them ever climbed down into the pit. Most FBs can take hundreds of bolts before they die.

I bet the key element here is whether the marksdwarf can path to the enemy. Marksdwarves stupidly charging the enemy have always been a problem in DF. It's practically a tradition. Maybe now the introduction of climbing and jumping have made it much worse.

DF soldiers are idiots. DF marksdwarves are extreme idiots. So lock them in every time.
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Crabs

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Re: Marksdwarves rushing to their death
« Reply #21 on: September 06, 2019, 06:59:41 am »

The crab points its pincer and the thread shudders!

I'm currently in a very similar situation, my marksdwarves want to leave the fortress and jump into a 15z deep cliff after firing one or two shots at the invaders outside.
Here's my setup:

WWWW...___
WW_F...___
WW_F...___
___D...___
WW_F...___
WW_F...___
WWWW...___

(W=Wall, F=Fortification, _=Floor .=Abyss)
I'm sationing my marksdwarves right behind the fortification but they immediatly rush to the door, hold on to it and then fall down into the pit, dying or being crippled badly.
I tried forbidding the door, I tried restriting the archers to burrows and both. How do I stop them to try to climb on the other side?
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Re: Marksdwarves rushing to their death
« Reply #22 on: September 19, 2019, 04:42:36 pm »

1) You did carve rather than build the fortification, right?
2) In case this helps, dwarves cannot hold onto doors, or any buildings at all (tested at least with raised bridges). They can however hold onto, say, walls diagonally above them. So you can block off oblique climbing path with this if it is necessary.

Dragofire

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Re: Marksdwarves rushing to their death
« Reply #23 on: October 19, 2019, 02:25:47 pm »

Use stations to keep them from rushing in. A stationed dwarf will only ever move 2 squares from the station point.
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Re: Marksdwarves rushing to their death
« Reply #24 on: October 19, 2019, 11:38:55 pm »

Unless they see an enemy, in which case they rush them.

Dragofire

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Re: Marksdwarves rushing to their death
« Reply #25 on: October 20, 2019, 09:41:36 am »

Use fortifications then and restrict the staircase.
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My Stuff
My Dragon Cave Scroll
We could just lie on all of our maps, or we could flood Europe.
The standard sense of Mario is that he won't murder someone but isn't good enough to not smash bugs. This is engraved into everyone’s mind.
There was one slight problem with the climb, and that was the spontaneous combustion.
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