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Author Topic: Future of the Fortress  (Read 473879 times)

voliol

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1890 on: April 13, 2019, 01:51:38 am »

Does "bribery" include promising to share the secret of life and death with someone or is that not in the current version yet?
I'm also very curious, so let me extend the question: Would vampires and other intelligent night creatures be able to offer sharing their curse as reward or create criminal organizations composed only of their brethren?

The villains talk mentioned by Knight Otu had necromancers taking apprentices under the premise of sooner or later granting them the secrets of life and death. And yes, this included having the apprentices being agents for the necromancers in exchange.

Magistrum

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1891 on: April 13, 2019, 08:19:59 am »

Oh, now that you talk about it I remember reading about it. Do you remember anything about the vampires?
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voliol

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1892 on: April 13, 2019, 12:31:48 pm »

Nothing about the vampires. Not sure if much has been mentioned.

Mel_Vixen

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1893 on: April 13, 2019, 05:07:02 pm »

Hm... that sounds much like a suggestion, but I guess what you're wondering here in the first place is how blackmail functions in game? Because that's often related to revealing information about someone they wanted to keep private. So ask about that?


Does it? But yeah he question is if "Extortion" and "blackmail" are possible/exist under the current system. 
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Manveru Taurënér

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1894 on: April 13, 2019, 05:27:30 pm »

Hm... that sounds much like a suggestion, but I guess what you're wondering here in the first place is how blackmail functions in game? Because that's often related to revealing information about someone they wanted to keep private. So ask about that?


Does it? But yeah he question is if "Extortion" and "blackmail" are possible/exist under the current system.
*

Toady briefly mentions "kind of blackmail" as a mechanic in the villain talk linked earlier, the example given that if the person that was influencing the king's advisor on behalf of the necromancer dies, the advisor could be blackmailed to continue working for the necromancer, since they've already incriminated themselves (can't remember if it was mentioned further, but that's what I could remember and find off the top of my head (17:30ish).
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Pillbo

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1895 on: April 15, 2019, 08:51:54 pm »

1. With the update to relationships coming will we see any cross race romance (if it doesn't happen now and I've just never seen it)? Ignoring half-bred offspring, I think it would be cool to see dwarves marry the local goblin or plump helmet man, or even cross-racial political marriages to give legitimacy to the odd elf who becomes a dwarven king, or to unite rival villain gangs.

2. As far as the villains go, I know they can lie and assume identities, but I was wondering if they will be able to hide inventory items from the player as part of their cover/deception with the update? This is also assuming that I've not figured out this is already happening, but it would make sense that we couldn't see what a thief is hiding in their tunic.
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Aid

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1896 on: April 16, 2019, 03:23:19 pm »

Hello Toady, I have to ask during this noise, you are watching the Game of the Thrones or if you read "A Song of Ice and Fire"?

What do you think about the combat system now? What would you like to improve or change and when can you do it?
« Last Edit: April 16, 2019, 03:25:25 pm by Aid »
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PlumpHelmetMan

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1897 on: April 16, 2019, 06:51:29 pm »

I fail to see what relevance Toady being a GoT fan has on the future of DF.

That said, I guess there aren't really that many concrete rules as to what you can or can't ask in this thread so I'm probably just being a stick-in-the-mud. :P
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Shonai_Dweller

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1898 on: April 16, 2019, 08:17:48 pm »

I fail to see what relevance Toady being a GoT fan has on the future of DF.

That said, I guess there aren't really that many concrete rules as to what you can or can't ask in this thread so I'm probably just being a stick-in-the-mud. :P
I assume the question isn't expected to be answered yes/no.
What Influences Toady in fantasy literature, by how much is very relevant. People ask about Toady's RPG influences from time to time too. It informs us as to what we might expect and what Toady may not know in order for us to make better Suggestions.

The next decade or so will see DF attempting to procgen magic systems, societies, politics, religions, culture. What input he has is very much connected to the future of the game (especially if he hasn't read it yet, it's so massive he quite probably won't and will miss what some consider to be a vital system).

Much more relevant than "have you heard of sun hats" anyway... :)
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PlumpHelmetMan

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1899 on: April 16, 2019, 08:27:04 pm »

As far as they're both bleak fantasy universes where you're afraid to become attached to any given character due to the possibility that they'll die horribly at any given moment, DF certainly resembles GoT in that regard.
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Mel_Vixen

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1900 on: April 17, 2019, 09:37:22 am »

I fail to see what relevance Toady being a GoT fan has on the future of DF.

That said, I guess there aren't really that many concrete rules as to what you can or can't ask in this thread so I'm probably just being a stick-in-the-mud. :P
Necromancers are kinda like white walkers. And Df zombies like wights. Only the necro raises new zombies without the zombies being infectious themselves. Also the necro has kinda control about the zombies like a White walker over wights.
The Zs dont die though if you kill the necromancer - nor do the have problems with obsidian ... unless you hack them to pieces with obsidian swords.
Also the wall looks like a very drwarfy thing. Plus all the backstabing and evil plans etc.
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PlumpHelmetMan

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1901 on: April 17, 2019, 03:30:41 pm »

Oh, and since I don't believe anyone else's mentioned it yet today: happy birthday, Toady! :D
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Renarin21

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1902 on: April 18, 2019, 08:58:06 am »

For the myth and magic stuff:
1. Will we ever see any "metamagic", actions/things/magic that changes how magic works/manifests?
2. Will we ever have people in-universe that try to "hack" or exploit loopholes in how the magic works, ala the dwemer from the Elder Scrolls, or the God-Learners from Glorantha?
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Manveru Taurënér

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1903 on: April 18, 2019, 10:45:18 am »

For the myth and magic stuff:
1. Will we ever see any "metamagic", actions/things/magic that changes how magic works/manifests?
2. Will we ever have people in-universe that try to "hack" or exploit loopholes in how the magic works, ala the dwemer from the Elder Scrolls, or the God-Learners from Glorantha?


Yes and yes. It's been talked about before here and there, and is also part of the plot of Threetoe's Tales foretold stories, worth a read if you want some insight into their thinking on the subject, especially the analysis segment at the end:

One of the aspects of this universe that we wanted to emphasize was the passage between the ages, which is more prominent here than in the last story involving magic (see that story's analysis for more on magic systems and metaphysics, as well as the dev page). There aren't always discrete boundaries -- much like the current DF, the world's balance can change slowly as magical creatures are killed, for example, or as rifts are shut in a multiple-rift/portal apocalypse scenario. Those apocalypse scenarios themselves, on the other hand, set a clear era boundary. The Tales Foretold setting had eight named periods involving two apocalyptic events, and several gradual changes. Sometimes the gradual changes don't involve the fading of magical forces, but rather their growth/flowering through a period of research and stability to the point where the name of the era justifiably changes. The Golden Age and Dulchari period of the Tales Foretold setting worked this way.

We'll save some of the details for a future story, but another aspect of this universe to emphasize is the interconnected mechanics like soul cradles, lines of fate, and material transmutation (in DF, this configuration would be a generated part of one universe). Magical research in the Tales Foretold system involved understanding these building blocks, and then merging them together in new ways. The access to new worlds caused by the first Nightmare Apocalypse allowed additional forms of magic to be incorporated into existing native systems, leading to the more complicated magic used by the Dulchari wizards. When Cenaster separated the world from other planes, certain forms of magic ceased to work, and it also changed the mechanics of the afterlife. In Dwarf Fortress, systematizing the way the basic metaphysical aspects of the world work will cause these effects to happen as consequences of these sorts of disasters, and ideally they'd also be able to adapt to player-led changes in the structure of the universe.
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Shonai_Dweller

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #1904 on: April 19, 2019, 10:51:45 pm »

So with players having access to villain commands, we can now kidnap, torture and sell into slavery people we don't like? That sounds fun. Will slave markets actually make it out of worldgen, or is that a future post-economy update thing? Maybe just trading them with individuals (with the right ethics)? Or sending a companion away with orders to go sell the slaves in an abstract off-map market?
« Last Edit: April 19, 2019, 11:18:23 pm by Shonai_Dweller »
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