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Author Topic: Future of the Fortress  (Read 434622 times)

Rumrusher

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2250 on: July 26, 2019, 04:00:04 am »

Wow, awesome to see more pre-mythgen magic. While I'm mostly relieved about the bogeymen change, I have to admit that part of me is probably gonna miss the little troublemakers.
after the set up of civil/playable bogeymen with just the entity animal tokens.

kinda worried if the modding potential for creatures that use the bogeyman token is now shoved to one region and or one randomly generated creature that needs to show up?

though regional/timed summoning interactions seems like a fun concept where creatures can just pop up out of thin air. really don't know about the bogeyman changes given uhh on one hand it might make playable bogeymen either a straight up raw dump custom creature file or dfhack thing and not entity animal token domestication thing the site just does, but having said region where the 'cackling' summons and kills them be in one area means if someone gets past the hurdle of making them playable in the new update they won't have to fear the night twice as harder than a normal adventurer

It might be the heat wave getting me as well, but I can't get my head around that question. My guess is that it is supposed to be parsed something like this:

Will the new changes to boogeymen that restrict them to certain evil biomes affect all creatures with the [BOOGEYMAN] token? Or just the generated ones? Will we be able to choose whether to restrict a modded creature, and if so, are there any further moddable options (restricting to only GOOD biomes, only biomes connected to a certain sphere etc.)?

(I'm sorry if I misunderstood a part. Still, even if that wasn't what that question was supposed to be I still want the answer to this one)
seems like you got most of the question, but it mostly wondering if the bogeyman spawn in state which I usually call 'the cackling' for clarity is going to be restricted to just where the nightmare demon and the nightmare sphere? like given how demons hang out with goblins forts it would likely means dark towers who are notoriously known to be fps killing experiences will just have bogeymen spawning in. this set up would probably make dark fortresses even more of a place no one will just go to out of fear of extreme slowdown.

on a different topic is there anything in the future for cavern exploring for adventurers? since all this talk about surface problems remind me that there no incentive to draw folks to the caverns in the recent update.
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FantasticDorf

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2251 on: July 26, 2019, 05:56:05 am »

Wow, awesome to see more pre-mythgen magic. While I'm mostly relieved about the bogeymen change, I have to admit that part of me is probably gonna miss the little troublemakers.
after the set up of civil/playable bogeymen with just the entity animal tokens.

kinda worried if the modding potential for creatures that use the bogeyman token is now shoved to one region and or one randomly generated creature that needs to show up?

though regional/timed summoning interactions seems like a fun concept where creatures can just pop up out of thin air. really don't know about the bogeyman changes given uhh on one hand it might make playable bogeymen either a straight up raw dump custom creature file or dfhack thing and not entity animal token domestication thing the site just does, but having said region where the 'cackling' summons and kills them be in one area means if someone gets past the hurdle of making them playable in the new update they won't have to fear the night twice as harder than a normal adventurer
Will the new changes to boogeymen that restrict them to certain evil biomes affect all creatures with the [BOOGEYMAN] token? Or just the generated ones? Will we be able to choose whether to restrict a modded creature, and if so, are there any further moddable options (restricting to only GOOD biomes, only biomes connected to a certain sphere etc.)?

Primordial evil (our current, naturalised evil for generic evil tag monsters) and spherical evil are seperate concepts in the devlog as i understand it, bogeymen having their raws opened up might need to ignore the fact that fortresses are constantly bathed in light, until such a faculty or day/night and lighting is added, or to explain that its exonerated by the corruptive ground letting them manifest for as long as they like.
  • Very much depends how it's implemented @Rumrusher, if a sphere corruption and [Evil] is enough to actually manifest, the biome would be completely optional if supported like that. That's my running assumption on how Toady is going to implement wide swathes of monsters, as unlanded normal animals just don't exist in the world without a biome.
Will we have more UI warning information and pop'ups for players when embarking upon a corrupted land of what kind of sphere it is? Especially since in theory a fortress close to a tomb could come under range of a corruption spread offsite probably needs to know, if there aren't any noticable effects if reprecussions come up later. Like blight spheres killing crops etc.

This might have amusing/immersive implications when the creatures in [FORCED_SPHERE:DEATH] (as a example of explicitly needing a sphere instead of primordially existing, and receding when the corruption goes away) start appearing around necromancer towers and mummy crypts rather than explicitly just death-demon towers.
« Last Edit: July 26, 2019, 06:05:45 am by FantasticDorf »
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Rumrusher

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2252 on: July 26, 2019, 07:16:41 am »

Wow, awesome to see more pre-mythgen magic. While I'm mostly relieved about the bogeymen change, I have to admit that part of me is probably gonna miss the little troublemakers.
after the set up of civil/playable bogeymen with just the entity animal tokens.

kinda worried if the modding potential for creatures that use the bogeyman token is now shoved to one region and or one randomly generated creature that needs to show up?

though regional/timed summoning interactions seems like a fun concept where creatures can just pop up out of thin air. really don't know about the bogeyman changes given uhh on one hand it might make playable bogeymen either a straight up raw dump custom creature file or dfhack thing and not entity animal token domestication thing the site just does, but having said region where the 'cackling' summons and kills them be in one area means if someone gets past the hurdle of making them playable in the new update they won't have to fear the night twice as harder than a normal adventurer
Will the new changes to boogeymen that restrict them to certain evil biomes affect all creatures with the [BOOGEYMAN] token? Or just the generated ones? Will we be able to choose whether to restrict a modded creature, and if so, are there any further moddable options (restricting to only GOOD biomes, only biomes connected to a certain sphere etc.)?

Primordial evil (our current, naturalised evil for generic evil tag monsters) and spherical evil are seperate concepts in the devlog as i understand it, bogeymen having their raws opened up might need to ignore the fact that fortresses are constantly bathed in light, until such a faculty or day/night and lighting is added, or to explain that its exonerated by the corruptive ground letting them manifest for as long as they like.
  • Very much depends how it's implemented @Rumrusher, if a sphere corruption and [Evil] is enough to actually manifest, the biome would be completely optional if supported like that. That's my running assumption on how Toady is going to implement wide swathes of monsters, as unlanded normal animals just don't exist in the world without a biome.
Will we have more UI warning information and pop'ups for players when embarking upon a corrupted land of what kind of sphere it is? Especially since in theory a fortress close to a tomb could come under range of a corruption spread offsite probably needs to know, if there aren't any noticable effects if reprecussions come up later. Like blight spheres killing crops etc.

This might have amusing/immersive implications when the creatures in [FORCED_SPHERE:DEATH] (as a example of explicitly needing a sphere instead of primordially existing, and receding when the corruption goes away) start appearing around necromancer towers and mummy crypts rather than explicitly just death-demon towers.

bogeymen don't have to worry about the whole light and indoor stuff when they are pulled from the cackling, as is any creature who has [NIGHT_CREATURE_BOGEYMAN] just act like normal (outside of their corpses have a small shelf life before vaporising), so far the bogeyman token just gives a special event where they could spawn from nothing at night, and instantly kills any creature with the token if the special event ends including those preexisting from world gen hmm also probably kills any pre-existing creature if they aren't closer to the adventurer when the cackling is active.

It's kinda why I kept talking about 'the Cackling' the whole time as it's the event(or well the end of said event) that kills bogeymen not the bogeymen themselves dying due to certain conditions.
so this is going off the assumption that bogeymen will just linger around dark fortresses (which would be favored as this envisions goblins arming bogeymen with armor and weapons thus making them the elite force to the goblin army) along with trolls and goblins and not just some night trap to halt adventurers from trying to solo a dark fortress.

though if both happen it means it's probably FUN to activate the cackling near the spire to quickly wipe out the bogey-army inside when you enter the spire, then all the goblins and trolls who saw their friends instantly die in front of them take emotional stress damage.


So far my issue is the chance of no bogeymen existing in a region due to a dice roll of world gen via demon selection not evil region than the shoving bogeymen to goblin sites so the common player could avoid them more easily and not just get assaulted on day 0.
« Last Edit: July 26, 2019, 07:20:04 am by Rumrusher »
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Beag

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2253 on: July 26, 2019, 04:14:43 pm »

1. Will other backgrounds besides hearth person in adventure mode confer a special status in your starting site?
2. How many of the background skills will eventually be usable in adventure mode?
3. Will demon towers exist for all spheres for purposes of region changing or just certain spheres? If only a few which ones.
4. Will our player adventurers be able to use magic divination dice?
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ZM5

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2254 on: July 26, 2019, 05:08:56 pm »


4. Will our player adventurers be able to use magic divination dice?

Going by this bit, yes - "And, um, the divinations doing things sometimes. I went to a shrine, rolled a tin icosahedral die and it was a bad roll and I was cursed to be a snowy owl for a week. So I flew up to a nearby rooftop and pondered tangents.".

PlumpHelmetMan

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2255 on: July 26, 2019, 05:16:10 pm »

There's also the fact that pretty much every form of magic already in the game can be accessed by adventurers (vampirism, lycanthropy, necromancy) so having divination be any different would be kind of arbitrary IMO.
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Eric Blank

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2256 on: July 26, 2019, 09:16:25 pm »

Do or can summoned creatures have souls? Is it possible to summon something that becomes a permanent historical figure, talks to people etc without causing crashes?(a problem Ive faced with reanimated intelligent body parts)
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Egan_BW

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2257 on: July 26, 2019, 09:29:26 pm »

Will there be a skill associated with Divination, or maybe some other barrier to entry like needing to get someone to tell you how to do it?
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therahedwig

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2258 on: July 27, 2019, 06:26:00 am »

How much effect do the gods themselves have on the divination? Or are their uh... structures still too barebones to do anything there? Are we also going to see stuff like card-reading, crystal gazing and entrails reading(proper necromancy :D), will necromancers in specific do necromancy? Do you have any plans for divinations themselves to actually predict the future, or will they primarily be communications?

For some reason when discussing future-reading magic I always imagined trances, so the dice caught me off guard :D

Oh, oh, oh, can histfigs observe and tell each other about divinations/game outcomes? Because a lot of stories start with an (un)lucky roll of the dice :D Did you manage to have histfigs themselves be capable of rolling dice?
« Last Edit: July 27, 2019, 06:35:11 am by therahedwig »
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ZM5

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2259 on: July 27, 2019, 07:46:04 am »

Are there any plans to change how ranged weapons work in adventure mode and in the raws before the big wait? By that I mean, being able to change the firing/reload speed on an individual basis, or being able to aim for specific body parts.

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2260 on: July 27, 2019, 01:53:33 pm »

There's also the fact that pretty much every form of magic already in the game can be accessed by adventurers (vampirism, lycanthropy, necromancy) so having divination be any different would be kind of arbitrary IMO.

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2261 on: July 27, 2019, 02:32:33 pm »

Damn last blogpost spawned a lot of questions which is very cool!
1. What if npc or player steals the divination dice/s from shrine? Will they get cursed if they wont return the dice/s in some days later?
2. Do divination dice's count as artifacts?
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Noventrice

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2262 on: July 27, 2019, 05:46:23 pm »

What sort of activities prevent evil from fading from an area? Is it only evil activities such as evil clouds/rain? Could I theoretically be in an area as it becomes more good or does my presence there count as activity?
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PlumpHelmetMan

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2263 on: July 27, 2019, 06:24:19 pm »

I think Toady meant the activity of evil creatures, and even then just those he's indicated to be capable of influencing the evil level of a region (which I think is currently limited to demons, necromancers, and intelligent undead).
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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #2264 on: July 28, 2019, 06:01:47 pm »

Will certain megabeasts be able to spread evil regions?
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