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Author Topic: Future of the Fortress  (Read 975136 times)

FantasticDorf

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #3390 on: August 04, 2020, 07:31:09 am »

snip
Suggestions belong in the suggestions sub forum http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?board=5.0.

Yeah ditto suggestions into suggestion forum pretty please @ArrowheadArcher. But its strange i was just thinking about the arsenal dwarf, in regards to past replies on equipment mismanagement by wg entities, the code isn't technically defunct either (still a valid position responsibility, effect it has is neglible in fort mode from testing unless it does stuff in w.g) but its still one of those longstanding obsolete things.

There's never a 100% gurantee some of this side-stuff like the recently added 'advisor' roles will get more fleshing out or delayed villian stuff unfurled to its full length, but the steam release is making good progress as is from what it appears.
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Thisaccountis42

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #3391 on: August 04, 2020, 04:34:25 pm »

Could future updates see specific dishes or cuisines associated with certain civs and/or sites?
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Shonai_Dweller

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #3392 on: August 04, 2020, 05:00:29 pm »

Could future updates see specific dishes or cuisines associated with certain civs and/or sites?
Yes, this is planned and in the devnotes. It was almost part of the taverns update but was cut for time, likely not to be attempted again until the economy is done to make it worthwhile.
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therahedwig

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #3393 on: August 05, 2020, 05:27:23 am »

I actually went back and looked, and I don't see any mention of economy regarding tavern games and recipes. Rather that these things require generators, and that there's no official place in the roadmap where they'd go. So for all we know it might be M&M release 2.3 ;) (which isn't too weird an idea either, most of the mentioned myth gen magic systems seem to use materials, so I am assuming we'll see magic potions before too long)

Especially given worldgen does have gambling and there's the divination dice already.
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Shonai_Dweller

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #3394 on: August 05, 2020, 06:34:26 am »

I actually went back and looked, and I don't see any mention of economy regarding tavern games and recipes. Rather that these things require generators, and that there's no official place in the roadmap where they'd go. So for all we know it might be M&M release 2.3 ;) (which isn't too weird an idea either, most of the mentioned myth gen magic systems seem to use materials, so I am assuming we'll see magic potions before too long)

Especially given worldgen does have gambling and there's the divination dice already.
They were part of the taverns update:
Quote
Set prices/activities
Recipes/drink quality
Games
Dwarves can gamble with outsiders
Ability to play games directly if a dwarf is involved
The generators weren't made and they've now been put off. Most likely (fotf answer somewhere) until the economy makes them more worthwhile.

--edit
Fotf quote:
(Mostly other people start talking about the economy in fotf answers, but closest from Toady was this, which mainly covers games/gambling. Unless there was something later).
Quote
So, yeah, we had planned to break the tavern stuff up and get two reasonably short releases in.  Then we did the normal thing and this release ended up not quite as short, and then we started feeling a little uncomfortable continuing on in the same vein for too long.  And getting a bit over-excited about the myth stuff as we played around with the generator side project.  Coupled with the gambling vs economy+justice problem, we are leaning toward the artifact release now after this.  I still really like the random games and recipe ideas though.  They may find side generators of their own lighting a fire under them before long.

« Last Edit: August 05, 2020, 06:44:28 am by Shonai_Dweller »
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FantasticDorf

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #3395 on: August 05, 2020, 07:17:57 am »

I've kind of gotten a bit hung up on equipment management thoughts, and drifted over to the economy.

1. Criminal behaviour such as embezzling suggests w.g civ/off-site dwarves end up earning a wage, same as devlog comments on wealthy patrons buying buildings. Are there any other implicit w.g things that dwarves spend their money on?

2. Is there any particular ordering of precedence to w.g payment for civ/non-fort-site positions or is it handled in some hardcoded way?

3. If poverty is a issue for a large majority of roles regarding the site-level army in supplimenting its equipment, do you think that it would impact responsibilities like [RESPONSIBILITY:UPGRADE_SQUAD_EQUIPMENT] (from the arsenal-dwarf, still a valid token to use but doesn't really do anything) capability to function without first procuring more money not spent elsewhere into funding better equipment?


I mainly say this because im in the middle of writing a suggestion thread as i speak; about the economics of how compared to mercenaries and rich folk operate in the mini-economy and some suggestions on how to budget armies a little bit more so that sieges can differ in quality between different civs at different levels of wealth. It'd be nice to have some informative quotes by the next time the FotF rolls around.

Its novel to think that humans while being the most merchantile grop with the highest respect for commerce, propensity to build merchant companies, (and some guilds to refine goods) are often fielding the worst armies quality wise in mass deployment of copper equipment, because the person in charge of the squads is a low paid and ranking member of their society with enormous gambling debts.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2020, 07:21:02 am by FantasticDorf »
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Uthimienure

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #3396 on: August 05, 2020, 11:05:37 am »

RE: The artifacts your dwarves have created in fort mode. In the UI work you're doing, will you be making it easier to pinpoint where artifacts are located?

Example: "L" screen, then set an F-key to follow an artifact, then using that F-key centers the screen on the artifact, so far, so good.  After this is when it can get frustrating because the cursor isn't located on the artifact, and if the map edge is nearby it can take a lot of searching to find using "t". Sometimes I've even given up!


EDIT:  Nevermind, simply zoom in closely and then it's much easier. Duh!
« Last Edit: August 05, 2020, 11:10:52 am by Uthimienure »
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ror6ax

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #3397 on: August 07, 2020, 04:50:33 am »




Will adventure mode get graphical paper-doll equipment screen?
Will there be daytime/nighttime change in DF? At least purely cosmetically it would be nice IMO.
Can we have animation for wind swaying the trees lightly? Pretty please :)
Will there be animations for moving objects, destroying objects, dorf attacks, fire, waterfalls etc?


« Last Edit: August 07, 2020, 04:52:47 am by ror6ax »
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Shonai_Dweller

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #3398 on: August 07, 2020, 04:55:16 am »




Will adventure mode get graphical paper-doll equipment screen?
Will there be daytime/nighttime change in DF? At least purely cosmetically it would be nice IMO.
Can we have animation for wind swaying the trees lightly? Pretty please :)
Will there be animations for moving objects, destroying objects, dorf attacks, fire, waterfalls etc?



Day and night (in Fortress Mode), No. Answered last month (or the month before). Would just be annoying flashing through day and night cycles every couple of seconds unless the timescale (and therefore the entire gameplay of Fortress mode) changed drastically.

Adventurer of course, already has it.
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Gadersd

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #3399 on: August 07, 2020, 09:56:48 am »

Do you have any interest in adding evolutionary capabilities to the game? I think having physical features naturally adapt to each environment would add a lot of interesting variety to the game. Maybe even aspects of personality and mind can be tied to genetics in the game? Regarding the time scales, I have made a few simulations of my own and evolution can happen very fast in some circumstances. Wars and environment changes can spur rapid change in the gene distribution. This may be out of scope for what you have in mind for DF, but I think it could lead to interesting cases, such as magically inclined or  magically resistant populations.
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FantasticDorf

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #3400 on: August 07, 2020, 11:14:12 am »

Do you have any interest in adding evolutionary capabilities to the game? I think having physical features naturally adapt to each environment would add a lot of interesting variety to the game. Maybe even aspects of personality and mind can be tied to genetics in the game? Regarding the time scales, I have made a few simulations of my own and evolution can happen very fast in some circumstances. Wars and environment changes can spur rapid change in the gene distribution. This may be out of scope for what you have in mind for DF, but I think it could lead to interesting cases, such as magically inclined or  magically resistant populations.

Genetics are in the game, but they aren't very well fleshed out. For instance it was definitely poked around that it might have been possible to either cheat or by complete internal game fluke, have a dwarf (from the mother's race) inherit the bright hair hues of a goblin parent, which lead to some speculation about dwarves with player desirable bright pink beards, but the most likely result is that it'd not work, crash to desktop or create some sort of freaky null child.
  • Most inherient traits are racial on creature.txt, but express themselves differently in individuals, even the most altruistic goblin still might have a roaring temper simply by the way they were born, so i can't really say anything about mind traits in current context. Creatures also follow their ethical & moral code defined in civ's pretty dilligently too, a homogenized goblin in the dwarf civ with a big beard and head full of dwarf bunk of law, order etc, is still a bit of a psychotic short fuse.
With features like beard color being more visible by the promotional content for the steam release, do you think that there would ever be such popularity for a feature or increased requests for ways to aesthetically alter dwarf's beards or other body aspects through in-game means (bleaching beards, barbering & dying, tattoos, bodypaint, yikes deliberately cutting off hair as punishment etc.)

Something emergent like elves suddenly isolated and under shaping of dark forces becoming orcs (which is a device of Tolkien) or even the radical transformation of necromancer-experiments is a example of forced evolution. The people affected by it just live with it, when the site government falls apart for whatever reason they're thrown out into the world free to follow their wishes, they aren't night creatures but its easy to draw a association, a bit like when you judge a goblin in a tavern is automatically a spy.
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LordBaal

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #3401 on: August 07, 2020, 11:54:03 am »

I have a question regarding the code. In the past the idea was to have the code delivered to the NY Museum of Arts in the case of Toady passing. First, I dont know if that actuallt meant the code would be made public or only parts of it as some display of sorts. Second, is that still the plan? Or now the code wont be released ever to anyone?

Also, Toady, would you aprove of us trying to use necromancy in that case to bring you back? I mean, what could go wrong?
.
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Bumber

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #3402 on: August 07, 2020, 12:55:07 pm »

I have a question regarding the code. In the past the idea was to have the code delivered to the NY Museum of Arts in the case of Toady passing. First, I dont know if that actuallt meant the code would be made public or only parts of it as some display of sorts. Second, is that still the plan? Or now the code wont be released ever to anyone?

Also, Toady, would you aprove of us trying to use necromancy in that case to bring you back? I mean, what could go wrong?
.

Last I heard, the plan was to release the source to everyone as long as Toady dies of natural causes.
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Putnam

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #3403 on: August 09, 2020, 03:37:02 pm »

1. At this point, will we still be able to mod in new items/workshops by simply editing the raws ?

already can, this is not liable to change

Can personality be tied to political beliefs? In the next version, will there be political beliefs and non-theism/anti-theism that will also develop much like personality?

there already are political beliefs, in a gigantic block in the center of all personality screens, with more "deviant" political beliefs for their civilization highlighted in cyan

MrWiggles

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #3404 on: August 09, 2020, 08:51:38 pm »





Will there be daytime/nighttime change in DF? At least purely cosmetically it would be nice IMO.




To add to this. This was decided really early on by the community in part. There wont be a day/night cycle in Fort mode because players valued having some dorfs always active over period of time where there were no dorfs active.
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