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Author Topic: Future of the Fortress  (Read 2100312 times)

clinodev

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #4650 on: July 01, 2022, 03:54:37 am »

Thanks as always for the replies!

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Rumrusher

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #4651 on: July 01, 2022, 05:32:51 am »


Yeah, FantasticDorf is correct, though I've already forgotten the details.  I don't remember specifically why regular zombies/evil creatures etc. were a casualty of this, or if they exist anywhere outside of demon/necro/mummy influence zones.  We moved the nightmare stuff to certain of them, but of course that doesn't really come up in the fort (we could have bogeyman in those regions attack isolated dwarves sometimes and just ignore the day/night part of it if we were cruel I suppose.)


having experience the current version bogeymen the only good way this would come up to a fort mode player is if they play adv mode to summon a bunch then use one of the few vanilla ways to keep them around long enough to show up to harass the folks in fort mode(when they switch back to fort mode), though this does lead to the scenario of your dwarven citizens watching one lone (spider or experiment, or resurrected intel undead) adventurer wander to the fort at night spawning a bunch of night critters only to talk to a bunch of them and then die on the spot... or walk under some roof and settle down in the fort while a bunch of the citizens unlucky to be on the nightmare evil biome surface when this mess started now has to deal with a bunch of trapavoid dodgy critters that shapeshift.
so a challenge for anyone willing to set it up for their fort.

do wanna say thanks for keeping bogeymen in the game and the polymorph interaction open the door for some fun testing and experiences with how they function in a fort setting, both as a foe and as a friend.
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brewer bob

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #4652 on: July 01, 2022, 06:43:56 am »

Thanks for the replies!
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Doorkeeper

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #4654 on: July 02, 2022, 10:28:14 pm »

Hillocks have shallow underground farms. Will the changes to soil farming affect crop yields in hillocks? More generally, does the sim now track whether a site has shallow sub farms or deep sub farms, and does crop production for that site correspond accordingly?

upd: upon further inspection the tiles inside the individual hillock structures are actually made of cavern floors... so it looks like they're just deep farming, technically. not shallow farming as implied by location.

Although as you've mentioned in your most recent response, the hill dwarves could have gathered the "improved" soil from the mountainhome. That's my headcanon for now, at least.

How would that work anyway, if you were to add a soil gathering zone? Since soil is a material and is the same regardless of depth, plus cavern floors are currently just rock overlaid with mud. Would the rock/mud gathered from a cavern have a special flag for plot improvement use?

upd2: haven't noticed this before until now, but i've dug out an indoor surface soil layer in fort mode, and the resulting floor tiles are labeled as cavern floor. Wondering if this was also changed as part of the farming overhaul. "Cavern Floor" just indicates that the tile attribute is subterranean, as far as i can tell (it's not displayed if vegetation is growing on it). But still wondering if the changes you've made affect this label since players could read "Cavern Floor" and confuse shallow soil for the cavern surface. I'm also not sure anymore if this means the hillock farm plots are counted as cavern/deep farming, since I initially assumed they were because the tiles were labeled as cavern floors.

Spoiler: screenshot (click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: July 03, 2022, 03:42:56 am by Doorkeeper »
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clinodev

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #4655 on: July 03, 2022, 04:42:26 am »


Although as you've mentioned in your most recent response, the hill dwarves could have gathered the "improved" soil from the mountainhome. That's my headcanon for now, at least.

How would that work anyway, if you were to add a soil gathering zone? Since soil is a material and is the same regardless of depth, plus cavern floors are currently just rock overlaid with mud. Would the rock/mud gathered from a cavern have a special flag for plot improvement use?

Perhaps we'll discover pigs and poultry will convert muddied stone into cavern floors. Pigs in particular were iron age cultivator's champions, widely used to clear small plots for horticulture. They'll uproot and "plow" a plot of woodland, clearing tangled briars, digging up rocks, toppling saplings, and small trees, preparing the soil while providing fertilization and soil aeration. Irish small tenants and cottiers were still using the method in the 19th and into the 20th century. They'd finish digging what they reasonably could of potatoes and other edible roots, then turn the pigs into last years plot, and plant the pig's old yard. Poultry will clean up a lot of what pigs miss.

I can imagine dwarves moving livestock from plot to plot like this, and pigs sure do like mushrooms! Perhaps some cavern beasties could be assigned a plowing flag as well, drunians look like they might enjoy a good root while watching for easier food to steal, and I could imagine draltha doing it without really intending to!

It would be a clever way to use animal fertilizer without dealing with fertilizer products.

Another "new farming" question: How does a potash fertilized muddied stone/soil plot compare with cavern plots? How about with potash fertilized cavern plots? Some cleverness with the numbers could make potash fertilization useful for more than specialist early quarry bush cultivation.

(clinodev spent much of his childhood bewailing the fate that put him on a farm, and half of his adulthood kind of wishing he could go back. So it goes.)
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Eric Blank

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #4656 on: July 03, 2022, 07:40:31 pm »



Perhaps we'll discover pigs and poultry will convert muddied stone into cavern floors. Pigs in particular were iron age cultivator's champions, widely used to clear small plots for horticulture. They'll uproot and "plow" a plot of woodland, clearing tangled briars, digging up rocks, toppling saplings, and small trees, preparing the soil while providing fertilization and soil aeration. Irish small tenants and cottiers were still using the method in the 19th and into the 20th century. They'd finish digging what they reasonably could of potatoes and other edible roots, then turn the pigs into last years plot, anplant the pig's old yard. Poultry will clean up a lot of what pigs miss.
This is what my family used our sow for, and she was very effective. The chickens help keep the insect pests down but they'll uproot your plants to do it. Pig feces is so good plants will grow in it which the pig ate. She ate a squash and grew her own squash plant and then ate the squash it grew.
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scriver

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #4657 on: July 04, 2022, 03:36:44 am »

The Circle of Sty

Edit: finally we will sneak in the feces feature after all
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Bloodwarrior

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #4658 on: July 06, 2022, 01:49:45 pm »

1. When will the development page on the dwarf fortress site be updated.

2 how quickly is progress going on premium and any time frame for it

3 once magic and myth update comes out in what ways can during gameplay can a deity manifest


Also Iím having trouble changing this to lime green
« Last Edit: July 08, 2022, 09:37:32 pm by Bloodwarrior »
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voliol

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #4659 on: July 06, 2022, 03:57:51 pm »

1. When will the development page on the dwarf fortress site be updated.

2 how quickly is progress going on premium and any time frame for it


Also Iím having trouble changing this to lime green

The "[/color]" token has to be on the other side of the text, like a right parenthesis, but I fixed it for you in case you don't frequent this thread.

2. "How quickly" is a tricky wording, but I would say progress is being steadily made. From the Release Roadmap from February, and various other sources where they seem to be leaning towards an Adventure-mode-less initial release, along with the progress they've shown, I would guess sometime this fall, or at latest early 2023. It is anybody's guess though. Blind has another interview with Tarn later this month (July 14) where I hope the question comes up, so we might know better then.

Immortal-D

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #4660 on: July 08, 2022, 12:29:33 pm »

Regarding the changes to farming (and I suppose subterranean effects in general); Will there be any changes to the way 'light-dark' tiles are calculated?  Right now, once a tile is exposed to the surface it becomes permanently 'light', even when covered again, meaning you can neutralize cave adaptation without risk.

Waterlimon

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #4661 on: July 08, 2022, 12:53:29 pm »

Will steam version have the option to display water depth as 1-7? Not necessarily numbers but at least different tile image?
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Rose

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #4662 on: July 08, 2022, 06:28:11 pm »

Will steam version have the option to display water depth as 1-7? Not necessarily numbers but at least different tile image?
It does! There's been numerous devlogs showing this off.
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UselessMcMiner

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #4663 on: July 08, 2022, 07:02:56 pm »

I've noticed that custom modded bloodsucker races with their own entities perform bloodsucker purges. I dont think this is a bug since it makes sense for other races to purge bloodsuckers but is them doing it to themselves intended? limegreen
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Eric Blank

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #4664 on: July 08, 2022, 08:02:02 pm »

I dont think entire races/civs of [BLOODSUCKER]s was actually intended. The vanilla implementation up until now has been purely in the form of vampire curses, so it makes sense the behaviors associated with it dont have any modifications for civs of bloodsuckers. That's something I hope to see in the future, though, as I wanted my Blood Elves to be undead vampiric nightcreatures.
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