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Author Topic: Future of the Fortress  (Read 411261 times)

Fishyfire

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #810 on: August 24, 2018, 11:37:45 am »

I have found a PDF containing potentially useful materials information, may be interesting.

http://www-mdp.eng.cam.ac.uk/web/library/enginfo/cueddatabooks/materials.pdf
« Last Edit: August 24, 2018, 11:41:50 am by Fishyfire »
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Putnam

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #811 on: August 25, 2018, 06:31:45 am »

I have found a PDF containing potentially useful materials information, may be interesting.

http://www-mdp.eng.cam.ac.uk/web/library/enginfo/cueddatabooks/materials.pdf

I actually made a suggestion thread on this a while back. In hindsight, I'm not sure bones are isotropic and I know they're not homogeneous, but it's not like the game models mats that aren't, so.

Beag

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #812 on: August 25, 2018, 03:33:28 pm »

1. What sort of laws/religious stuff do you think needs to be added specifically for the villain update?
2. Will criminal organizations inside the same town or city fight each other?
3. Will this change in the number of criminal organizations per town or city open up more kinds of missions for player adventurer's in those groups?
4. In the villain update how much will laws vary between civilizations and will there be a way for the player adventurers to find out what those laws are?
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Blaze_1711

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #813 on: August 25, 2018, 06:19:40 pm »

Is it possible that, with the myth and magic updates' progress, we might end up seeing a powerful enough mage/sorcerer/warlock/summoner/god/angel/demon/thing casting a mass spell on a city or region? Bring in some sort of demonic mist over the place or straight up warp a whole castle/village into a pocket dimension/hell itself?
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KittyTac

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #814 on: August 25, 2018, 10:48:00 pm »

Is it possible that, with the myth and magic updates' progress, we might end up seeing a powerful enough mage/sorcerer/warlock/summoner/god/angel/demon/thing casting a mass spell on a city or region? Bring in some sort of demonic mist over the place or straight up warp a whole castle/village into a pocket dimension/hell itself?
Common element in fantasy stories. Will probably occur depending on the world.
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golemgunk

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #815 on: August 26, 2018, 03:35:04 am »

Is it possible that, with the myth and magic updates' progress, we might end up seeing a powerful enough mage/sorcerer/warlock/summoner/god/angel/demon/thing casting a mass spell on a city or region? Bring in some sort of demonic mist over the place or straight up warp a whole castle/village into a pocket dimension/hell itself?

The stuff being worked on right now is probably going to lead to situations like this directly. Villains having goals and making people do their bidding will become a lot more interesting when magic becomes a part of this. Wizards and cults doing spells in the name of gods they worship and affecting the world at large sounds plausible.
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BassDwarf

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #816 on: August 26, 2018, 06:09:45 am »

So with the with the implementation of sites outside of yours that are within your holdings and the ability to exile Dwarves there to remove them from your fortress and visa versa, what would be the chance of getting "work sites" and the chance of this being done before the big wait?

By work site, I mean things like mines, logging camps, farms etc.

Starting on a site with no iron can be a real problem and require you to only outfit people with copper/bronze or painstakingly trade for iron and coal or cheese multiple sieges with traps until you can melt down Goblin weapons and armor until you have enough iron to equip the militia. When with these outside work sites, you can send Dwarves off to prospect for any type of material and they begin working a mine, sending a caravan back periodically and supplying the fortress with materials. This can extend to ores, wood, food, sand, clay and more and would help fortresses lacking in various things on the embark.

Plus with farms, you can have Dwarves run ranches etc without the issue of 30 cows damaging the FPS but you still get milk, meat and leather.

Then you have the fun of attacks on the work sites, a gold mine raided by bandits, or a Goblin faction you are at war with attacks your mine rather than your fortress, and of course, Elves upset with your logging camp send in the war grizzly's to stop the deforestation, all of which can kill and scatter your Dwarves, them returning with the tale of the attack.

Naturally this can expand adventure mode too, with them becoming randomly generated sites in history and can be formed and lost as the world progresses, and your lord could send you off to cause trouble/raze a nearby goblin mine. Plus these work sites can act as war justification/cause, "the war started over a disagreement over local resources" or some such matter.

I understand that there are plans that outside hillocks will be able to send food etc but I think having, smaller, more focused sites would also be a decent addition to fortress mode as well as the world building that benefits adventure mod.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2018, 09:24:15 am by BassDwarf »
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Shonai_Dweller

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #817 on: August 26, 2018, 06:29:06 am »

So with the with the implementation of sites outside of yours that are within your holdings and the ability to exile Dwarves there to remove them from your fortress and visa versa, what would be the chance of getting "work sites" and the chance of this being done before the big wait?

By work site, I mean things like mines, logging camps, farms etc.

Starting on a site with no iron can be a real problem and require you to only outfit people with copper/bronze or painstakingly trade for iron and coal or cheese multiple sieges with traps until you can melt down Goblin weapons and armor until you have enough iron to equip the militia. When with these outside work sites, you can send Dwarves off to prospect for any type of material and they begin working a mine, sending a caravan back periodically and supplying the fortress with materials. This can extend to ores, wood, food, sand, clay and more and would help fortresses lacking in various things on the embark.

Plus with farms, you can have Dwarves run ranches etc without the issue of 30 cows damaging the FPS but you still get milk, meat and leather.

Then you have the fun of attacks on the work sites, a gold mine raided by bandits, or a Goblin faction you are at war with attacks your mine rather than your fortress, and of course, Elves upset with your logging camp send in the war grizzly's to stop the deforestation, all of which can kill and scatter your Dwarves, them returning with the tale of the attack.

Naturally this can expand adventure mode too, with them becoming randomly generated sites in history and can be formed and lost as the world progresses, and your lord could send you off to cause trouble/raze a nearby goblin mine. Plus these work sites can act as war justification/cause, "the war started over a disagreement over local resources" or some such matter.

I understand that there are plans that outside hillocks will be able to send food etc but I think having, smaller, more focused sites would also be a decent addition to fortress mode as well as the world building that benefits adventure mod.
Lime green text if that's a question.
Probable answer is  "almost none" since it's not on the list of development points for pre-big wait development. Sites with specific purposes is part of the law/property update probably, so not for quite a while yet.

Might be worth a post in the suggestions forum though.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2018, 06:33:13 am by Shonai_Dweller »
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BassDwarf

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #818 on: August 26, 2018, 09:30:45 am »

Lime green text if that's a question.
Probable answer is  "almost none" since it's not on the list of development points for pre-big wait development. Sites with specific purposes is part of the law/property update probably, so not for quite a while yet.

Might be worth a post in the suggestions forum though.

Thanks for informing me about the lime green, my bad.

I know its not in the pre-big wait unfortunately, and unless Toady magically changes his mind on this question, we may have to wait until law/property, I just think its a feature worth investing in, especially with the prospect we are gonna have to go 2+ years of no updates and Toady really wants to give us a decent chunk of content to keep us busy and large parts of which primarily effect adv mode content, giving fort mode something new that would expand things would be nice. This would then also give low population forts a better chance of thriving and surviving, and low population means better FPS.
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George_Chickens

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #819 on: August 26, 2018, 10:35:43 am »

Is it ever planned for the DF map to be "continuous"? As in, will fluid that runs off the map and minecarts shot out of it always just disappear for good, or one day will we see these fluids and items actually go somewhere and affect wherever they land?

I'm particularly curious about this for moving fortress parts. It'll be hard to make a weapon to surpass Metal Gear if we can't use rails to shoot things off site with it.
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PatrikLundell

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #820 on: August 26, 2018, 12:22:32 pm »

Is it ever planned for the DF map to be "continuous"? As in, will fluid that runs off the map and minecarts shot out of it always just disappear for good, or one day will we see these fluids and items actually go somewhere and affect wherever they land?

I'm particularly curious about this for moving fortress parts. It'll be hard to make a weapon to surpass Metal Gear if we can't use rails to shoot things off site with it.
To do that DF would have to keep more of the world loaded, which means trees etc. would grow outside of our embark, corpses and arrows, plus your minecarts, of course, litter it, etc. This would probably result in X * Y embarks require an (X+2)*(Y+2) memory footprint, with all the associated issues of junglification (with no cutting except the occasional fire, which we presumably could set off ourselves...). On top of that, we'd have issues at the world tile boundaries, although I wouldn't be surprised if the map rewrite takes world tile straddling issues into consideration.
Caravans and visitors (and our raiding parties) would similarly have to pass this "almost included" terrain, and possibly deal with with critters there.
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feelotraveller

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #821 on: August 26, 2018, 09:50:25 pm »

In celebration of the (first) anniversary of the last announced ban on the forum, I'd like to ask, is this an unreservedly a 'good thing'?  ...which is my way of asking about that pachyderm over there without actually naming it...

Separately, are there any plans to reintroduce Dwarven Parties?  I ask because stress balancing and addressing the difficulty of forming relationships seem to be on the table in the near future.  (I always liked that mechanic.  ;))

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Shonai_Dweller

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #822 on: August 26, 2018, 10:02:36 pm »

In celebration of the (first) anniversary of the last announced ban on the forum, I'd like to ask, is this an unreservedly a 'good thing'?  ...which is my way of asking about that pachyderm over there without actually naming it...

Separately, are there any plans to reintroduce Dwarven Parties?  I ask because stress balancing and addressing the difficulty of forming relationships seem to be on the table in the near future.  (I always liked that mechanic.  ;))
Generic "party" was replaced with drinking, singing, dancing, socializing, game playing (future), fistfighting and dying. It won't be coming back (and once the bugs in that list are fixed and it's all working properly it will seem pointless to even consider bringing it back).

Specific celebrations might be introduced later. But will most likely feature all of the above (plus parades and stuff from festivals for big occasions, presumably). I doubt we'll ever see dwarves just stand around "partying" again.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2018, 10:06:34 pm by Shonai_Dweller »
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feelotraveller

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #823 on: August 26, 2018, 10:40:36 pm »

Generic "party" was replaced with drinking, singing, dancing, socializing, game playing (future), fistfighting and dying. It won't be coming back (and once the bugs in that list are fixed and it's all working properly it will seem pointless to even consider bringing it back).

Specific celebrations might be introduced later. But will most likely feature all of the above (plus parades and stuff from festivals for big occasions, presumably). I doubt we'll ever see dwarves just stand around "partying" again.

I understand that there was a replacement, but it is quite different to having a large section of your fortress simultaneously deserting your orders and gathering together for a month or so en masse.  Guess dwarfs don't celebrate birthdays or weddings, etc. And it feels quite bereft from a story point of view - unexpected parties are a long and honoured tradition.  :P
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Shonai_Dweller

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Re: Future of the Fortress
« Reply #824 on: August 26, 2018, 10:56:09 pm »

Generic "party" was replaced with drinking, singing, dancing, socializing, game playing (future), fistfighting and dying. It won't be coming back (and once the bugs in that list are fixed and it's all working properly it will seem pointless to even consider bringing it back).

Specific celebrations might be introduced later. But will most likely feature all of the above (plus parades and stuff from festivals for big occasions, presumably). I doubt we'll ever see dwarves just stand around "partying" again.

I understand that there was a replacement, but it is quite different to having a large section of your fortress simultaneously deserting your orders and gathering together for a month or so en masse.  Guess dwarfs don't celebrate birthdays or weddings, etc. And it feels quite bereft from a story point of view - unexpected parties are a long and honoured tradition.  :P
I think specific celebrations are planned (somewhere in amongst the 65% of the game which hasn't been implemented yet) . And dwarves not taking breaks to gather and socialize together is part of the ongoing stress problems which need fixing.

Check out this thead for a summary of the various issues:
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=171185.0
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