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Author Topic: Researchable random generated weapons  (Read 1101 times)

FantasticDorf

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Researchable random generated weapons
« on: March 21, 2018, 06:00:23 pm »

Its really not as random as it may lead you believe in concept, the fundamentals being that randomly placed attributes from a set like forgotten beast features are applied onto new crafts that scholars in appropriate fields of metal & armor working can create innovations relevant to them.

> This may range from unlocking objects that are uncommon for a civilisation to have initially or explicitly mentioned to be 'locked' for dwarves, in dwarf play this may be some additional weapons like flails, pikes and long swords, without giving away too many weapon types, and they'll work through this list very slowly in world generation.

> Items that dwarves can research can also be new types of original weapons, and scholarly mechanics learn newly generated trap tools in this fashion too with variants of trap weapons.

Quote from: List of some researchable item attributes
  • Ranged Weapons
[Repeating] for ranged weapons like the crossbow - a upgraded crossbow type that fires faster but requires more resupply of the 25 bolts that currently are the maximum.
[Accurate] Passively increases the dwarf's focus and accuracy, training the crossbow skill on the archery range doesn't rely on hitting the target, only shooting, so doesn't particularly make dwarves more competent crossbow users than normal ones, hunters may end up actually killing their targets with heart, brain and lung shots.
[Powerful] tighter crossbow/bow binding methods make this weapon deliver more force with its shots, allowing bolts and arrows to penetrate & fly further.

  • [Melee Weapons]
[Dense] increases the impact, but also increases the passive weight of the weapon, useful on blunt ones, require more bars & recieve more in exchange. Makes edged weapon swing slower, but deliver both more force & devastating pummel shots.
[Large / Small] the size of a weapon may be overblown or shrunk down, allowing you to use some larger weapons as dwarves in exchanged for the effect of smaller contact area & less force and conversely have, smaller weapons scale bigger contact areas when made large.
[Serrated] edged weapons of this type are more likely to get lodged in opponents and cause deep wounds when into contact with skin, but have a poorer penetration quality.

  • [Armor]
[Tight Fitting] This armor is more lightweight but has less penetration protection, but is still materially dense, good for squads that need to move quickly to a target like sworddwarves without compromising on using leather or omitting armor pieces.
[[Shaped] Shields] in a particular generated shape, give additional or less coverage and vary in weight, cross shields like humans can have have more shield block coverage, while a small half crescent shield may be roughly equal to a buckler but have less coverage and weight than a normal shield.

  • [Other misc objects]
[Spacious] A variant for quivers, waterskins and backpacks, it allows them to carry double their normal supplies at a time in exchange for more materials to make

Just a collection of ideas, this also takes advantage of the small chance of encountering strange world generated weapons already in the game, which you could reason are unique designs that can't be researched by your dwarves culturally adopted by other civs, like specialist elven arrows, the previously mentioned cross shaped human shields and bizarre weapons.
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George_Chickens

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Re: Researchable random generated weapons
« Reply #1 on: March 21, 2018, 09:06:42 pm »

Procedurally generated tech trees would be pretty cool, but I get the impression Toady may have his own version of research planned.
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Encrtia

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Re: Researchable random generated weapons
« Reply #2 on: April 08, 2018, 05:03:15 am »

Sounds like an awesome concept, that only serves to compliment the game's style of procedural enjoyment. I like it  :D
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thompson

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Re: Researchable random generated weapons
« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2018, 09:39:26 pm »

I wouldn't mind seeing semi-procedurally generated metallurgy. Semi, because you could place some metals alloy better than others on average or produce different colours. Could also enhance properties through tempering and cold working.
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FantasticDorf

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Re: Researchable random generated weapons
« Reply #4 on: April 10, 2018, 02:58:35 am »

I wouldn't mind seeing semi-procedurally generated metallurgy. Semi, because you could place some metals alloy better than others on average or produce different colours. Could also enhance properties through tempering and cold working.

Different suggestion in the same kind of ballpark im afraid, besides the fact that taking a realism approach you'd need generated ore deposits (for fantasy metals like adamantine) to recieve new metals with whatever mixtures & properties available because outside of what you could achieve with modding with good source reference to just add more alloy reaction tags, existing metals can't be idly mixed together because they don't just react.

> Also is this correct for the period of DF, even if dwarves are typically more advanced than most other races in-game they are still constrained by manual era construction methods, even if they have theoretically thought it all out.

Turning lead into gold is also fantastical, unless somehow it just generates such a way to say that magic arc metal sphere sorcery allows you to bend the metallic elements to do this.
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thompson

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Re: Researchable random generated weapons
« Reply #5 on: April 12, 2018, 11:56:53 pm »

You could use real alloys, with real maximum theoretical properties, but due to incomplete metallurgical knowledge your research gives you a sub-optimal material. That maintains realism. I think this would complement your idea nicely.
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Anandar

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Re: Researchable random generated weapons
« Reply #6 on: April 13, 2018, 08:02:14 am »

One could research methods to increase sharpness of bladed weapons and trap components, eg an axe or making a pick just a bit better for mining faster... and another idea, researching centre of balance of a given weapon type eg a hammer or mace to allow greater force at impact point or with a sword to allow faster movement as the haft and blade ate centred well
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FantasticDorf

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Re: Researchable random generated weapons
« Reply #7 on: April 15, 2018, 08:34:29 am »

Those are nice to propose individually, but the original idea is centered on that being attributes, more effective cutting and picks would actually require changes to happen to the materials in the game so isn't really relevant to your alloy.  A flat change to have a [efficient] axe or pick modified type could improve mining/cutting speed for less required skill and be produced separately to normal axes & picks out of any available material.

  • The production of steel objects is not limited to the material, its limited to the availability to steel, you can still obtain & use metals out of prepared bars to produce weapons, for example if you made a adventurer drop off steel bars at a fortress site or raided a dwarf fortress as a non-fortress race, a copper/iron working race could make a exotic attribute weapon like a [sharp] halberd out of that steel bar
Copper picks materially is the same as steel for its digging action, but is more blunt for combat which is the only differentiating feature besides weight & heat resistance, any amount of new metals made via alloys, modded in or generated would only affect the underlined features, so the idea addresses the prefixes because masterful weapons & armor are already more effective than quality materials even one level lower like exceptional being worse. High level masterwork armor has additional deflection chances.

One could research methods to increase sharpness of bladed weapons and trap components, eg an axe or making a pick just a bit better for mining faster... and another idea, researching centre of balance of a given weapon type eg a hammer or mace to allow greater force at impact point or with a sword to allow faster movement as the haft and blade ate centred well

That's what it's aimed to do, (Θ☼sharp masterpiece steel sword☼Θ) etc.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2018, 08:40:48 am by FantasticDorf »
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thompson

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Re: Researchable random generated weapons
« Reply #8 on: April 19, 2018, 11:34:15 pm »

In light of recent activity in this sub-forum, I think there's something to be said for grouping related ideas in the same thread. It makes it easier for the community to contribute and work out possible synergies between ideas.
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