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Author Topic: Stress & Pysche: 44.11  (Read 3942 times)

Robsoie

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Re: Can anyone confirm or otherwise report on the stress fixes in 44.11?
« Reply #75 on: July 03, 2018, 05:14:32 pm »

I let them all in the room for a whole month, i avoided using a statue in a niche in order to avoid any possible distraction.
Checked then the descriptions after the month went off and it seems none did a conversation (either happy or unhappy), so it looks like dwarves are now so hyperactive with all their new needs that they have a hard time to actually focus on getting a conversation with another dwarf, even locked with throngs of them for a whole month.

The pets that can't be caged anymore with the dozens more that are in cage (due to being too attached to their dwarves) were also not helping as i noticed in the description a couple of dwarves interacting with their pets.

I'll have to make a try with experimenting getting rid of the pets first (easy with a bridge to atom smash them as they are the only creatures gathering in that meeting room if i don't force the dwarves through burrows) and adding the booze/wine stockpile in that room so i can lock all the dwarves for more than a single month without worrying about them being so thirsty they only try to path and fail to next barrels or well breaking then the possibility of them doing any other activity.

Oh joy of experimenting more, good i have backup saved :)
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PatrikLundell

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Re: Can anyone confirm or otherwise report on the stress fixes in 44.11?
« Reply #76 on: July 03, 2018, 05:25:13 pm »

I've had more success with getting socializing going in tavern zones than in no activity ones. Tavern zones are for maritial encouragement suites, while no zones are for baby making in my fortresses (assuming only two citizens are locked into the room, although dorfs aren't shy [in that sense], so baby making will probably happen in a crowded no activity room of couples as well).
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Robsoie

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Re: Can anyone confirm or otherwise report on the stress fixes in 44.11?
« Reply #77 on: July 03, 2018, 05:38:12 pm »

Looks like this socializing setup works

first i got rid of the pets that couldn't be caged due to close attachement to their owners, sorry to little buggers but that's ok i have a backup save ;)

made a room , set a food stockpile in it allowing only plant drink (in my fortress case it's only alcohol barrels)
lowered a lot the similar stockpile max barrels that is already in my tavern.

design a zone set to Meeting Area in that whole room, then pressed l and set that room as a location using the same name as my already existing tavern, making this room basically an annex to my actual tavern.

Setup the room (excepted of the 3 tiles that touch the door) as a burrow and setup a new alert so all the dwarves go only into this burrow.



once everyone was in, locked the door
Waited a bit and checked  :


Looks like it's working this way, could have used the actual tavern but there are too many items in it distracting things.

Hopefully the other tavern activities (story telling, dancing ...) are going to help instead of breaking the friend/grudge/love/hate gathering.

edit : and the far from family stress seems to get dealt with too.

Oh and looks like the AI is understanding what i am trying to do :
 "Don't bother trying to play on my emotions" :D

edit 2 : redid the experience but with another stockpile filled with only barrel of plump helmet so food and drink needs were met allowed to spend more time in the closed room, socializing was still happening, even got a few new friendships
« Last Edit: July 03, 2018, 06:09:30 pm by Robsoie »
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Shonai_Dweller

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Re: Can anyone confirm or otherwise report on the stress fixes in 44.11?
« Reply #78 on: July 03, 2018, 06:10:33 pm »

Stressed woodcutter with no labours enabled just followed my working woodcutter down to the caverns to watch him cut wood. Odd. I'd take the hint and give him some work to do, but he's already uneasy at discovering the cave-fish man genocide programme going on beneath his feet.
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FantasticDorf

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Re: Can anyone confirm or otherwise report on the stress fixes in 44.11?
« Reply #79 on: July 03, 2018, 06:40:36 pm »

Looks like this socializing setup works

first i got rid of the pets that couldn't be caged due to close attachement to their owners, sorry to little buggers but that's ok i have a backup save ;)

You can assign pets to meeting zones combined with pastures to make them stay still & stick there so that when the dwarves come by they can say hello to their pets when they come out, but im pleased to see it worked out for you, even if the whole thing is a little bit forced upon the dwarves to fit them into a compact space probably atleast once a year between doing other things for a big community get together.
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mikekchar

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Re: Can anyone confirm or otherwise report on the stress fixes in 44.11?
« Reply #80 on: July 03, 2018, 06:50:49 pm »

That's literally how make all my taverns -- narrow strips.  The key is to force dwarfs to stand next to each other.  I haven't experimented on this since Toady claims to have fixed it, though.  Previously, it appeared that as more dwarfs entered the fortress, friendships became more rare.  So if the starting 7 were not initially friends (it happens sometimes), then within a year they are all friends, or have grudges or whatever.  If I take 7 migrants from the first couple of waves and burrow them, one or two of them will become friends.  If I take the next 7 migrants and burrow them, then none of them will become friends.

Like I said, I haven't tested it since, but given what people are saying (and given that Toady seems to indicate that he has only tested on the starting 7), I bet that it is still broken in exactly the same way.
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tussock

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Re: Can anyone confirm or otherwise report on the stress fixes in 44.11?
« Reply #81 on: July 04, 2018, 07:45:46 am »

So I tried the meeting area activity zone that's part of an inn, uh.

I didn't have to put anyone in it. One soldier walk up, entered socialise mode, and suddenly everyone in the pub is in socialise mode.

And yes, everyone need that, purple Socialise! popping up all over for people to join in. Easy as that, need a meeting area as part of a pub somewhere. Mine is upstairs, nothing in it at all, other than the stairs back down.
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FantasticDorf

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Re: Can anyone confirm or otherwise report on the stress fixes in 44.11?
« Reply #82 on: July 05, 2018, 09:30:25 am »

    Small Inn works to get dwarves aquainted but they are still socially awkward with the occasional story interspersed. (excuse the mess) for optimal usage, like use in temples too to dissuade the use of instruments and dancing they should be 4x5 or vice versa on all angles with no furniture or any suitable adaption of this like shown.


I've found one genuine crutch to the socialisation process, and another hypothetical one i've jumped upon in a issue report.

Quote
  • Dwarves with the 'Feels uncomfortable around others different to themselves' have more negative reactions to opposing or different beliefs & require more likeminded dwarves (in such a hot pot of dwarves though cliques emerge), and this is just set by dwarven culture, which the desires of the players for dwarves to be social contradicts partially, as does alcohol
  • Secondly #0010812 leans towards the possibility that in a connection to the over-fixation on furniture and activities distracting from talking, we've talked about, that emotional priorities sideline the multiple possible emotions to choose 1 relevant one as the state.

Quote
> In other interesting need fufillment news, dwarves in a squad and off schedule (clear order for a season or a few months) will run individual drills & training in their squads room in order to fufill their own needs for learning, fighting & martial prowess which makes them feel more well-rounded without depriving them of fortress activities like visiting the inn and praying.

Edit- whoops, sorry i didn't read your previous comments Robsoie on the topic, yeah the passive training/rest is nice isnt it?
[/list]
« Last Edit: July 05, 2018, 11:05:47 am by FantasticDorf »
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Immortal-D

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Re: Can anyone confirm or otherwise report on the stress fixes in 44.11?
« Reply #83 on: July 05, 2018, 10:13:35 am »

Lots of good !SCIENCE! here :)  The insight about various interests overwhelming any conversations is fascinating.  I might have to ugly-down my Tavern & Meeting Hall a bit, see how that turns out.

Rowanas

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Re: Can anyone confirm or otherwise report on the stress fixes in 44.11?
« Reply #84 on: July 05, 2018, 10:52:46 am »

This is why we can't have nice things!
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I agree with Urist. Steampunk is like Darth Vader winning Holland's Next Top Model. It would be awesome but not something I'd like in this game.
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Dragonborn

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Re: Can anyone confirm or otherwise report on the stress fixes in 44.11?
« Reply #85 on: July 06, 2018, 08:24:23 am »

So if furniture impacts socialization, how should we setup places for dwarves to eat?  Should we have one narrow, furniture-less room for socializing and a separate dining hall for eating?
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tussock

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Re: Can anyone confirm or otherwise report on the stress fixes in 44.11?
« Reply #86 on: July 06, 2018, 08:52:40 am »

The small undressed rooms give them a bad thought for not having a chair to eat at, may not be worth it in troubled times, perhaps better in short bursts with booze and mugs present and time off for work and eating at proper legendary dining rooms.

You can't really lose that strong good thought just to chase another good thought, the aim is to get more of them.

--

Legendary weapon skill seems to be a massive menace for needs, my surviving old soldiers are all unfocused, which can't help their soldiering, nor taking out the odd berserk miner. Why are there still bronze picks in my fort? Copper, and no quality! Gah, poor swordsmaster, hope he can crutch walk ....

Turning off their squad training areas, stationing them to kick them out of individual training mode (which they will do until they need to drink or sleep usually, and I have them with food and water, so until sleep :D ), they will eventually drop stuff and go socialise, but they still can't work or bring water or anything so there's a lot of needs they can't have met and average focus at best with a bit of micromanagement involved at that.

Come to think of it, carrying food is pretty great for training them up, with all the right stockpiled stuff in the barracks so they arm up quick and just train all day, but once they're good enough, got to turn it off so they get those dining room thoughts again. Drinking from a flask seems as good as drinking from a mug, no negative thought there, so carrying booze is fine.
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FantasticDorf

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Re: Can anyone confirm or otherwise report on the stress fixes in 44.11?
« Reply #87 on: July 06, 2018, 09:13:05 am »

Use meeting halls with conjoined chairs like this i suppose? My dwarves leave the tavern 'hole' (actually with some overspill dwarves dont visit the zone if there's absolutely NO floorspace to socialise) to go eat and run jobs in the adjacent meeting hall table canteen to the left.


Quote
Image attached: My meeting hall for eating prepared meals stored in the 'community hall' in the previous screenshot is just across the hall, everything is centered on the same layer with some deluxe 3x3 size abodes and some 1x3's homes out of shot.

So far everythings going ok for my fortress, and im building a public tavern aboveground with strict 10x10 dance arena to see if i can get some needs filled (it might destroy the population of the community hall though) & deal with overflow. My 100 dwarf population manages with shrines and if its a success ill transfer the above ground tavern template into religious festival pits.

Since the aboveground tavern is not going to be used for socialisation (least not implicatively) and mainly to hire/use poets & performer, then using furniture there (especially roads to mark out the boundaries of where the 'dance pit' starts') isn't a issue.

> Long and short of the issue, once you get a critical mass of dwarves the single dressed down space needs to be expanded, else you build more holes or move into a larger space with dwarf bodies to fill the void. Lots of player issues pertain to very stressful compact conditions with few dwarves vaguely socialising perhaps.
« Last Edit: July 06, 2018, 09:15:19 am by FantasticDorf »
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Saiko Kila

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Re: Can anyone confirm or otherwise report on the stress fixes in 44.11?
« Reply #88 on: July 07, 2018, 03:19:17 am »

I just wanted to say, that free time with standard tavern setup is enough. But free time is something that most dwarves lack. For this reason only my monster slayers(*) have tons of friends (some even ~30), because they are effectively on one lifelong vacation.

*)and starting seven, but they all started as friends.
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Showbiz

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Re: Can anyone confirm or otherwise report on the stress fixes in 44.11?
« Reply #89 on: July 07, 2018, 05:13:05 am »

:
That one had an unfortunate accident, but her widower does nothing but sit around crying all day now. So that didn't really help. The other one is the baron consort, so, yeah. Maybe I have to figure out an underground fishery after all.
Or convert the above ground fishing spots to dwarf friendly environments with access tunnels and roofs.
slightly offtopic:
how about safety against raids? Is it somehow possible to fish indoors i.e. let fish through but no goblins or elves?
« Last Edit: July 07, 2018, 05:22:46 am by Showbiz »
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Pardon for my mistakes
english isn't my native language
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