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Author Topic: Dwarves refuse to use containers?  (Read 1408 times)

paladin225

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Dwarves refuse to use containers?
« on: July 18, 2018, 08:43:07 pm »

I posted about this before recently and at this point I feel like maybe I should post in the bug report forum about this?

I'm playing DF Version 44.12

I know in older versions of DF, the dwarves made use of containers much more easily and without any special attention needed so it really feels like something is broken here or not functioning as well as it did in older versions at least.

I first encountered these container issues on a different embark recently, right at the start of the embark, the dwarves insisted on storing one item per tile in every stockpile instead of using containers which I had (I always make bins early on and bring barrels with me) to store things more efficiently. It took over a year (because of this storage inefficiency) to finish unloading my wagon on that embark and then for some reason the dwarves finally started using containers after I turned the accepting of bins/barrels off and on, on stockpiles a few times. At that time I figured it was my fault for not turning on the taking of containers at stockpiles or something and moved on.

I have since started a new fort/embark and I am running into the same issues again with containers, however, this time, making sure that stockpiles accept containers does not seem to be fixing the issue.  I have several bins that literally are just left to sit at the carpenter's workshop and are ignored by the dwarves. The carpenter shop is set to give out to any stockpile etc.  the dwarves simply refuse to take the containers and store them in stockpiles and make use of them. I've tried setting stockpiles to only take from the carpenter shop with the bins etc. and nothing happens. 

I even got creative and made a one tile dump zone on the stockpile I wanted a bin to go to and dumped a bin there, then claimed the bin and removed the dump zone. Still, the dwarves refuse to use the bins even if they are sitting on the stockpile. I have idler dwarves that could be storing the bins/putting items in the bins with the appropriate labors turned on and it just doesn't happen. Even with empty non-forbidden bins sitting on the stockpiles now they still store one leather, one cloth, one ring, one bracelet etc. per stockpile tile and ignore the empty bins sitting right there.

Anyone have any suggestions? Could DF Hack be used to fix this somehow? Is there anything else I should try or should I just post this in the bug forum?  If I'm still somehow doing something wrong and this is still somehow my fault, I really have no idea what it could be at this point.

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anewaname

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Re: Dwarves refuse to use containers?
« Reply #1 on: July 18, 2018, 09:15:25 pm »

I've been having no issue with either barrels or bins. There is probably something in the basics of the global or speicifc stockpile settings that needs to be changed.

Check this list:
- From the main menu, 'p'ile to check your global stockpile settings to ensure that Reserved Bins is 0 and Reserved Barrels is about 4 (you would use '/', '*', '-', or '+' to adjust these, I usually reserve 0 bins and 6 barrels).
- From the main menu, 'q'uery the specific stockpile and ensure it accepts bins/barrels (you would use 'R' or 'V' to maximize the number allowed).
- Make sure the items are ones that can be placed inside bins/barrels.

If those settings are made, and the barrel/bin is not forbidden/unpathable/filled-with-other-stuff, a job will be generated to Put Item In Stockpile, where 'j'ob Details will show the bin or barrel is being moved. This job does not care about stockpile links or where the barrel/bin is, it just assigns the container and eventually it will be hauled over (the job is low priority so if your dwarfs are very busy, it may take a while).
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paladin225

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Re: Dwarves refuse to use containers?
« Reply #2 on: July 18, 2018, 11:57:39 pm »

- From the main menu, 'p'ile to check your global stockpile settings to ensure that Reserved Bins is 0 and Reserved Barrels is about 4 (you would use '/', '*', '-', or '+' to adjust these, I usually reserve 0 bins and 6 barrels)

Thanks for the reply.

What does the reserved bins/barrels setting on the global stockpile settings do exactly?  That was the only thing in your suggestions that I hadn't checked already. My reserved bins had been set to 21 and reserved barrels to 100, though I never touched this myself. Is this influenced by how many stockpiles you make?

Everything else you suggested should already be fine, my stockpiles are pathable, the stockpiles are each set to accept the max number of bins/barrels according to the stockpile size. The items I want to store can be placed in bins (cloth, leather, trade goods/stone crafts etc.) as far as I know and neither the bins or the items I want to store in them are forbidden. The bins are definitely very empty too. The bins themselves are definitely pathable as I've got dwarves to move some of them to dump zones (and reclaimed them). There are plenty of idle dwarves with all hauling enabled.
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mikekchar

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Re: Dwarves refuse to use containers?
« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2018, 01:01:44 am »

What does the reserved bins/barrels setting on the global stockpile settings do exactly?

It reserves that many bins/barrels in the stockpile before it allows any to be used.

Quote
My reserved bins had been set to 21 and reserved barrels to 100, though I never touched this myself.

I think you can guess why it isn't working at the moment  ;)  I have no idea how you got that set up like that.
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Miles_Umbrae

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Re: Dwarves refuse to use containers?
« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2018, 03:46:48 am »

Is it just happening during the first year?
Or is it a persistent issue you see in older forts as well?
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anewaname

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Re: Dwarves refuse to use containers?
« Reply #5 on: July 19, 2018, 08:10:31 am »

...What does the reserved bins/barrels setting on the global stockpile settings do exactly?...
The Reserved settings keep that number of containers from being assigned to stockpiles for storage. For barrels, this means some are always available for booze and workshop construction, and for bins it currently means nothing because bins are currently not used for anything else. Reserved settings like bins=0 and barrels=4 work well.
...My reserved bins had been set to 21 and reserved barrels to 100, though I never touched this myself...
Hehe... You know when you hit a series of keys and realize you are not seeing the expected output? You could have done this a few times and the numbers slowly accumulated up to 21 and 100. If that happened, it is just a matter of recognizing when you are doing it.
Is this influenced by how many stockpiles you make?
The global settings for Reserved are not effected by the number of stockpiles you have. Just lower the settings and they will start to work on filling the containers.
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paladin225

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Re: Dwarves refuse to use containers?
« Reply #6 on: July 19, 2018, 05:03:53 pm »

...My reserved bins had been set to 21 and reserved barrels to 100, though I never touched this myself...
Hehe... You know when you hit a series of keys and realize you are not seeing the expected output? You could have done this a few times and the numbers slowly accumulated up to 21 and 100. If that happened, it is just a matter of recognizing when you are doing it.

Well I set the bins to zero and barrels to 5.  I was in the middle of a trade depot rush the last time I played so most dwarves were busy with that, (especially considering how all my crafts were not in bins and had to be taken to the depot one at a time...) but I did soon see a weapon bin happen with all my weapons stored in it and some other tasks seem to be in the works for a few other bins at the carpenter shop now so I'm assuming and hoping this has finally fixed the issue.

I would be the first to admit that I sometimes hit keys by mistake, I haven't played DF in a long time so I'm having to relearn all the keys.  But even then, I find it hard to believe that I somehow hit these particular keys by mistake while I had the stockpile menu opened. On my default keybinds, I only need to use letter keys to make stockpiles and the keys to control the reserved bins/barrels settings were keys like "+-" and "*/" etc. (no where near the letter keys) and while +- is used for scrolling some lists, I'm pretty sure I've never used /* for anything at all, especially while in that stockpile menu and to get those numbers up to 21 and 100 I would need to be holding one key (two keys simultaneously to raise barrels) for quite a while on the stockpile menu.  So I'm still thinking something else might've automatically changed those settings somehow. I might make a new world and embark sometime just to test that and see if those global stockpile settings are altered from zero at all at the start of a new fort.

Its definitely something of a mystery, but yeah, for now I just hope this takes care of my container issues.  To answer Miles_Umbrae, I don't really have any old DF saves so I can't test this in an old fort. So far I've only encountered this container issue in two new forts in different worlds in 44.12.

Thanks for the help everyone!

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