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What Time Is It?

Space-Time
- 2 (14.3%)
Hammer Time
- 3 (21.4%)
Time...to die.
- 6 (42.9%)
Peanut Butter Jelly Time
- 3 (21.4%)

Total Members Voted: 14


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Author Topic: Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1917 A.C. Cold Season (COMPLETE)  (Read 93772 times)

Madman198237

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Re: Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1915 A.C. Hot Season (Design Phase)
« Reply #1005 on: January 22, 2019, 09:26:21 pm »

Using a revision to fortify one front is part of the best possible plan here---we leave one front at level 1 entrenchment (the other one will be...level 2 at the end of this turn) and then surprise them with a level-four entrenchment in the ostensibly-less-defended front.

And we don't need to get into melee faster if you'll recall, because we'll be fighting in a city until we deploy the Salamander anyway. Thus the increased mobility for our already-armored troops is going to be minimal.

They have a dedicated 40mm AT gun already, not sure how effective it might be against the Salamander's thick armor. It won't be hard for them to deploy more and better, most likely. Perahudara doesn't have to be "optimal" for a combat landing if it works when we've artillery'd and strafed the landing zone until it's barren.
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Taricus

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Re: Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1915 A.C. Hot Season (Design Phase)
« Reply #1006 on: January 22, 2019, 09:37:49 pm »

If we're fighting in the city, the extra mobility is going to be negligible in effect then. And if the Perahudara is landing in a safe zone... Well, thing is, that's a safe zone, not a combat zone. It's fine as a transport but it isn't a good assault transport AKA driving up into the enemy's face and then unloading.

And yeah, the existing 40mm gun is an AT weapon, but so far that will be ineffective against the Charybdis purely because that's what it was armoured against.
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Madman198237

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Re: Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1915 A.C. Hot Season (Design Phase)
« Reply #1007 on: January 22, 2019, 09:44:23 pm »

I brought up the 40mm as concerning the Salamander. We ARE fighting in a city, exclusively so in case you've forgotten. And the safe zone I'm proposing is safe because we've made it safe before bothering to send in troops.

But I don't argue for JUST having the Perahudara, I'm just arguing that we should do the Salamander next turn. A simple enough Salamander redesign will have a very, very low chance of failing, and thus be a good candidate in our "surprise" turn. So if we're going to upgrade our armor to be more capable in the sorts of combat we're seeing now, well, this is the turn to do it. It'd also help us get closer to taking Harren...and we'd have them on the verge of losing Harren right when we get ready for the amphibious turn. That'll put them in a bind: Do a design to help their soldiers cross the water better, or try to design something to help in the close confines of Harren?
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Taricus

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Re: Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1915 A.C. Hot Season (Design Phase)
« Reply #1008 on: January 22, 2019, 09:52:17 pm »

If we spring the salamander now, odds are if the enemy is trying to also do an amphibious invasion yet is waiting until next turn to do it. And again, the armour support in Harren would still be invaluable. Especially since our most mobile form of support on the ground is an armoured sled.

But the Impulse doesn't solve any problems we have currently in melee, and we'd need better power armour weapons for it to really shine. All in all, it's a few designs ahead of what we need for our power armour, and should avoid it until those basics are covered first.
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Madman198237

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Re: Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1915 A.C. Hot Season (Design Phase)
« Reply #1009 on: January 22, 2019, 09:55:38 pm »

OK so we're BOTH getting the option to start amphibious invasions the turn AFTER this one. We don't WANT to spring the Salamander now because it's wasting a bit of surprise factor.

If we want better armor in Harren we upgrade the power armor suits, because those are the most maneuverable form of armor we have. The Impulse improves the maneuverability of our soldiers which is NEVER a bad thing, and breaks the melee tie. The general intent is to immediately follow it with a Gravity Hammer based on the mini-Gravity Engines it will provide us with, thus giving us maneuverable and deadly armored lifting suits.

It's not a few designs ahead of anything, and we have the basics covered, at least for urban combat.

And again, let's push the enemy back, force them to choose between Harren and an amphibious landing.
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Taricus

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Re: Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1915 A.C. Hot Season (Design Phase)
« Reply #1010 on: January 22, 2019, 10:12:04 pm »

The impulse, by itself, won't break the melee tie. The only things that will would be outright melee weapons. Moreover we do have a general power armour tie which we need to break, the breaking of which would have far greater effects. And mobility isn't going to do that, as again, we do need specialised power armour weapons for that tie to be broken.
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Madman198237

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Re: Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1915 A.C. Hot Season (Design Phase)
« Reply #1011 on: January 22, 2019, 10:17:49 pm »

Ooook?
The basics of this entire genre is that if you improve your equipment, you get better combat results. If our power armor is more maneuverable, we get advantages the enemy doesn't have, and thus we win the power armor tie.

Then we follow it with a Gravity Hammer and suddenly we're capable of rushing straight from cover into a melee duel the enemy is not equipped to win, and won't be equipped to win as they don't have the sorts of techs that will allow us to relatively easily make a Gravity Hammer.

So then we get a maneuverability boost that will get us into melee combat, AND a power armor weapon. Both of your objections [Salamander would somehow deliver our power armor guys into melee combat/combat faster, and that we need designated power armor weapons]
« Last Edit: January 22, 2019, 10:19:33 pm by Madman198237 »
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Powder Miner

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Re: Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1915 A.C. Hot Season (Design Phase)
« Reply #1012 on: January 22, 2019, 10:43:09 pm »

I find myself ultimately agreeing with Madman here -- if we build the Salamander next turn, we still get the mechanical reward, so I don't see much of a reason to build the Salamander this turn rather than the next, even if I'm skeptical there will be much surprise factor.

Quote from: fodebocks
AAV-15 'Salamander' Armoured Vehicle: (0)
AAV-15 'Apibaru': (3) NUKE9.13, Taricus, DGR
ALS-15M "Impact" Avalanche Booster System: (3) Madman, Rockeater, Powder Miner
« Last Edit: January 22, 2019, 10:56:00 pm by Powder Miner »
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Taricus

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Re: Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1915 A.C. Hot Season (Design Phase)
« Reply #1013 on: January 22, 2019, 10:53:33 pm »

The gravity hammer is immaterial to them winning in melee, that's what our myomer does in the first place. The moment we have any melee weapons the armour can use, we win hands down and they can't beat that.

And again, the Impulse... we can't win in melee with it. Sure, we can charge them, but the moment we're stuck in we're buggered. We need to be infantry in melee, not cavalry.
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Madman198237

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Re: Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1915 A.C. Hot Season (Design Phase)
« Reply #1014 on: January 22, 2019, 11:14:13 pm »

So it gets us to melee and we use a hammer in the melee. If we don't get the hammer (design fails and must be revised, etc.) then I guess we ONLY have guys capable of crossing exposed pieces of ground without getting shot (with aimed shots, anyway), smashing into enemies hard enough to disable anything not in power armor and presumably knock over/disorient people IN powered armor, etc.

I'm framing it as useful to melee combat because it'll be really hilarious to do a boosted charge with the hammer, but it's not NECESSARY to have both to have great effect in combat.

Also, it allows us to instantly DISENGAGE from melee combat if that proves necessary. The enemy can't punch you as you run away with this system, and so on.
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We shall make the highest quality of quality quantities of soldiers with quantities of quality.

Taricus

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Re: Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1915 A.C. Hot Season (Design Phase)
« Reply #1015 on: January 23, 2019, 12:03:49 am »

PAR-15 'Holepunch': Developed as a response to the lack of dedicated power armour weaponry for our Avalanches to use, the PAR-15 intends to rectify the issue. A massive 15 x 110mm calibre semi-automatic rifle, utilising gavpowder loads to achieve an excellent level of ballistics (Especially when combined with FMJ/G rounds) to penetrate the Abberan powered armour effectively, and using pieces of depleted gavrilium to keep the carbine-length barrel cool. Feeding from a detachable, 20 round magazine, and solidly build to withstand both the user and the stresses of firing such a high-powered round, the PAR-15 is designed to be a long-lasting standard weapon for our proud troops wearing the Avalanche Armour.
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NUKE9.13

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Re: Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1915 A.C. Hot Season (Design Phase)
« Reply #1016 on: January 23, 2019, 02:44:59 am »

Thought about it more, decided to support the Impact.
Quote from: fodebocks
AAV-15 'Salamander' Armoured Vehicle: (0)
AAV-15 'Apibaru': (2) Taricus, DGR
ALS-15M "Impact" Avalanche Booster System: (4) Madman, Rockeater, Powder Miner, NUKE9.13
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Man of Paper

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Re: Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1915 A.C. Hot Season (Design Phase)
« Reply #1017 on: January 26, 2019, 11:16:34 pm »

Votes Locked.

 I should update before Draig does.
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Taricus

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Re: Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1915 A.C. Hot Season (Design Phase)
« Reply #1018 on: January 26, 2019, 11:44:57 pm »

You've got weeks in that case then :P
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Man of Paper

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Re: Industrialized Warfare: Salvios Thread / 1915 A.C. Hot Season (Revisi Phase)
« Reply #1019 on: January 28, 2019, 02:32:50 am »

Year 1914 AC (After Colonization) Hot Season, Design Phase


Proposal: ALS-15M "Impact" Avalanche Booster System
"Impact" Avalanche Booster System
The Avalanche is a very fine piece of technology, but it can be better. The Impact system aims to improve the Avalanches by adding very small Gravity Engines around its center of mass. These, combined with a small bank of capacitors sufficient for a single use before a recharge, allow the user to give themselves a hard push or boost, capable of throwing them and their entire armored lifting suit a few meters in the desired direction---up [for anything from cushioning falls to Myomer-and-gravity-enhanced jumps], forwards or backwards, left or right.

These Mini-Gravity Engines (MGEs) are constructed to be very durable as well as being powerful in short bursts, since they'll be getting thrown around in a suit of armor and smashed into things (like enemy armored bodies in sudden charges).

The capacitors themselves are charged directly by the Avalanche's engine system, and protected by being nestled under the armor.


Difficulty: Hard
Result: 5 (4+2-1) = Below Average


Mobility is becoming increasingly important in our current situation, and in order to grant our Avalanches the ability to rapidly move and engage we have created the Impact. The Impact is actually a series of six Miniature GravEngines embedded in the armor at the left and right sides, the front and back of the torso, and behind the collar. The gravite cores are aligned to propel the Avalanche left, right, forward, back, and up, but can only be activated one at a time to prevent a left/right or forward/back trigger tearing the suit apart. A new forearm piece with a panel adorned in a button for each M.G.E., though there is no cover so rare accidental activation can occur.

While ingenious, there are a few drawbacks to the system itself. As the cores of the M.G.E.s are in a fixed position being able to properly align oneself for accurate motion is difficult. Before activation the wearer must also hop off the ground or risk their dragging feet throwing them off and angling them in the wrong direction (namely, face-first into the ground). The M.G.E.s can propel an Avalanche at 16 meters/second, but only very briefly as the system ravenously draws power from the capacitors allowing only two or three seconds of usage before requiring up to a half hour to fully recharge.

While the myomer strengthening the legs absorbs the majority of landing impacts, headlong charges and side-on collisions at those speeds have a tendency to injure the meat popsicle soldier within the armor as they get jostled around, with more severe injuries occurring with sudden stops (like with the previously mentioned ground). Also of note, the increased energy moving through and stored within the suit has increased discomfort, and often after engagements users need some extended rest.

Introduction of the Impact has led to the creation of the Avalanche-B, a variant of the original design made to utilize the Impact.

The Impact system itself costs 3 Caelium and 1 Ore (CHEAP), and the additional resources it uses reflected in the cost of the Avalanche-B, making it cost us 6 Ore, 2 Gavrillium, 6 Caelium, and 2 Myomer (VERY EXPENSIVE). It has also added MiniGrav Engines as a Component for further usage with costs changing on a case-by-case basis. Future designs can also be made to utilize the Impact.


----------------


As progress moves ever forward you are now tasked with coming up with your Revision. Also, remember it is up to you to decide if our artillery comes into play in the Fortress-City by the end of the Strategy Phase. Good luck, and [I WOULD SAY GOD-SPEED BUT I LEFT IT TO YOU TO FURTHER DEFINE SALVIOS PAST MY FOUNDATIONS]. You can also choose to rename the Avalanche-B if you desire to.


IT IS NOW THE REVISION PHASE.




Spoiler: Designs (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Territories (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Resources (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Special Rules (click to show/hide)
Spoiler: Credits+Blueprints (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: Abberan Armory (click to show/hide)
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