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Small Nose Fan

Big Nose Enjoyer

[Fleeting Frames]

Yeah, without updates there's just cheeky tricks.

If you're interested in green designations cheeky trick: BROWN is also used for speardwarves/farmers/food stores, various soils¦, red+green contaminant mixing, unselected items in loo'k', idlers, inside indicator, height bar. CYAN is also used for fps indicator, clothier NW¦, height bar, peasant/swordsdwarf colour, clear glass¦. And of course, light cyan and light yellow sometimes get degraded into the two, like when making minecart out of fungiwood or adamantine¦?.

¦ patchable in raws or via twbt/dfhack script*.

* In the sense of runtime material swap or utilizing more than 16 colours - well, technically everything in map view is patchable via script if you're willing to just display another tile on top of detected wrong tile, but that has numerous issues and difficulties which is why we leave that sort of thing to twbt.

There's also the option of going the route of how some tilesets don't attempt to make visible engravings look good, and just patch ~/≈ tiles, then ensure they're not displayed by sand/furrowed soil/creatures/magnetite&other stones/bridges/globs/farm plots, and accept the reminder as casualty - which would include snow, incidentally.

[Meph]

What other things are you trying to add? Maybe I know a few tricks that might help.

[vettlingr]

Yeah, without updates there's just cheeky tricks.

If you're interested in green designations cheeky trick: BROWN is also used for speardwarves/farmers/food stores, various soils¦, red+green contaminant mixing, unselected items in loo'k', idlers, inside indicator, height bar. CYAN is also used for fps indicator, clothier NW¦, height bar, peasant/swordsdwarf colour, clear glass¦. And of course, light cyan and light yellow sometimes get degraded into the two, like when making minecart out of fungiwood or adamantine¦?.

¦ patchable in raws or via twbt/dfhack script*.

* In the sense of runtime material swap or utilizing more than 16 colours - well, technically everything in map view is patchable via script if you're willing to just display another tile on top of detected wrong tile, but that has numerous issues and difficulties which is why we leave that sort of thing to twbt.

There's also the option of going the route of how some tilesets don't attempt to make visible engravings look good, and just patch ~/≈ tiles, then ensure they're not displayed by sand/furrowed soil/creatures/magnetite&other stones/bridges/globs/farm plots, and accept the reminder as casualty - which would include snow, incidentally.

about the yellow/cyan, I usually fix this by setting colour form 3:6:1 to 11:3:0 or 3:6:0 to 3:14:0 which has been in the game for a long time, but I think we are talking about a nother bug.

If I can avoid green designations, which do sound good because green=go ahead. I will do it.The thing is that you possess a good fix for showing water in TWBT, but I will be waiting for it to be included in the LNP none the less. Because I don't really trust bros and gals to be able to do the maual download without my guidiance anymore.

I tried a lot with plants. Usually you have Structural:Plant:x but I had to settle with :::RYE or :::Barley to make it work while grasses have the whole :::Structural:Plant:x it works, but im not sure how stable it is.
What other things are you trying to add? Maybe I know a few tricks that might help.

[Fleeting Frames]

Hah, I didn't mean simultaneously yellow and cyan, but yeah that bugs been there for a long time. Using expanded colors from twbt my minecarts properly keep their assigned colour though, so I think that's an option.

Here's one example of green designations. Not bad for normal digs, but I find having marked designations darker/lighter shade gets confusing normally.

As for the TWBT fixes being included in the LNP...Hah, I fear you're going to keep waiting forever. I don't make pull request for these things on github; as I shouldn't for I write for 43.03; nor has my previous upload of it gotten, like, any interest at all. And to be fair, 43.03 doesn't have some stuff like creature transparency as that became possible when Toady exposed certain variables.

Though this conversation did motivate me to put prioritization script aside for tweaking twbt further for its/my own sake. Overrides for hauled items yesterday, maybe applying vermin creature graphics today (though, heh, that would in fact be easier without twbt).

[Pvt. Pirate]

i never set engravings to unobscured, because they only confuse the shit out of me as they always depict the first creature or object mentioned in the described picture and it is not visible that it is an engraving, so i wonder why there are goblins in my great hall, until i realize, its the engraved floor.

[vettlingr]

Hah, I didn't mean simultaneously yellow and cyan, but yeah that bugs been there for a long time. Using expanded colors from twbt my minecarts properly keep their assigned colour though, so I think that's an option.

Here's one example of green designations. Not bad for normal digs, but I find having marked designations darker/lighter shade gets confusing normally.

As for the TWBT fixes being included in the LNP...Hah, I fear you're going to keep waiting forever. I don't make pull request for these things on github; as I shouldn't for I write for 43.03; nor has my previous upload of it gotten, like, any interest at all. And to be fair, 43.03 doesn't have some stuff like creature transparency as that became possible when Toady exposed certain variables.

Though this conversation did motivate me to put prioritization script aside for tweaking twbt further for its/my own sake. Overrides for hauled items yesterday, maybe applying vermin creature graphics today (though, heh, that would in fact be easier without twbt).

All I hear of criticisms is usually regarding the limitations of TWBT such as hauled items, Bridge textures reverting back when stood upon and vermin not showing up as anything else than small dots. THe problem being I guess is that TWBT only regards I, B and T, and no units.

i never set engravings to unobscured, because they only confuse the shit out of me as they always depict the first creature or object mentioned in the described picture and it is not visible that it is an engraving, so i wonder why there are goblins in my great hall, until i realize, its the engraved floor.

I did play around with overrides for engravings toggled on, but it would involve writing double the amount of TWBT overrides that I already have written. Also the possible bugs would make it not worth it.

[Fleeting Frames]

Bridge textures not showing up is also visible in that snip I posted; it looks at items, then at buildings, then all tiletypes, then applies first override it finds for a given tile and skips the rest. It then still displays terrain overrides underneath because it then redoes the map check again, word-for-word, in another function below it in same file...which, whoops, doesn't have my water/hidden fixes - well, that explains why numbers showed up when items and water shared a tile^^;;


Worth mentioning since I don't think it's explained anywhere: consequently even items by themselves have a bug, in that if there are overrides for a tile, it looks at all matching item groups, oldest items and overriddes first, until it finds an item on that position. Vanilla DF displays piles of items in "youngest first" order, and the pile of items can have not-overridden item on top besides.

Minor ex: This means a full set of clothes will always have same item showed on top, no matter production order.
Major ex: If a tool shares a raw tilenumber with another item (ex, quire and metal bars), and you have a tool (say, wheelbarrow) on a tile with younger metal bars, then it will display the override for quire.


As for vermin, that's really vanilla bug, though luckily the tile they should have is still loaded in game memory. Pissed of Nopal badly (though the record of that is gone as he or Toady erased his account).

I did play around with overrides for engravings toggled on, but it would involve writing double the amount of TWBT overrides that I already have written. Also the possible bugs would make it not worth it.

That's why I did sentient corpse overrides (which also needs altered twbt), tbh - lot of engravings are about creatures, and mostly-transparent text image looks acceptable on ground (though getting actual creature tile from raws would be possible), but horrible on walls, and walls can have so many shapes.

[Pvt. Pirate]

i never set engravings to unobscured, because they only confuse the shit out of me as they always depict the first creature or object mentioned in the described picture and it is not visible that it is an engraving, so i wonder why there are goblins in my great hall, until i realize, its the engraved floor.

I did play around with overrides for engravings toggled on, but it would involve writing double the amount of TWBT overrides that I already have written. Also the possible bugs would make it not worth it.

i know the amount of work involved there and just leave them obscured.

[vettlingr]

Long overdue, but I can finally announce that I have made sprites for all domestic animals. Just a 1000 more animals to do now. I also decided to add a thicker black outline to help with the visuals. I like the results, more screenshots of that later. I just need to fire up some new forts to test it.

i never set engravings to unobscured, because they only confuse the shit out of me as they always depict the first creature or object mentioned in the described picture and it is not visible that it is an engraving, so i wonder why there are goblins in my great hall, until i realize, its the engraved floor.

I did play around with overrides for engravings toggled on, but it would involve writing double the amount of TWBT overrides that I already have written. Also the possible bugs would make it not worth it.

i know the amount of work involved there and just leave them obscured.

As I said before, me and meph fancied the idea to add support, while it works, it can only be applied to walls, lest creatures walking on engraved floors get overridden too.

Bridge textures not showing up is also visible in that snip I posted; it looks at items, then at buildings, then all tiletypes, then applies first override it finds for a given tile and skips the rest. It then still displays terrain overrides underneath because it then redoes the map check again, word-for-word, in another function below it in same file...which, whoops, doesn't have my water/hidden fixes - well, that explains why numbers showed up when items and water shared a tile^^;;


Worth mentioning since I don't think it's explained anywhere: consequently even items by themselves have a bug, in that if there are overrides for a tile, it looks at all matching item groups, oldest items and overriddes first, until it finds an item on that position. Vanilla DF displays piles of items in "youngest first" order, and the pile of items can have not-overridden item on top besides.

Minor ex: This means a full set of clothes will always have same item showed on top, no matter production order.
Major ex: If a tool shares a raw tilenumber with another item (ex, quire and metal bars), and you have a tool (say, wheelbarrow) on a tile with younger metal bars, then it will display the override for quire.


As for vermin, that's really vanilla bug, though luckily the tile they should have is still loaded in game memory. Pissed of Nopal badly (though the record of that is gone as he or Toady erased his account).

I did play around with overrides for engravings toggled on, but it would involve writing double the amount of TWBT overrides that I already have written. Also the possible bugs would make it not worth it.

That's why I did sentient corpse overrides (which also needs altered twbt), tbh - lot of engravings are about creatures, and mostly-transparent text image looks acceptable on ground (though getting actual creature tile from raws would be possible), but horrible on walls, and walls can have so many shapes.

That is interesting. I also found out that TWBT treat a lot of sprites as OPENSPACE when viewing something that are several Z-levels below. but only if an item lies on top of it for some reason. Its hard to explain unless you see it.

[Fi]

Hello, Vettlingr. I am absolutely loving the dark medieval theme of your tileset, and it has been making my journey in Adventure Mode quite an aesthetically-pleasing, thrilling, and foreboding experience—foreboding because your art for hostile creatures looks as though they would be chilling to encounter in-game in your visualization of Dwarf Fortress's world.

There is one thing that did bother me upon discovery of it, and I have one question about it:

• Do you have plans for the future to make male and female variants of the races whose tiles don't have one for visual clarity? While playing as an Elf, I thought that every Elf I conversed with was actually a female, but I noticed upon making one of the Elves my companion that... "she" was actually a "he". This visual clarity would also help with relationships for when they are implemented into Adventure Mode for our Adventurers, so we can tell who is actually a male and who is really a female (I can't wait for this since I would love to be able to romance one of my stalwart companions).

[tpssurvivor]

• This visual clarity would also help with relationships for when they are implemented into Adventure Mode for our Adventurers, so we can tell who is actually a male and who is really a female (I can't wait for this since I would love to be able to romance one of my stalwart companions).

Well mate, for now DF doesn't support different tilesets for male and female, Vettlingr just decided to make elves represented as female.
When DF Releases on steam, then we will have the framework to represent each race with their respective sex.

[Fi]

DF doesn't support different tilesets for male and female,

The reason why I asked is related to having seen a tileset that has male and female counterparts of each race and GemSet having male and female counterparts for each job that specifies a gender (King and Queen).

What I didn’t know about the former is that the maker(s) of that tileset made adding male and female counterparts for each race achievable through hacking which led to me believing that it was something Dwarf Fortress natively supported, so thanks for clarifying that for me.

When DF Releases on steam, then we will have the framework to represent each race with their respective sex.

I don’t know if you’re helping Vettlingr with developing this tileset, but are you confirming that male and female counterparts for each race are planned for the Steam version of Dwarf Fortress?

The question was meant for him.

^{[E: Buffed out a typo.]}

[vettlingr]

tpssurvivor isn't really helping me develop this, although he is right. Df as it is does not support caste-specific Creature sprites such as MALE and FEMALE, though the steam edition and the free edition will in the future. I have seen some prototypes introduced by meph on what the sprite sheets would look like, though im still hesitant to go head making them, due to toady often not delivering fully on graphics requests. But we'll see. FEMALE and MALE graphics are planned.

[vettlingr]

I updated this to day.

The latest version should now include:
- More detailed above ground flora
- Mountain and Domestic Sprites
- Water and magma textures
- Ice textures.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[Fi]

tpssurvivor isn't really helping me develop this, although he is right. Df as it is does not support caste-specific Creature sprites such as MALE and FEMALE, though the steam edition and the free edition will in the future. I have seen some prototypes introduced by meph on what the sprite sheets would look like, though im still hesitant to go head making them, due to toady often not delivering fully on graphics requests. But we'll see. FEMALE and MALE graphics are planned.

Thank you for your response, Vettlingr.

Hm, I should start doing more research behind about anything I discover that has been created by the community for Dwarf Fortress to determine rather it is a hack or something that is natively supported by Dwarf Fortress since it is such a highly moddable game, so apologies for my ignorance.

Take your time with them—no rush at all. Waiting for Toady to fully support and implement graphics requests when he finds time for them during the development of all of those exciting things we're getting soon, that I've read about from the latest 'Future of the Fortress' blog, would help with saving your time and efforts just in case those graphics requests don't happen or are partially implemented.

I can live with the races sharing one male or female sprite and knowing that their counterparts are planned for their respective sexes, so thanks again. ❦