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Author Topic: Wan economy??? (Or, quotes relating to issues with the economy system)  (Read 1927 times)

therahedwig

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So, because 'when is the economy going to return?' is a very often asked FotF question, I am just going to collect all the quotes relating to what is blocking the economy here, so that we'll notice when the economy is actually going to return. I originally wanted to order these by topic, but I couldn't decide how exactly, so they're just by (ISO style formatted) date now. I stopped looking backward around 2011, because that's when the initial caravan arc was being done(and when everyone was still young and optimistic).

Spoiler: 2009 (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: 2011 (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: 2013 (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: 2014 (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: 2015 (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: 2017 (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: 2018 (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: 2019 (click to show/hide)

Feel free to add quotes, or to recycle this post in the future. Please don't turn this thread into an armchair discussion of different economic models. You can go with those to the suggestions forum.
« Last Edit: February 02, 2019, 03:44:22 pm by therahedwig »
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Loud Whispers

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Re: Wan economy??? (Or, quotes relating to issues with the economy system)
« Reply #1 on: December 01, 2018, 05:10:34 pm »

ptw the Footkerchief of DF economy quotes

Ekaton

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Re: Wan economy??? (Or, quotes relating to issues with the economy system)
« Reply #2 on: December 14, 2018, 07:57:24 pm »

Proper economy, that would really make the world alive. A very informative topic, thanks!
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Eschar

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Re: Wan economy??? (Or, quotes relating to issues with the economy system)
« Reply #3 on: December 28, 2018, 05:15:42 pm »

Proper economy, that would really make the world alive.

Yes, from what I hear the economy didn't work well last time.

Please don't turn this thread into an armchair discussion of different economic models.

Because: you can't fight in here, this is the War Room!
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therahedwig

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Re: Wan economy??? (Or, quotes relating to issues with the economy system)
« Reply #4 on: December 29, 2018, 09:33:00 am »

Well, it isn't just about making the world truly alive. The thief and trader roles (and general villainy) just cannot function without the type of resource management we call economy. I mean, it makes no sense to be a thief if stealing stuff has no true use to it. For that matter, this would trickle down into fort mode as well, it'd actually make buying out the whole caravan a feat instead of something to do with a legendary cook :)

But, right now, it seems that we will not have an extra economy arc or something, but rather they're doing a bit of economic work each cycle and each cycle we get closer to a working economy.
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PlumpHelmetMan

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Re: Wan economy??? (Or, quotes relating to issues with the economy system)
« Reply #5 on: January 31, 2019, 09:47:02 pm »

I think the issue last time was largely the attempt to jump into a complex economy too early in the game's development. Trying to run before learning to walk, if you will.
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thvaz

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Re: Wan economy??? (Or, quotes relating to issues with the economy system)
« Reply #6 on: January 31, 2019, 10:04:56 pm »

Yeah, economy is the giant elephant in the room for quite some time. It is a difficult problem to tackle, but an essential one, and Toady avoids it like the plague.
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Shonai_Dweller

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Re: Wan economy??? (Or, quotes relating to issues with the economy system)
« Reply #7 on: January 31, 2019, 10:31:31 pm »

Yeah, economy is the giant elephant in the room for quite some time. It is a difficult problem to tackle, but an essential one, and Toady avoids it like the plague.
Yeah. "Avoiding it" by clearly outlining exactly where it is in the schedule (after Ships and Moving Fortress Parts having thought about what made more sense, boats before economy or economy before boats).

The schedule may change of course. There's a glowing pit at the bottom of this unscheduled rabbit hole labelled Economy which Toady's dangerously close to...
« Last Edit: January 31, 2019, 10:37:40 pm by Shonai_Dweller »
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thvaz

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Re: Wan economy??? (Or, quotes relating to issues with the economy system)
« Reply #8 on: February 01, 2019, 05:47:39 am »

Yeah, economy is the giant elephant in the room for quite some time. It is a difficult problem to tackle, but an essential one, and Toady avoids it like the plague.
Yeah. "Avoiding it" by clearly outlining exactly where it is in the schedule (after Ships and Moving Fortress Parts having thought about what made more sense, boats before economy or economy before boats).

The schedule may change of course. There's a glowing pit at the bottom of this unscheduled rabbit hole labelled Economy which Toady's dangerously close to...

The economy was once called the caravan Arc. It was supposed to come before the army arc back in the day. It doesnt really need to wait the myth update but it looks like it will. So, more 4-5 years without it.
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Shonai_Dweller

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Re: Wan economy??? (Or, quotes relating to issues with the economy system)
« Reply #9 on: February 01, 2019, 06:10:36 am »

Yeah, economy is the giant elephant in the room for quite some time. It is a difficult problem to tackle, but an essential one, and Toady avoids it like the plague.
Yeah. "Avoiding it" by clearly outlining exactly where it is in the schedule (after Ships and Moving Fortress Parts having thought about what made more sense, boats before economy or economy before boats).

The schedule may change of course. There's a glowing pit at the bottom of this unscheduled rabbit hole labelled Economy which Toady's dangerously close to...

The economy was once called the caravan Arc. It was supposed to come before the army arc back in the day. It doesnt really need to wait the myth update but it looks like it will. So, more 4-5 years without it.
Quite a bit longer I think. Moving Fortress parts is the third major rewrite arc planned (in the current dev notes schedule) after Myth and Starting Scenarios. And both of those are big enough to see a few major releases each.
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PlumpHelmetMan

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Re: Wan economy??? (Or, quotes relating to issues with the economy system)
« Reply #10 on: February 01, 2019, 06:55:06 pm »

I mean, like thvaz said, it's definitely essential so it's safe to assume that Toady won't put it off forever. But yeah, it's tough to predict when he'll decide to give it another go, especially since it remains one of the most difficult hurdles to clear. By no means impossible, though.
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Death Dragon

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Re: Wan economy??? (Or, quotes relating to issues with the economy system)
« Reply #11 on: February 02, 2019, 10:24:40 am »

Should probably be said here that with the latest devlog and FotF, Toady made it so that historical figures can use the money in their "accounts" to upgrade their equipment (also increasing upkeep costs), which is currently mostly used by mercenaries, and he is considering giving players the option to pay mercenaries in fort mode using minted coins.
This update is taking some surprisingly big steps towards the economy.

http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/index.html#2019-01-30
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf//index.php?topic=169696.msg7924237#msg7924237
« Last Edit: February 02, 2019, 10:36:21 am by Death Dragon »
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therahedwig

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Re: Wan economy??? (Or, quotes relating to issues with the economy system)
« Reply #12 on: February 02, 2019, 03:48:03 pm »

Thanks for reminding me to update :)

Also, lol@villains probably having to spend money on their hideouts. There's just something very funny to me about the practical issues DF npcs have to deal with.
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