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Author Topic: Can you kill entire species off in Adventure Mode?  (Read 5616 times)

Sarmatian123

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Can you kill entire species off in Adventure Mode?
« on: February 01, 2019, 05:07:49 am »

Can you kill entire species off in Adventure Mode?

I killed like 1200 wild animals now. Mostly at my own camp, but I was poaching 2 lairs I claimed too and killed some when travelling on ground.

Is there any hope, I will kill off some entire species of them?

Or the stupid roll-terrain-reveal feature/bug will generate endless number of animals to fill my camp to the last free pocket of space in there and give me fps death?

Is there any reason, besides skilling combat abilities in killing wild animals?
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PlumpHelmetMan

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Re: Can you kill entire species off in Adventure Mode?
« Reply #1 on: February 01, 2019, 12:22:47 pm »

I think you can wipe out animal species, don't quote me on it though. Though if there's a bug involved causing animals to spawn randomly then that might change things.
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Rumrusher

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Re: Can you kill entire species off in Adventure Mode?
« Reply #2 on: February 02, 2019, 06:15:11 am »

it's possible to wipe them out but it requires endless amount of murdering them to put a dent.. and lots of walking around at best you could depopulate the area of said creature but full on genocide is uhh more than 1200 like slap a couple more 0s to that like probably in the millions.
this is like adv megaprojects levels of commitment.
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Fatace

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Re: Can you kill entire species off in Adventure Mode?
« Reply #3 on: February 02, 2019, 02:51:11 pm »

Ive tried... doesn't seem like you can, even if you go to a dark fortress, town, ect, random npc's tend to spawn either way... but I do know that kobolds are impossible to kill off since they just literally respawn as soon as u leave their area...

I even tried invading goblin civs, forcing them out of their fortress and pits into campgrounds.. and attempt to kill them all off (takes forever), but randomly on a rare occasion the game crashes upon attempting to load certain people (old vanilla raiding glitch as far as im aware of)
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Untrustedlife

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Re: Can you kill entire species off in Adventure Mode?
« Reply #4 on: February 02, 2019, 07:54:23 pm »

Ive tried... doesn't seem like you can, even if you go to a dark fortress, town, ect, random npc's tend to spawn either way... but I do know that kobolds are impossible to kill off since they just literally respawn as soon as u leave their area...

I even tried invading goblin civs, forcing them out of their fortress and pits into campgrounds.. and attempt to kill them all off (takes forever), but randomly on a rare occasion the game crashes upon attempting to load certain people (old vanilla raiding glitch as far as im aware of)
No, thats not how that works in dwarf fortress, populations are tracked. Its just that populations can be very big. And only a certain amount of them can be loaded at a time. There is no such thing as "respawning" in the normal sense in dwarf fortress, the only time respawning happened, it was a bug and was promptly fixed. Its more like "loading more entity population since the numbers are large".

You can easily confirm that i am correct by using legends viewer look at a place in legends viewer check its population, go to that place (a  hamlet, kobold cave or whatever), kill a bunch of them. Retire, export legends, and look in legends viewer, you will see that population has now dropped. Or you can just depopulate a hamlet and see that they dont come back.

Even animal populations are tracked. I havent tested whether your kills effect wild animal populations in awhile, but i believe t is indeed the case and that it has been asked on the FOTF before. (Also i recall that i killed off the giant wolverine population on a mountain once, and confirmed with legends viewer) (they have small populations in each region, so are a good test case)

The only time "actual" respawning happens, is with Angels in Vaults.
« Last Edit: February 02, 2019, 08:38:47 pm by Untrustedlife »
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George_Chickens

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Re: Can you kill entire species off in Adventure Mode?
« Reply #5 on: February 03, 2019, 03:14:25 am »

Ive tried... doesn't seem like you can, even if you go to a dark fortress, town, ect, random npc's tend to spawn either way... but I do know that kobolds are impossible to kill off since they just literally respawn as soon as u leave their area...

I even tried invading goblin civs, forcing them out of their fortress and pits into campgrounds.. and attempt to kill them all off (takes forever), but randomly on a rare occasion the game crashes upon attempting to load certain people (old vanilla raiding glitch as far as im aware of)
No, thats not how that works in dwarf fortress, populations are tracked. Its just that populations can be very big. And only a certain amount of them can be loaded at a time. There is no such thing as "respawning" in the normal sense in dwarf fortress, the only time respawning happened, it was a bug and was promptly fixed. Its more like "loading more entity population since the numbers are large".

You can easily confirm that i am correct by using legends viewer look at a place in legends viewer check its population, go to that place (a  hamlet, kobold cave or whatever), kill a bunch of them. Retire, export legends, and look in legends viewer, you will see that population has now dropped. Or you can just depopulate a hamlet and see that they dont come back.

Even animal populations are tracked. I havent tested whether your kills effect wild animal populations in awhile, but i believe t is indeed the case and that it has been asked on the FOTF before. (Also i recall that i killed off the giant wolverine population on a mountain once, and confirmed with legends viewer) (they have small populations in each region, so are a good test case)

The only time "actual" respawning happens, is with Angels in Vaults.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure this is even true with bogeymen. Back when they were first released, I remember going on a quest with an unretired veteran to completely purge them from an area, as to make it safe for my future adventurers. Eventually, though I'm not sure if it's just a placebo, it seemed as though the attacks tapered off.
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Sarmatian123

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Re: Can you kill entire species off in Adventure Mode?
« Reply #6 on: February 03, 2019, 05:52:46 am »

Well, I tried. I tried hunting them out. However what good it is, if DF crashes to desktop with segmentation fault. Specially, if you saved 2h ago and speeds inside camp are 4(4) and 8(8 ), right? I never fast traveled in this game. It ended on 10th of hematite y05. Maybe if you fast travel, then it takes longer before DF goes crashing on you time after time with segmentation fault, giving you a hint that something really bad is going on in Adventure Mode.

Can't we get common conclusion that DF in Adventure Mode, as it currently stands is simply: UNPLAYABLE.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2019, 06:07:02 am by Sarmatian123 »
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Untrustedlife

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Re: Can you kill entire species off in Adventure Mode?
« Reply #7 on: February 03, 2019, 01:20:47 pm »

Well, I tried. I tried hunting them out. However what good it is, if DF crashes to desktop with segmentation fault. Specially, if you saved 2h ago and speeds inside camp are 4(4) and 8(8 ), right? I never fast traveled in this game. It ended on 10th of hematite y05. Maybe if you fast travel, then it takes longer before DF goes crashing on you time after time with segmentation fault, giving you a hint that something really bad is going on in Adventure Mode.

Can't we get common conclusion that DF in Adventure Mode, as it currently stands is simply: UNPLAYABLE.

Whats the point of underlining and bolding that, its most certainly not unplayable, just a bit buggy sometimes, but fort mode is also buggy so eh.
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Fatace

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Re: Can you kill entire species off in Adventure Mode?
« Reply #8 on: February 03, 2019, 01:54:38 pm »


No, thats not how that works in dwarf fortress, populations are tracked. Its just that populations can be very big. And only a certain amount of them can be loaded at a time. There is no such thing as "respawning" in the normal sense in dwarf fortress, the only time respawning happened, it was a bug and was promptly fixed. Its more like "loading more entity population since the numbers are large".

You can easily confirm that i am correct by using legends viewer look at a place in legends viewer check its population, go to that place (a  hamlet, kobold cave or whatever), kill a bunch of them. Retire, export legends, and look in legends viewer, you will see that population has now dropped. Or you can just depopulate a hamlet and see that they dont come back.

Even animal populations are tracked. I havent tested whether your kills effect wild animal populations in awhile, but i believe t is indeed the case and that it has been asked on the FOTF before. (Also i recall that i killed off the giant wolverine population on a mountain once, and confirmed with legends viewer) (they have small populations in each region, so are a good test case)

The only time "actual" respawning happens, is with Angels in Vaults.

Nah it still happens, mainly with kobold caves, even if legends says you've killed them all, they repopulate the place with new generic people that arnt listed on legends unless killed or if they become historical figures. After so many playthroughs, every time I have attempted to kill off a Goblin or something Civ, I come back or reload the area and theres 2-5 new goblins, repeat, and the same keeps happening. If I find none, I could come back days/months/years later and find more..
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Fatace

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Re: Can you kill entire species off in Adventure Mode?
« Reply #9 on: February 03, 2019, 01:59:14 pm »

Well, I tried. I tried hunting them out. However what good it is, if DF crashes to desktop with segmentation fault. Specially, if you saved 2h ago and speeds inside camp are 4(4) and 8(8 ), right? I never fast traveled in this game. It ended on 10th of hematite y05. Maybe if you fast travel, then it takes longer before DF goes crashing on you time after time with segmentation fault, giving you a hint that something really bad is going on in Adventure Mode.

Can't we get common conclusion that DF in Adventure Mode, as it currently stands is simply: UNPLAYABLE.


The game is playable, you just keep playing it in the most laggiest/buggy way possible by never or rarely fast traveling and letting the world unload... not sure what type of computer you have... but the only time I crash is due to either mod testing bugs, or invasion bugs.
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Untrustedlife

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Re: Can you kill entire species off in Adventure Mode?
« Reply #10 on: February 03, 2019, 03:30:42 pm »


No, thats not how that works in dwarf fortress, populations are tracked. Its just that populations can be very big. And only a certain amount of them can be loaded at a time. There is no such thing as "respawning" in the normal sense in dwarf fortress, the only time respawning happened, it was a bug and was promptly fixed. Its more like "loading more entity population since the numbers are large".

You can easily confirm that i am correct by using legends viewer look at a place in legends viewer check its population, go to that place (a  hamlet, kobold cave or whatever), kill a bunch of them. Retire, export legends, and look in legends viewer, you will see that population has now dropped. Or you can just depopulate a hamlet and see that they dont come back.

Even animal populations are tracked. I havent tested whether your kills effect wild animal populations in awhile, but i believe t is indeed the case and that it has been asked on the FOTF before. (Also i recall that i killed off the giant wolverine population on a mountain once, and confirmed with legends viewer) (they have small populations in each region, so are a good test case)

The only time "actual" respawning happens, is with Angels in Vaults.

Nah it still happens, mainly with kobold caves, even if legends says you've killed them all, they repopulate the place with new generic people that arnt listed on legends unless killed or if they become historical figures. After so many playthroughs, every time I have attempted to kill off a Goblin or something Civ, I come back or reload the area and theres 2-5 new goblins, repeat, and the same keeps happening. If I find none, I could come back days/months/years later and find more..
*facepalm*
No,
Each site has something called an entity population, there are very few ways to see it, but like i said you can do it with legends viewer. rest assured the population is still tracked properly. They are "generic" because it grabs from the entity population to populate the site when you go there, and from hist figs (but if there are no hist figs left it will use the entity population),  and these populations can be in the thousands (of entity population) they are mostly used right now to crate armies, and to generate historical figures for when the civilization needs a new ruler or noble  and there isn't an heir for example,  so as i said earlier.  Its just that populations can be very big. And only a certain amount of them can be loaded at a time. But no, its still all entirely tracked and you can still kill them all eventually and this is easily confirmed with legends viewer. Please stop with the speculation. This is very easy to confirm.

When you kill them, you will see the entity population drop, once it hits 0, the site is considered depopulated, and they will no longer spawn, what you are seeing in your "examples" is it populating from entity populations. You can still kill them all off with enough work.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2019, 03:45:30 pm by Untrustedlife »
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Strik3r

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Re: Can you kill entire species off in Adventure Mode?
« Reply #11 on: February 03, 2019, 04:33:39 pm »

But no, its still all entirely tracked and you can still kill them all eventually and this is easily confirmed with legends viewer. Please stop with the speculation. This is very easy to confirm.

When you kill them, you will see the entity population drop, once it hits 0, the site is considered depopulated, and they will no longer spawn, what you are seeing in your "examples" is it populating from entity populations. You can still kill them all off with enough work.

This is correct and i can confirm it as such.
As part of my mod testing recently, i fortunately happened upon several conquered dwarf sites with extremely low civilized populations. After killing everyone living there, the game actually displayed the sites as ruins on the map and no people spawned there.
(For some reason, that world also had a perfectly (over)populated town that was also considered a ruin by the game, that i later claimed with two demon companions in tow lol)
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Fatace

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Re: Can you kill entire species off in Adventure Mode?
« Reply #12 on: February 03, 2019, 05:59:11 pm »

*facepalm*
No,
Each site has something called an entity population, there are very few ways to see it, but like i said you can do it with legends viewer. rest assured the population is still tracked properly. They are "generic" because it grabs from the entity population to populate the site when you go there, and from hist figs (but if there are no hist figs left it will use the entity population),  and these populations can be in the thousands (of entity population) they are mostly used right now to crate armies, and to generate historical figures for when the civilization needs a new ruler or noble  and there isn't an heir for example,  so as i said earlier.  Its just that populations can be very big. And only a certain amount of them can be loaded at a time. But no, its still all entirely tracked and you can still kill them all eventually and this is easily confirmed with legends viewer. Please stop with the speculation. This is very easy to confirm.

When you kill them, you will see the entity population drop, once it hits 0, the site is considered depopulated, and they will no longer spawn, what you are seeing in your "examples" is it populating from entity populations. You can still kill them all off with enough work.

If this is the case, then wouldn't the towns or dark fortresses be in ruins or depopulated in my worlds? I invaded Goblins and pushed them to the sides of their pits/fortress and killed them all off, and went inside and killed off any others that were alive and after a while nothing happened to it, I even checked legends to see if their were any goblins left in the world and there was none left.. but after leaving, switching to fortressmode, it still showed population... invaded it again and again, and they just razed the place, killed nothing their and left. Only creatures that remain their are beak dogs and trolls, unless that is what it considers still a population.. even tho I do know for fact that trolls and beak dogs will respawn once you unload and reload the area.
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PlumpHelmetMan

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Re: Can you kill entire species off in Adventure Mode?
« Reply #13 on: February 03, 2019, 06:31:12 pm »

Seems to me that you're just ignoring him and repeating the same erroneous points.
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Untrustedlife

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Re: Can you kill entire species off in Adventure Mode?
« Reply #14 on: February 03, 2019, 07:04:47 pm »

Seems to me that you're just ignoring him and repeating the same erroneous points.
yep.
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