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[Chimerat]

I haven't been able to find an answer anywhere to this, so maybe someone knows it (and can point to the source of their information).

I see there's an itch.io release in the works. (As well as one on STEAM-DRM, if you like DRM...)

With my experience with tilesets, several creatures/items have the exact same sprites.

As per the product's description at https://kitfoxgames.itch.io/dwarf-fortress, "Nothing substantial has changed, under the hood."

So that would mean no custom sprites to ensure all creatures that are not the same species look different? None of the screenshots I could find even allow me to zoom in, so I'm not sure how to verify.

[Shonai_Dweller]

1) How do you define "custom sprites"? Dwarf Fortress vanilla has functionality for including a huge number of sprites. About the only thing it doesn't have is different sprites for creature castes (as far as I recall). But...

2) Before release Toady is making a graphics support upgrade.
So nothing will change under the hood when the Steam version is released, which will be after these changes have been made.

Mod forum, tilesets has threads on the new graphics.

[Bortness]

Here's the basic info on tilesets and graphic packs *at the current time* as far as I understand it.  Without graphics enabled, ASCII is your only option, and given that ASCII has a limited set of "tiles" (characters) to work with, by necessity many creatures will use the same character.  Once graphics are enabled, it is *already now* possible to assign a unique sprite to every different creature type in the game (excluding caste distinctions, as already mentioned).  If you are experiencing doubled-up creature tiles with graphic sets enabled, I imagine it's a function of lack of graphics rather than the underlying engine's ability to support.

Also as mentioned, Toady is making a graphics-support upgrade to the engine anyways before the Steam / Itch release, so the engine's native graphics support should be increased substantially anyways.  And given that DF "classic" is to remain more or less untouched, I imagine that user-created and supported graphic sets will probably see a serious uptick in action as well.

This kinda feels like trying to find something to be upset about, to be perfectly honest.

[therahedwig]

To be fair, these kinds of things always has everyone try to give their 2 cents, so it becomes super quickly super difficult to tell what is going on.

That said, the idea is that vanilla, er, I mean, classic DF will have the same graphic engine features, but not the actual asset pack made by two people who know the game really well and are now working fulltime on it, like the paid version will have.

So like, there's no difference between what was already planned, it's just that extending the graphics suddenly has priority instead of coming at version 0.99.82

I am also pretty sure the steam version won't have DRM, as that's something typically only the big AAA publishers want.

[Meph]

Hi.

Tileset-related questions best go to either Mike Mayday or me directly.

With my experience with tilesets, several creatures/items have the exact same sprites.

That is a rather outdated experience. The tileset I've been running over the last 2 years has around 10.000 unique sprites. Every item, every creature, every plant, plant growth, bud, flower, nut... all have their fitting sprites. Yes, sometimes there are re-colors, just look at the silly amount of gibbons that Toady added to the game; but generally that is rare.

There will be a lot of graphic API changes under-the-hood. And even if there weren't, DF today easily allows adding unique sprites too all creatures. With or without Dfhack/TWBT.

So, to make it very clear: There are 767 creatures in the game, about 360 giant/animal men, 100 vermin and 300 normal creatures. All of those will get an adult sprite, a child sprite, a zombie sprite, a corpse sprite (hopefully), and when applicable a trained and mount sprite.

If you are still doubtful, have a look at this: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=161047.0

I made that in my free time. Now imagine how motivated I might be for the official release.

[Shonai_Dweller]

Hey Meph! Are you looking forward to the day we get unique caste sprites or lying awake at night calculating the extra graphics? Just curious. 

[Meph]

Unique caste sprites don't add that many. Most male/female animals don't look that different, so it's just the humanoids, maybe lions, some insects/insect men, that's about it.

[Putnam]

(As well as one on STEAM-DRM, if you like DRM...)

there have been DRM-free steam releases for 10 years and i have no idea why people keep saying this

[Shinotsa]

(As well as one on STEAM-DRM, if you like DRM...)

there have been DRM-free steam releases for 10 years and i have no idea why people keep saying this

Can’t emphasize this enough. Steam being the DRM devil is so 2015.

[Cruxador]

(As well as one on STEAM-DRM, if you like DRM...)

there have been DRM-free steam releases for 10 years and i have no idea why people keep saying this

Can’t emphasize this enough. Steam being the DRM devil is so 2015.

2015 was actually less than ten years ago.

[Shonai_Dweller]

(As well as one on STEAM-DRM, if you like DRM...)

there have been DRM-free steam releases for 10 years and i have no idea why people keep saying this

Can’t emphasize this enough. Steam being the DRM devil is so 2015.

2015 was actually less than ten years ago.

And people were getting it wrong back then too. 

[Chimerat]

Hi.

Tileset-related questions best go to either Mike Mayday or me directly.

With my experience with tilesets, several creatures/items have the exact same sprites.

That is a rather outdated experience. The tileset I've been running over the last 2 years has around 10.000 unique sprites. Every item, every creature, every plant, plant growth, bud, flower, nut... all have their fitting sprites. Yes, sometimes there are re-colors, just look at the silly amount of gibbons that Toady added to the game; but generally that is rare.

There will be a lot of graphic API changes under-the-hood. And even if there weren't, DF today easily allows adding unique sprites too all creatures. With or without Dfhack/TWBT.

So, to make it very clear: There are 767 creatures in the game, about 360 giant/animal men, 100 vermin and 300 normal creatures. All of those will get an adult sprite, a child sprite, a zombie sprite, a corpse sprite (hopefully), and when applicable a trained and mount sprite.

If you are still doubtful, have a look at this: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=161047.0

I made that in my free time. Now imagine how motivated I might be for the official release.

Thank you for clearing that up!

(As well as one on STEAM-DRM, if you like DRM...)

there have been DRM-free steam releases for 10 years and i have no idea why people keep saying this

Can’t emphasize this enough. Steam being the DRM devil is so 2015.

2015 was actually less than ten years ago.

And people were getting it wrong back then too. 

Really!? When did STEAM add the option to back up your installers so that you can use your games at any time without having internet access?

Right. Never.

Until it does that, it is STEAM-DRM.

[Sorg]

Really!? When did STEAM add the option to back up your installers so that you can use your games at any time without having internet access?

Right. Never.

Until it does that, it is STEAM-DRM.

You mean like this -> https://imgur.com/a/QZ8P9iD ?

[PatrikLundell]

I'm not a fan of Steam's "You've purchased a license to play a game for as long as we decide you should have it. You have no right whatsoever beyond that, including to be given a reason for why we cut you off" EULA.
However, I'm not a fanatic either, so I use Steam if there's no reasonable alternative and I'm sufficiently interested in the game.

However, there is at least one game available via Steam (and probably more than one) that remains available as long as it's on your hard drive (I won't bet anything on the Steam application not wiping it if ordered by its master, though), and it should be possible to move/copy it as well. Unreal World is the game I'm thinking of. Since it's available as free download (+ optional donation) from the game developer there's a better alternative to Steam for that case, though.

There are many games that work when the Internet connection is down as they don't have "phone home to master" DRM.

Installing programs without Internet access is getting more and more complicated, however, as many installers seem to just be downloaders that call the home site to download an actual installation package (if done properly that package is tailored to your hardware and OS, and contains the latest patches. This obviously would require the relevant details to be uploaded, and whether they're treated in a competent manner or like Facebook and spread further to anyone willing to pay for it differs on a case by case basis, of course).

[Lightman]

Really!? When did STEAM add the option to back up your installers so that you can use your games at any time without having internet access?

Right. Never.

Until it does that, it is STEAM-DRM.

You mean like this -> https://imgur.com/a/QZ8P9iD ?

That doesn't address Chimerat's concerns, though. First, to restore the backup, you have to log into Steam, so it can't be used offline. Second, the backup feature does not affect whether or not you can play offline. My understanding is that some games require you to be online to play and it's possible for the Steam client to require login:
If the Steam client is requiring a login, there is no option to bypass that without going online.

Also worth noting about the backup system from Steam:
Many games that use third party installers or downloaders will not work with Steam's backup feature.

It appears that the backup feature is not universal for purchases from Steam.