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Author Topic: How much embark points everyone uses? v2.0  (Read 7998 times)

xZippy

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How much embark points everyone uses? v2.0
« on: August 11, 2019, 06:01:58 pm »

I'm still learning the game, so I cheat heavily and give myself like 200000 points with DFHack, which obviously means I bring a huge amount of almost every item and animal. The high amount of animals gives me that edge where I can start butchering/cooking things immediately and build up that skill. I even give myself extra stone blocks and logs as to not take up as much time at the start getting things ready.

I know that's extreme cheating, but I really want to feel out all the game's mechanics. Then I'll go down to 10000 points, then 1000 less every time after that.

I need to know what embark points other people start out with because reasons. Please tell me or I'll be very angry. >=[
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NordicNooob

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Re: How much embark points everyone uses? v2.0
« Reply #1 on: August 11, 2019, 06:18:41 pm »

Never really heard of anybody using anything other than the standard 1504 in most cases; I've heard of a rare few using 10k just to mess around or test stuff (ie, bring 10k worth of cats and set their body temp to be that of dragonfire), but almost every serious embark does use the standard amount. You can fit quite a bit in with that many if you know what you're doing with it, and I don't think I'd know what to do with even 500 extra points, unless except maybe I've got mods that add expensive ores that are actually useful to bring on embark.
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Naia

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Re: How much embark points everyone uses? v2.0
« Reply #2 on: August 11, 2019, 09:39:01 pm »

I'm doing a minimal embark type thing to add some challenge.

20 plump helmets ( comes whit a free barrel )
1 copper battle axe.
The expedition leader get 1 point in relevant skills.
The medic get 1 point in relevant skills.

If the embark is evil whit undead creatures or within range of necromancer towers, 2 common stones is added ( mechanism for cage traps )

And that's it. Don't recall the exact number, but it's about 300 points worth.

That means the starting dwarves have to get by living off the land until the first caravan. 
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Fleeting Frames

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Re: How much embark points everyone uses? v2.0
« Reply #3 on: August 11, 2019, 10:21:16 pm »

I've seen couple different values here and there:

1324 (Play Now! has at most 1358 with steel anvil) in some worldgens, 2500 in others.
106 for anvil and copper nugget.
44 for copper pick.
0 for zero-point embarks (before 43.03, you'd make a wooden axe from wagon logs, now you need to take a metal one from a visitor).
Personally, tend to stay with the standard.

As far as getting butchering stuff goes, I feel 49 turkeys - less than a steel anvil - is more than one needs after they breed, generally. You generally use embark points either for quicker start or hard-to-obtain stuff, and caging or not caging poults will slow you down while not being particularly hard to obtain.

Beyond ready-forged gear on shrine embarks, 10000 point embarks are useful for artistry stuff like building a giant pitchblende sphere set to implode or the like; caravan can technically bring you it but not that much very quickly. Kinda forces your mason to stick to next to wagon, though.

Tilmar13

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Re: How much embark points everyone uses? v2.0
« Reply #4 on: August 12, 2019, 05:21:16 pm »

I either use less points or the standard value. I don't like cheating with extra points for the same reason you said you do it. I feel like the LESS I have the more I have to experiment and test out all the features.  If I'm trying to learn a new mechanic, I try to set out in an embark where it is absolutely paramount that I get it right. i.e. penetrating aquifer with just a few stone, creating a sustainable meat industry in an undead biome, an all-above ground fort in savage wilds. I feel like you gain more from learning how to do it when there's no room for failure, and that if you do fail it'll set you back a lot. That's what makes Dwarf Fortress !FUN!
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ibanix

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Re: How much embark points everyone uses? v2.0
« Reply #5 on: August 13, 2019, 10:22:31 am »

Dunno why you'd need more than normal unless testing. With basic farming of a 3x3 plot or two, plus egg layers (turkeys best), I'm usually swimming in meat and produce.

If I bring more of anything, it tends to be coal or liginite if it's avail, as that really jump-starts any industry that needs fuel. Lye is also helpful to bring to get soap going right away.

On my most recent embark I was starting a massive glass system, so I brought a ton of sand; each gives you an extra bag. Presto, 50 extra bags!
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anewaname

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Re: How much embark points everyone uses? v2.0
« Reply #6 on: August 13, 2019, 04:51:12 pm »

I just use the default. It is enough for maximum skills, basic tools, basic animals, minimal food, and the remainder goes into metal ore.

There is a lot to what Tilmar13 says... You cannot do everything in one embark, so you work on doing one thing well, then another thing, etc. And, you change what you need to, to allow yourself the opportunity to do that other thing. So, you are doing the right thing by increasing your embark points... you are making one aspect of the game easier so you can focus on learning how to do other things.
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xZippy

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Re: How much embark points everyone uses? v2.0
« Reply #7 on: August 14, 2019, 02:41:26 am »

Dunno why you'd need more than normal unless testing. With basic farming of a 3x3 plot or two, plus egg layers (turkeys best), I'm usually swimming in meat and produce.
Testing is exactly right, and I'm trying to experiment with things and put them on the wiki so the next reader understands something better. The problem is, I went berzerk with like 200000 points and now my dwarves are spending an unholy amount of time moving an unspeakably amount of stuff - which I end up just trading away.

Next time, I'm just sticking with 20000, then 10000 after that.
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Sarmatian123

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Re: How much embark points everyone uses? v2.0
« Reply #8 on: August 14, 2019, 05:04:47 am »

I use default too. Though, I remove most items and invest heavily in skills.
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Pvt. Pirate

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Re: How much embark points everyone uses? v2.0
« Reply #9 on: August 15, 2019, 09:32:22 am »

i use nebulatrons preset and remove the steel anvil and some seeds to buy more picks or axes, depending on embark location and maybe add 2 of each type of thread in case of emergencies and/or an iron anvil.
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pamelrabo

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Re: How much embark points everyone uses? v2.0
« Reply #10 on: August 15, 2019, 01:10:19 pm »

I just use the standard embark points unless I'm roleplaying heavily (like the city is some special project of the King's) and I decide to give myself points enough for 100 iron bars, 25 armor sets or 300 marble blocks or 40 goats for livestock farm.

I consider it more a logic equipment limit for a 7 people expedition than a real budget, in fact.
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Iduno

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Re: How much embark points everyone uses? v2.0
« Reply #11 on: August 15, 2019, 01:31:03 pm »

I use the standard amount, and max out everyone's allotment of skills so I have less points to go shopping with.

Breeding pair of dogs and 2 female kittens, plus the starters is more than enough animals. 21 seeds of every food, drink, and rope type I feel like dealing with. I end up with 1 of all of the milks and 1 of every cheap meat for barrels, plus wood or whatever to make bins. Barrels, bins, and bags are great for logistics. Also, 2 picks, an axe, and "I don't know, I've got points left, so weapons and armor?" or a pile of leather to make starting armor. Bringing the ingredients to make your own stuff means the points go further, and it feels like a lot of stuff. And farming has such high yields that I don't care about getting other sources of food (although I will set up some herbalist/gatherers for variety).

Although I've gotten lazy enough that I usually just bring picks and an axe instead of setting up a temporary forge. Too fiddly.
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doublestrafe

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Re: How much embark points everyone uses? v2.0
« Reply #12 on: August 15, 2019, 02:19:40 pm »

Rocks. Nobody ever seems to say "bring a big pile of rocks." So many problems are trivialized by starting with a big pile of cheap, magma-safe rocks.
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Pvt. Pirate

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Re: How much embark points everyone uses? v2.0
« Reply #13 on: August 16, 2019, 03:29:26 am »

Rocks. Nobody ever seems to say "bring a big pile of rocks." So many problems are trivialized by starting with a big pile of cheap, magma-safe rocks.
almost every fort that survived the first year drowned in rocks, so i'm not bringing any along.
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Crabs

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Re: How much embark points everyone uses? v2.0
« Reply #14 on: August 20, 2019, 06:27:30 am »

I always start with "Play Now!"
 8)
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