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[brolol.404]

I don't know if it matters to you, but harvestmen aren't actually spiders.

Yeah. I read that. But, it has eight legs and spins webs. Close enough for me lol

[Lurksquatch]

I do get your point on the spider colony though and I agree. I spent some time looking it up and it looks like harvestmen spiders live in large colonies. So, I will remove wolf spiders as a playable fort mode race and add harvestmen spiders as a civ (wolf spiders will still be creatures in the mod). Although they are much weaker that wolf spiders, they are omnivores that eat insects and fungi and will have webs.

Sweet  .

Are you going to have a goblin analog? Someone to war with and defend the colony from? Termites might be a good option. Or, maybe army ants, or something like that?

[Meph]

Without dfhack, the "plants" would be animals that spawn on the edge of the map. They would either remain there or they would walk around.

You could make cavern trees for depth 2 and 3 (to avoid it showing up with invaders/traders) that evaporates when felled and poisons/dissolves the worker. Ant goes to cut down plant, picks a dangerous one, gets to breath in syndrome-ladden vapor, dies.

I think it might even work with growths, like a plant that emits poison (bursts of evaporating growths) once every now and then. Haven't tested that one yet.

[brolol.404]

You could make cavern trees for depth 2 and 3 (to avoid it showing up with invaders/traders) that evaporates when felled and poisons/dissolves the worker. Ant goes to cut down plant, picks a dangerous one, gets to breath in syndrome-ladden vapor, dies.

I think it might even work with growths, like a plant that emits poison (bursts of evaporating growths) once every now and then. Haven't tested that one yet.

This is a really cool idea. I assume some kind of mold or other kind of fungus could do this. I could add black mold "trees" or "shrubs" to the third cavern layer that does this. If I restrict the microbial soap creatures to the third caverns as well it would give the player a real incentive to venture out there. I will have to see if I can get it working though. If I can't get it to work on the growths I'm not sure it will be worth it.

[brolol.404]

The wolf spider civ has been successfully replaced with the harvestmen civ.

Here is the new artwork:



I put the other spider graphic in 018 (which isnt used in vanilla), so maybe I will use it for the other spiders.

I also added:

bark beetle (wagon puller)
cockroach
black widow
brown recluse
brown widow
cellar spider
funnel web spider
wolf spider

[Lurksquatch]

Some more insects you could add (If you don't have them already).

Tiger Beetles are very fast.
Dragonflies There are lots of species, so you could just add a generic dragonfly, or add more for variety
Golden Tortoise Beetles, maybe in good biomes? Maybe a source of shell for moods?
Antlions, maybe just the larva, because they're the ones people usually think about and can harm ants. Might be good for deserts.
Inchworms Technically, they're a kind of caterpillar, but they can be voracious ambush predators. Not sure how/if you want to handle the larvae/adult issue.

Hope it helps  .

EDIT: If you only pick one Tiger Beetle to base yours off of, might I suggest the Monster Tiger Beetle? There are plenty of others to choose from, though  .

[Enemy post]

Oh hey, I tried the beta you sent me. You might want to remove MAXAGE on your megabeasts. It's not realistic, but if you don't, they all die after at most 20 years of worldgen and are never replaced. This makes it virtually impossible for a player to ever encounter one unless history is set to "very short".

*Also, the UTTERANCES-based names are fun.

[Logariter]

I have an Idea for savage biomes. Maybe they could have smaller vertebrate creatures in them, which would seem huge, (but not megabeast-sized) to the insects.

[brolol.404]

Some more insects you could add (If you don't have them already).

Tiger Beetles are very fast.
Dragonflies There are lots of species, so you could just add a generic dragonfly, or add more for variety
Golden Tortoise Beetles, maybe in good biomes? Maybe a source of shell for moods?
Antlions, maybe just the larva, because they're the ones people usually think about and can harm ants. Might be good for deserts.
Inchworms Technically, they're a kind of caterpillar, but they can be voracious ambush predators. Not sure how/if you want to handle the larvae/adult issue.

Hope it helps  .

EDIT: If you only pick one Tiger Beetle to base yours off of, might I suggest the Monster Tiger Beetle? There are plenty of others to choose from, though  .

Cool ideas! thanks!

I will add tiger beetles. If I base them off of the monster tiger beetle it might be a semi-megabeast though. Or maybe I will stick it in the caverns as large terrifying creatures.
I already have dragonflies planned with different color variations.
I will add tortoise beetles (with gold as one of the color variations) with an expensive multiplier on their butcher mats.
I will add antlions (based on the larvae) in the first cavern layer and in deserts/badlands. (they won't transform into adult antlions)
I will add inchworms (based on the carnivorous ones). (they won't transform into adult moths)

Oh hey, I tried the beta you sent me. You might want to remove MAXAGE on your megabeasts. It's not realistic, but if you don't, they all die after at most 20 years of worldgen and are never replaced. This makes it virtually impossible for a player to ever encounter one unless history is set to "very short".

*Also, the UTTERANCES-based names are fun.

Thanks for the feedback. I removed MAXAGE from the megabeasts and I removed FLIER from the ant drones. Let me know if you have any other gameplay feedback

I have an Idea for savage biomes. Maybe they could have smaller vertebrate creatures in them, which would seem huge, (but not megabeast-sized) to the insects.

This is a really cool idea. Do you have any examples though? I did find a frog the size of a house fly, but I'm not sure it has a common name.

[brolol.404]

These creatures are currently in the mod:

black ant (playable civ)
harvestmen (playable civ)
army ant
bullet ant
carpenter ant
fire ant
honeypot ant
leafcutter ant
pharoah ant
weaver ant
bumblebee
carpenter bee
cicada killer (semi-megabeast)
cow killer wasp/ velvet ant
leafcutter bee
hornet (semi-megabeast)
mud dauber
mason bee
mining bee
orchid bee
tarantula hawk (semi-megabeast)
wasp
yellow jacket
black widow
brown recluse
brown widow
cellar spider
funnel-web spider
wolf spider
bark beetle (domestic/wagon puller)
cockroach
canary (megabeast)
bat (megabeast)
finch (megabeast)
shrew (megabeast)
sparrow (megabeast)
wren (megabeast)

These creatures are planned to be added:

honey bee (playable civ)
paper wasp (playable civ)
huntsman spider
jumping spider
hobo spider
orb-weaver spider
tarantula (semi-megabeast)
trapdoor spider
staghorn beetle (semi-megabeast)
antlion
rhinoceros beetle (semi-megabeast)
cicada
goliath beetle
hercules beetle (semi-megabeast)
longhorn beetle
ground beetle
leaf beetle
rove beetle
weevil
scarab
ladybug
dung beetle
carpet beetle
fire fly
darkling beetle
click beetle
assassin bug
trilobite beetle
stink bug
hissing cockroach
bed bug
tiger beetle
tortoise beetle
dry wood termite
damp wood termite
cone head termite
silverfish
earwig
deer tick
dog tick
wood tick
mite
flea
louse
brown cricket
grasshopper
katydid
locust
giant weta
cave cricket
orchid mantis
mantis
stick bug
silk worm moth
luna moth
gypsy moth
atlas moth
codling moth (domestic)
peppered moth
hawk moth
hummingbird moth
monarch butterfly
tiger butterfly
swallowtail butterfly
black fly
hover fly
saw fly
horse fly
fruit fly
blow fly
mosquito
phorid fly
crane fly
bot fly
dragonfly
thrip
cordycep
aphid (domestic)
woolly aphid
mealybug (domestic)
whitefly
armored scale bug
soft scale bug
mantidfly
earth worm
nightcrawler
inchworm
leech
nematode
flat worm
fluke
hook worm
ribbon worm
arrow worm
ragworm
microbe
millipede
stone centipede
bark centipede
cave centipede
pillbug
bark scorpion
emperor scorpion (semi-megabeast)
deathstalker scorpion
whip scorpion
hairy scorpion
snail
black slug
leopard slug
giant land snail (semi-megabeast)
water strider
water scorpion
camel spider (demon)
giant centipede (demon)
giant millipede (demon)

[Meph]

You are missing good/evil creatures on that (admittedly impressive) list.

I also don't know if you have any domestic animals yet, but ants do this: https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/10/071009212548.htm (symbiotic relationship with aphids)

[brolol.404]

You are missing good/evil creatures on that (admittedly impressive) list.

I also don't know if you have any domestic animals yet, but ants do this: https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/10/071009212548.htm (symbiotic relationship with aphids)

Thanks

This is the current domestic list:

bark beetle (domestic/wagon puller)
codling moth (domestic)
aphid (domestic)
mealybug (domestic)

This is the current good list:

monarch butterfly
luna moth
orchid bee
orchid mantis

This is the current evil list:

assassin bug
phorid fly
cordyceps

EDIT: Im still debating on the savage biomes, but I do like the idea of small vertebrate.
EDIT2: aphids and mealybugs will be milkable for "honeydew"

[brolol.404]

I decided to restrict the camel spider, giant centipede and giant millipede to the third cavern later instead of the fifth cavern layer, so that the player can disable the magma sea and hell in advanced worldgen settings for a more realistic gameplay.

[Meph]

That makes sense. Guess you can include a custom worldgen setting that fits those parameters.

[brolol.404]

I currently have black ants and harvestmen in the mod as playable civs. I am going to try and incorporate honey bees and paper wasps as well, but that will depend on how well I can actually make them work with the DF game mechanics.

With that said, how should other intelligent creatures work? If I don't have any others, none will join your fort and you won't be able to recruit any as companions in adventure mode. However, if I make them intelligent, you won't be able to butcher them or tame/train them.

The other issue is that adventure mode creatures without CAN_LEARN can't have skills and cant gain skills.

So, my options are:

1. Only make black ants and harvestmen intelligent. Potentially make the non intelligent creatures playable in fortress mode (without the ability to gain skills)
2. Make a copy of every creature in the mod, add CAN_LEARN to them and set there frequency to 0. This would allow all creatures to be played in adventure mode (and gain skills) without the intellegent version showing up in the wild.
3. Choose some creatures to be intelligent (possibly civilized), but not playable in fortress mod to add some more variety in the intelligent races that show up in the world (the chosen would no longer be trainable/tameable)
4. Make two different creatures for each creature in the mod "black widow" and "black widow (intelligent)" to have the most variety of both creatures and intelligent races.
5. Add intelligent and slow learner to all creatures so that they can be used as animals, but also can gain skills (I am not sure if they would be tameable/trainable)
6. Some combination of these.

I am thinking of a combination of 2 and 3. Thoughts?